True Self?

Ah, now you see LM .. this is where Ii have to somewhat disagree. NOT I might add with any form of KNOWLEDGE WHATSOEVER so I CANNOT back it up with any written claims or counter claims. This is purely down to me and me alone, through my own very very limited experience.

Going back to NYE and this silence, space,awareness,time thingymebobby I was in .. even though the clock said 3 seconds had passed .. whilst I was present in it .. there was no time. Time didn't exist. It just WAS, if I've described that correctly? (probably not knowing me! tut!). But. Not only that. I can't associate with time AT ALL. I have no concept of time. OTHER PEOPLE tell me what time appointments are (I completely forget) .. this is not for a want of trying either! .. it just DOES NOT sit with me any longer. I instinctively know (when I'm well enough that is) the time, within 5 or 10 mins. I do not have a rush in me these days. I don't know what it is. It's certainly not for lack lack of trying that's for sure! I can start getting ready to go out hours earlier and STILL be on the last minute .. but the point I'm making is, I'm disagreeing with you and probably being one of the few people who doesn't run their lives by time. I have no watches or clocks in the house. I tell a lie. My daughter has one of each. But that's for her to work with not me. :)

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by Jules

I have no watches or clocks in the house. I tell a lie. My daughter has one of each. But that's for her to work with not me. :)

NOT ANY MORE!

Originally Posted by WhiteShaman

NOT ANY MORE!

LMBO!!!!!

Originally Posted by Jules

Going back to NYE and this silence, space,awareness,time thingymebobby I was in .. even though the clock said 3 seconds had passed .. whilst I was present in it .. there was no time.

Nice! That is half of your true self. The unchanging half (the foundation).

I have no watches or clocks in the house.

Your computer must have a clock.

Jules, I do get what you're saying about time. I have at least "visited" many of those places that various posters talk about on these threads, and I am familiar with that state where time ceases to exist. I'm told that some astronauts have had a problem with their time awareness (or whatever we want to call it) after returning from their journeys in space. It seems that if you remove yourself from the confines of this planet, you become more acutely aware that such things as a 24 hour day, etc. are human inventions relative to Earth.

You also become more aware that, regardless of where you are, you are always experiencing things now, in present time. From what I can tell, we do not know how to completely describe all the attributes of time, but our bodies exist and respond to a very convenient context that we call time.

In your case and mine, we may not be very aware of appointments or whatever, but we do have memories. That's some kind of awareness of past time, those things we've experienced. We also have whatever expectations, anticipations, hopes, anxieties, etc. that we do of future time, those things that have not yet happened in our realm of experience. What's also true is that, consciously or not, our bodies respond to the passage of time and we get hungry, sleeply and so on.

The best I'm willing to go with is that we have limited information about time, and most of us manage to function pretty well with the information we have.

Originally Posted by ichc

Nice! That is half of your true self. The unchanging half (the foundation).
That's what my gut instincts were screaming at me. But that settled into this all encompassing 'knowing' y'know? That understanding that's in the very soul of you that no-one can tell you any differently? Also had this immense feeling of peace and positivity which stayed for about 5 days or so

Your computer must have a clock.

The lappy does yes, but I never look at it. There's no need too. :)

You also become more aware that, regardless of where you are, you are always experiencing things now, in present time. From what I can tell, we do not know how to completely describe all the attributes of time, but our bodies exist and respond to a very convenient context that we call time.
You know LM, I think you've just hit the nail on the head. Even though it's different to how is was in the hospital (I'm sorry I keep harping back to that, I'm just trying to work things out now in my mind - it's taking on a momentum of it's own!) .. it's like it's two different entities. I've got Jue on the one hand who'se very much aware of what's going on around her, ie days events, illness, day to day stuff. Then there's the instinctive, hunger, tiredness, which has no concept of time. iT JUST HAPPENS. I yawn. The body is responding to its own BIOLOGICAL clock, sending the messages to the brain of it being tired. So, on a subconconcsious level then yes there must be some sort of awareness of it I suppose.

So. If youve got Jue the illusion and Jue the reality. Jue the reality has NO sense of time ..everything just IS. (the hospital jue), as one, love, bliss, joy, consciousness = true self - or as ichc put it half of the true self. Living in the Now.

jue the illusion = thinking, feeling, seeing, tasting, sensing, smelling, touching, creating, reacting, guilt, fear. So apart from the illusion, what is this label then??

(I think I've just confused meself even more now!! lol)

[hybrid]

Originally Posted by LaMont Cranston

hybrid, The fact that, according to current theory, time is relative, not absolute, doesn't mean that time doesn't exist. It does exist, and the current state of science has a somewhat limited take on describing all of the attributes and limitations of time. It's like that with a lot of things (i.e. gravity, black holes, dark matter, dark energy, dark flow, etc.). The fact that we have limited knowledge about these things doesn't mean they don't exist. What it means is that we are trying to better understand them, and we we are investigating and trying to understand them. That means they exist.

In your own life, you are very much aware that time is a real thing. Some scientist and engineer types, even retired ones, love to play the "it's all relative" card and throw in some QM. However, this does not diminish the obvious fact that those same people are living their lives "on the clock."

As conscious beings, they know they are living with the apparency of limited time. They measure their lives by seconds, minutes, hours, days, weeks, months, years, decades, etc. They have experiences, here and now, in a context of time and space.

aw, your just being pragmatic. that's all.

seconds , minutes, hours, days, months, years are measures of cycles. time exists the same way meters, feet, miles, kilometers exists. they are units of measurements. they only exist in your head.

PS: Are you familiar with Bell's Theorem?

yes. what about it?

.

[hybrid]

Originally Posted by Jules

So. If youve got Jue the illusion and Jue the reality. Jue the reality has NO sense of time ..everything just IS. (the hospital jue), as one, love, bliss, joy, consciousness = true self - or as ichc put it half of the true self. Living in the Now.

jue the illusion = thinking, feeling, seeing, tasting, sensing, smelling, touching, creating, reacting, guilt, fear. So apart from the illusion, what is this label then??

(I think I've just confused meself even more now!! lol)

nope, you sorted it out just fine.

.

[hybrid]

Originally Posted by ichc

Nice! That is half of your true self. The unchanging half (the foundation).

.

and we want that half!
without neglecting the other half of course.

.