Breaking the veil

[Shadowside]

I'll be quick, and explain the general premise of this scheme.

I'm going to try a break or damage the veil, using condensed energy. Here's how I'm going to go about it, I'm going to find a stone/rock/small object and im them going to enchant it so that it can hold lots of my energy. I'll then day after day week after week charge it with my energy, creating a stacking effect. Each day after charging I'll compress the energy into a singularity, in order to disrupt and destroy the veil. A similar principal exists in theoretical physics; If one single point in the universe is heated to a certain temperature space and time will bubble and warp creating another universe. I'm hoping that the same principle will work astrally; enough spiritual pressure and energy at one spot should irradiate the veil and break it apart. If anyone has any ideas questions or comments, feel free to post them. I'll be updating this with results every week.

[flutterangel]

No disrespect, just curious, but why are you trying to do that?

[mahakali]

what veil?

[Sangress]

Not to dissuade you...but.....

I've seen people try exactly what you are proposing before.

I'm sure you can already tell what their result was.

Do you know the nature and behavior of the Viel?

[Shadowside]

There are many theories on what would happen if someone or something snapped the boundry between the astral and the physical, but i'm fairly certain at the very least astral powers would intensify. Someone once told me that's its like air, constantly around you, interacting with you, but intangable and indestructable.

[Sangress]

Sorry for being so blunt.....but....(there's always a but, heh)

You do not need to break it to utilize it.

Your awareness can pass through it and blend with it and become part of it.

People seem to believe its some intangible wall that's constantly crushing them which they have to break apart to gain the rewards beyond it.

I suggest that, before you try this, study the fabric of the Veil and understand how it works before running headlong at it.

You might be surprised at what you find.

[Shadowside]

I'm not trying to use the stone to attack the veil directly, no I'm weakening it indirectly by making it work hard to keep itself stable. Eventually, if all goes to plan the veil will weaken through indirect contact with the stone, like radiation.

[Sangress]

Either way, I've seen scores of people do these things for naught.

It's just my personal experience.

You'll find that you have no need to try to weaken or break or make the Viel unstable because you are capable of using it to your benefit regardless.

If you are doing it out of curiosity, go ahead.

If you are doing it for personal gain, you'll probably need to find better ways.

I know I'm being blatant, but this is as crystal clear as night and day to me because I've seen it so many laborious times.

[Shadowside]

The beauty of this experiment it that it becomes more likely to succeed with each passing second, the veil is shifting and weakening I'm just trying to push over the brink completely

[Shadowside]

Darn, I thought I had an orginal idea for once. Oh well.

[Shadowside]

Okay sangress, If you've seen this a lot please tell me the various details of the past veil breaking experiments, so that way I can learn from other peoples past mistakes. And use them advantageously.

[Sangress]

They've done what you were attempting, using raw energetic force and constructs coupled with rituals over a physical object. Variations include trying to puncture the viel with their own or someone elses raw core energy, trying to energetically overload the Viel, trying to suck the energy out of a section of the Viel, trying to pull and tear the Viel......etc

All I want to get across is that you have no need to do anything to the Viel. It's like trying to make the sky turn red.

What is your motive beyond successfully manipulating the Viel in some way?

[Ciqala]

I have no idea what the **** is going on here, but why on earth would you break whatever separates this plane from the astral plane?
It is balanced for a reason, and it sounds like something atrocious and horrible would happen, i would be interested in hearing those other theories you wrote of.

So you want to force endless amounts of your own energy in a rock, it seems you know the process, that would be consuming, if it's even possible.

I wouldn't disturb the balance, i'd just go there myself, congrats if you cause the end of the world or something weird lol. I just get a weird feeling from it all.

Sort of reminds me of this guy i used to know, got drug induced schizophrenia, from a pcp, he was so happy he was tripping out constantly, but then a few days passed and he shot himself in the head because he couldn't stand the fact he would always live in it, don't ask me how it reminds me of this, but i'm pretty sure the astral plane is separated for a reason.

[Sangress]

The Viel is not a separation between the states of existence. It only appears that way.

It's actually just where one form of energy ends and another begins, like where light meets shadow. The vibrational frequency that governs the physical state of existence changes at that point and the only reason why no one has broken the Viel is because it is not effected by energy from the physical state of existence.

Just like a shadow, anyone can pass through the Viel if they actually take the time to understand how it works and what it is.

All you need to do to pass through the Viel, or gain whatever your seeking on the other side of it, is to become one with that "wall" of energy.

Am I making sense here?

[Shadowside]

First off all i'm not entirely convinced that the veil is natural, it could have been created to seperate us from our true selves, which i find interesting. Sangress the veil already has small holes and spots where it has been worn thin, so it can be damaged, so ergo it can be destroyed. The veil is falling at a steady pace, left to it's own devices it will fall on december 21st 2012. I'm just trying to get a peek at whats in store for the future so that i can prepare.

[Summerland]

To my understanding the Veil is thinning. However people and entities form other dimensions have been crossing it for, well, thousands of years. Dream walking, shamanism, astral projecting, seeing the fae, seeing spirits (ghosts), entities from other planes of existence.
I could think of a lot more important objectives to put all that energy into. But do as ye will, in that it harm none. IF you could accomplish this, for what purpose? To satisfy your curiousity? Is that a valid reason to possibly create a rift in the fabric?

[Autumn Ascent]

Totally random but this whole conversation about the veil reminds me of this video game dragon age origins i play. there is a place called the fade which is basically the dream world or astral and there are breaks in the veil and demons n stuff would come through it. not saying that's what is going to happen. it's just random and bared a significant similiarity to this so thought i'd share:D

[mahakali]

Totally random but this whole conversation about the veil reminds me of this video game dragon age origins i play. there is a place called the fade which is basically the dream world or astral and there are breaks in the veil and demons n stuff would come through it. not saying that's what is going to happen. it's just random and bared a significant similiarity to this so thought i'd share:D

awesome! do they have it for ps3?

[Sangress]

Totally random but this whole conversation about the veil reminds me of this video game dragon age origins i play. there is a place called the fade which is basically the dream world or astral and there are breaks in the veil and demons n stuff would come through it. not saying that's what is going to happen. it's just random and bared a significant similiarity to this so thought i'd share:D
I wantz it. :) T_T Why did my Xbox have to kill itself? (Red ring of death.)

First off all i'm not entirely convinced that the veil is natural, it could have been created to seperate us from our true selves, which i find interesting. Sangress the veil already has small holes and spots where it has been worn thin, so it can be damaged, so ergo it can be destroyed. The veil is falling at a steady pace, left to it's own devices it will fall on december 21st 2012. I'm just trying to get a peek at whats in store for the future so that i can prepare.
I never said it could not be damaged or worn thin. I just said it was pointless because it's not any kind of separating construct at all.

As long as you think it's separating you from something amazing and wonderful, then it will do just that because your perceptions will be blocked.

*Shrugs* I see there is no dissuading you. Shame you have to waste all that energy in the process.

(Energy that could go to a better cause.....like me. ;p)

[Shadowside]

yeah apparently that game rocks virtual face, to bad i opted for the wii instead of a 360. *twitch* *twitch*

Oh it's not wasted at all; Let's assume that i'll fail, well i have a back up plan for all that energy, I plan to keep that rock with me for a long long time, and If someone decides to mess with me, well that's just say that i'll have a ocean of energy to to channel into any spell i wish. Like fire, lots and lots and lots of fire. yeah let's go with that. :D

[Sangress]

(Thinks of stealing your rock)

*Evil grin*

[Shadowside]

I might actually have to put defenses around it now, lest i be 'capped by my own energy.

[Shadowside]

wow trippy i thought sangress was a guy until i looked at her profile, also apparently we share a star sign. awesome.

[Sangress]

I might actually have to put defenses around it now, lest i be 'capped by my own energy.

Exactly why I mentioned it. You can never be too careful.

wow trippy i thought sangress was a guy until i looked at her profile, also apparently we share a star sign. awesome.

*shrugs* I project masculine energy on purpose to put people off guard.

Manipulating energy is always such a joy.

Seems everyone is vulnerable to my tricks whether they know it or not. *Grins*

[Lucuno]

Be warned cause doing this is no different than opening Pandoras box..
Your not the first to try and break barriers, I knew of someone that did that with a few other gates; which leads to some disasters... The end result of this can go bad.. And yes, this is what I feel from my gut.

This is a warning for though the consequences can be big.

[Verunia]

I'll be quick, and explain the general premise of this scheme.

I'm going to try a break or damage the veil, using condensed energy. Here's how I'm going to go about it, I'm going to find a stone/rock/small object and im them going to enchant it so that it can hold lots of my energy. I'll then day after day week after week charge it with my energy, creating a stacking effect. Each day after charging I'll compress the energy into a singularity, in order to disrupt and destroy the veil. A similar principal exists in theoretical physics; If one single point in the universe is heated to a certain temperature space and time will bubble and warp creating another universe. I'm hoping that the same principle will work astrally; enough spiritual pressure and energy at one spot should irradiate the veil and break it apart. If anyone has any ideas questions or comments, feel free to post them. I'll be updating this with results every week.
You could just transcend your physical perception of this world to see the astral in all its glory.

It is a place of the mind, not a place of games. You don't seem to have any fear or doubt attached with your theory, I wonder if you've truly done the research about the astral realm or if you think you can do this just for a nice little life changing experience for the whole human race.. I'd leave that up to the All, personally..

And by research, I mean experience. Have you experienced the astral realm and understood its workings based on those experiences? Have you sought the help of your own truth?

And really, I'd just like to point out, that this doesn't seem like something that would affect anyone else other than you. It's your mind, its your life, it is solely your place to experience your life.. Everyone else could just be a figment of your imagination for all you know.

Sorry for rambling.. But I wonder if you really thought about this clearly. :wink:

Also, I have very little astral experience. I'm a novice. But I personally believe that there's a lot to learn from it naturally as we grow, not by breaking it open tooth and nail with 'spiritual energy' of some sort.

[Lucuno]

If your gonna open it without our permission, then your breaking a spiritual rule and will get into trouble.
Remember you don't decide for us humans.

[Shadowside]

Exactly why I mentioned it. You can never be too careful.



*shrugs* I project masculine energy on purpose to put people off guard.

Manipulating energy is always such a joy.

Seems everyone is vulnerable to my tricks whether they know it or not. *Grins*

My defenses have always been in place even before i decided to do this. But i guess extra measures wouldn't be a bad idea either.

Fyi the star sign gemini is masculine in nature, so i really doubt you even have to try to appear masculine, it comes naturally to your pesonality.

[Shadowside]

accidently quad-posted

[Shadowside]

I've been doing this eight years, I've done a lot, I know what I'm doing, The veil is a suffocating net that dampens astral powers and seperates the physical from the astral, It's time that the curtain of restriction that is veil come down in order for the world to come back into it's true self. Lucuno, who sets the rules of the astral? And Who do I answer to if i break those rules?

[Verunia]

It's time that the curtain of restriction that is veil come down in order for the world to come back into it's true self.

Another one of the many who claims to understand/know/foresee the truth of something.

I'm still not convinced, a man's truth is subjective to that which he believes.

[Lucuno]

who else protects those in astral and watches over the world?
Not everyone will be ready for this, you maybe, but not everyone else.
Not everyone is all powerful out there.

As for knowing what your doing; your not the first to claim that you know, so did the previous person I knew, and he went through a harsh lesson for it.

Also you should get permission from everyone cause not everyone will agree with this.

[Sangress]

Fyi the star sign gemini is masculine in nature, so i really doubt you even have to try to appear masculine, it comes naturally to your pesonality. http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/images/evonature/buttons/quote.gif (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fnewreply.php%3Fdo%3Dnewreply%26amp%3Bp%3D 86202)
I was meant to be born way after I was actually "born." (More than 3 months premature to be a bit more precise) I don't fit the Gemini archetype at all. I find your statement to be pretty ironic. heh.

The veil is a suffocating net that dampens astral powers and seperates the physical from the astral, It's time that the curtain of restriction that is veil come down in order for the world to come back into it's true self.
Read my above statements, and think for a bit.

Your missing something really crucial and really obvious.

Do I need to spell it out for you?

[radareyes]

I was meant to be born way after I was actually "born." (More than 3 months premature to be a bit more precise) I don't fit the Gemini archetype at all. I find your statement to be pretty ironic. heh.
We're all born at the time that we're born. :D As far as the Gemini archetype goes, well let's see: Exagerrates everything that happens to you, check, plays word games, check, doesn't like to be pinned down, BIG check -- yep, you're a Gemini alright. :wink:

Oh, and to the OP: If you really want to attempt to "break the veil", by all means go for it. The universe is far more resilient than most of the posters in this thread have attempted to portray it as being.

[Shadowside]

I was meant to be born way after I was actually "born." (More than 3 months premature to be a bit more precise) I don't fit the Gemini archetype at all. I find your statement to be pretty ironic. heh.


Read my above statements, and think for a bit.

Your missing something really crucial and really obvious.

Do I need to spell it out for you?

You fit the archetype to a T. You were always destined to be a gemini, The term meant to holds no meaning to me. Every pregnancy is different, no two are exactly the same, Your born when your are ready, as it happens you were ready in June. Maybe you were supposed to be a leo/virgo but that didn't come to pass, So you might aswell just your gemininess, It'll be with you for a while. Don't dwell on what Could have been, focus on the now.

Go ahead and s-p-e-l-l i-t o-u-t, J-u-s-t n-o-t t-o-o f-a-s-t Y-o-u m-i-g-h-t l-o-s-e m-e.

[Shadowside]

We're all born at the time that we're born. :D As far as the Gemini archetype goes, well let's see: Exagerrates everything that happens to you, check, plays word games, check, doesn't like to be pinned down, BIG check -- yep, you're a Gemini alright. :wink:

Oh, and to the OP: If you really want to attempt to "break the veil", by all means go for it. The universe is far more resilient than most of the posters in this thread have attempted to portray it as being.

I can't just assume it won't work without trying now can I, but more than likely I'll fail hard just like the rest. But that's an attempt for another day, For even I need to rest. Goodnight!

[Sangress]

ok, lets spell this out.

1. No one can know what i exaggerate, play at, do when I get "pinned" over the internet. For all you know I could be a 20 year old Virgo..I could be lying about my age and gender...etc and you would not even know it.

Also dictating who someone is by when they were born in relation to the stars...etc is ok on a generational scale, but on an individual and personal scale, that is ridiculous. It's a twisting of perceptions and enforces false judgement of an individual as well as encourages other people's self satisfaction at "guessing your star sign" and other inconsequential things like that.....etc

2. The Viel is not a construct, it is not a wall or a barrier....it is literally the fabric of the "astral" world where it meets with the fabric of the physical world....you "break" part of it and the layer behind it comes forth...its the equivalent of cutting or electrically charging water....it doesn't change the water, just makes it ripple and then resume its former shape when you stop manipulating it.

You cannot "break" the astral world.....I'm sure you realise that.

I don't care what you try or whether you succeed, its the fact that you do not understand the nature of the Viel and make assumptions of a foolish nature which hits my nerves.

There, it is spelled out.

I've said my peace. Do what you will. Listen or don't. Take it or leave it.

[Ivy]

I'll be quick, and explain the general premise of this scheme.

I'm going to try a break or damage the veil, using condensed energy. Here's how I'm going to go about it, I'm going to find a stone/rock/small object and im them going to enchant it so that it can hold lots of my energy. I'll then day after day week after week charge it with my energy, creating a stacking effect. Each day after charging I'll compress the energy into a singularity, in order to disrupt and destroy the veil. A similar principal exists in theoretical physics; If one single point in the universe is heated to a certain temperature space and time will bubble and warp creating another universe. I'm hoping that the same principle will work astrally; enough spiritual pressure and energy at one spot should irradiate the veil and break it apart. If anyone has any ideas questions or comments, feel free to post them. I'll be updating this with results every week.

lol...whats the veil ever done to you?

But seriously...the veil is created by your own energy within and around you. So I dont quite understand your logic....Im guessing you have read a couple of books and put a plan together?

[Casio]

I'll be quick, and explain the general premise of this scheme.

I'm going to try a break or damage the veil, using condensed energy. Here's how I'm going to go about it, I'm going to find a stone/rock/small object and im them going to enchant it so that it can hold lots of my energy. I'll then day after day week after week charge it with my energy, creating a stacking effect. Each day after charging I'll compress the energy into a singularity, in order to disrupt and destroy the veil. A similar principal exists in theoretical physics; If one single point in the universe is heated to a certain temperature space and time will bubble and warp creating another universe. I'm hoping that the same principle will work astrally; enough spiritual pressure and energy at one spot should irradiate the veil and break it apart. If anyone has any ideas questions or comments, feel free to post them. I'll be updating this with results every week.


yer umm good luck it wont work obiously u dont understand anything about the veil and no it wont break 2012 if you think that your nothing short of a idiot.....i dont think you understand your not powerfull enough to break it and you never will be its not like some wall its like where light meets dark as i believe someone else pointed out on here she also made a good point its like trying to cut water so in more simple words enjoy wasteing your time and btw judeing people on their starS seriously get a life but hey im cancer im just a frkin crab what would i know huh??

[Shadowside]

If it's created by the energy of the people who live in the world, the why is it crumbling? More and more people are being awakened and starting to study energy/magick and if the veil functions off of their energies shouldn't it be strengthening?
Sangress the veil has wholes in it that is a fact, It dosen't behave like water exactly, when you damage the veil, it is damaged permanetly, at one time the veil probably could fix itself but it's becoming to weak to do even that.

[Casio]

If it's created by the energy of the people who live in the world, the why is it crumbling? More and more people are being awakened and starting to study energy/magick and if the veil functions off of their energies shouldn't it be strengthening?
Sangress the veil has wholes in it that is a fact, It dosen't behave like water exactly, when you damage the veil, it is damaged permanetly, at one time the veil probably could fix itself but it's becoming to weak to do even that.

well then why try and make it weaker have u tried helping it repair if more people did that rather than trying to break it i think that would make the world a better place........so why not make a thread asking people to try and help it rather than go on about ideas of how to break it.

[Shadowside]

yer umm good luck it wont work obiously u dont understand anything about the veil and no it wont break 2012 if you think that your nothing short of a idiot.....i dont think you understand your not powerfull enough to break it and you never will be its not like some wall its like where light meets dark as i believe someone else pointed out on here she also made a good point its like trying to cut water so in more simple words enjoy wasteing your time and btw judeing people on their starS seriously get a life but hey im cancer im just a frkin crab what would i know huh??
I understand more than a lot of people about the veil, All signs point to yes, it will crumble on dec 21st 2012. I'm just doing this to get a taste of what's to come. fortunately I'm gifted with a large powerlevel so I'm pretty sure that i could possible make this work. I'm not judging anyone about there star sign I' a gemini aswell, I just pointed out that sangress has gemini characteristics, like arguing for arguing's sake like what i'm doing right now.

[Shadowside]

well then why try and make it weaker have u tried helping it repair if more people did that rather than trying to break it i think that would make the world a better place........so why not make a thread asking people to try and help it rather than go on about ideas of how to break it.

Simply put there's a possibility that if i succeeded, that the modern world would be changed forever, and believe me it needs it.

[Casio]

I understand more than a lot of people about the veil, All signs point to yes, it will crumble on dec 21st 2012. I'm just doing this to get a taste of what's to come. fortunately I'm gifted with a large powerlevel so I'm pretty sure that i could possible make this work. I'm not judging anyone about there star sign I' a gemini aswell, I just pointed out that sangress has gemini characteristics, like arguing for arguing's sake like what i'm doing right now.

a taste of whats to come?? i dont think the astral world mixing with this world can be to great the things we can do in the astral depend only on our minds limit and if that were to be the case in our world more than enough people have darker minds.

[Lucuno]

Astral mixing with this world = more disorder, there's no harmony cause there will be many wars; etc. There won't be just good entities running around but also bad ones; people will be in more danger and more deaths.

As for a big power level, you sound like something on DBZ, if you believe Spirituality is about being all powerful, then you lack the wisdom of spirit.
Oh well like the last one your just like him, he thought he was god and yea; your just like him. Spirit is about understanding, not becoming a GOD over power.
ALSO 8 years of spirit doesn't make you powerful.

ALSO 2012 = a theory; just like the Y2k, so why take it seriously?
Mankind has been talking end of the world for aeons now.
Also the world is changing, but not the way most people thinks it's changing, it's changing slowly.

Oh well I'll let this be cause I already know how this is going to end.

[Casio]

Astral mixing with this world = more disorder, there's no harmony cause there will be many wars; etc. There won't be just good entities running around but also bad ones; people will be in more danger and more deaths.

As for a big power level, you sound like something on DBZ, if you believe Spirituality is about being all powerful, then you lack the wisdom of spirit.
Oh well like the last one your just like him, he thought he was god and yea; your just like him. Spirit is about understanding, not becoming a GOD over power.
ALSO 8 years of spirit doesn't make you powerful.

ALSO 2012 = a theory; just like the Y2k, so why take it seriously?
Mankind has been talking end of the world for aeons now.
Also the world is changing, but not the way most people thinks it's changing, it's changing slowly.

Oh well I'll let this be cause I already know how this is going to end.




Agreed.......but take no offence but i believe no one knows how the world will end

[Lucuno]

No one does and it will end when no one expects it to end.
For example our world may end with a black hole eating our solar system. :D

The end is unpredictable; anyone that believes the predictions of the end shall be fooled; as they have been for aeons. No one can predict the end.

[Shadowside]

not trying to end the world, just trying to change it for the better.

[radareyes]

I can't just assume it won't work without trying now can I, but more than likely I'll fail hard just like the rest. But that's an attempt for another day, For even I need to rest. Goodnight!
That was encouragement, Shadowside, not an attempt to dissuade. My point about the universe's resiliency was in response to the many who have said things like "there's a barrier between the physical and the astral for a reason". But really, it's more a matter of your motivations for breaking the veil than it is the actual act itself. If you're in it for a spiritual "quick fix" or power trip, then you can expect severe repercussions. If, however, you're simply curious and your heart's in the right place, the universe WILL accomodate you, no matter how "reckless" your actions may seem from an outsider's perspective.

[Lucuno]

How can you change the world? Many want to change the world besides you.
And what kind of change? for harmony or for chaos? Cause atm breaking the veil is like opening pandoras box and if ya herd of that story; you should know what could happen when you do. Every action has consequences and so yea...

Edit: also rushing the world into changing will usually lead to many disasters, that's why we let it go with the flow.
It's no different when your swamped with work, if you push too hard and rush like hell, you will most likely burn out, but if you flow, you will get it done.
The same thing can happen with this world, change takes time, the world is changing, just not quickly.

[radareyes]

ok, lets spell this out.
Let's spell this out? You've got to be kidding me...



.1. No one can know what i exaggerate, play at, do when I get "pinned" over the internet. For all you know I could be a 20 year old Virgo..I could be lying about my age and gender...etc and you would not even know it.
Again, an attempt to avoid being pinned down. All of your attempts to refute your Gemininess simply reaffirm my sense that you are one. Funny how that works, isn't it?


Also dictating who someone is by when they were born in relation to the stars...etc is ok on a generational scale, but on an individual and personal scale, that is ridiculous. It's a twisting of perceptions and enforces false judgement of an individual as well as encourages other people's self satisfaction at "guessing your star sign" and other inconsequential things like that.....etc

There's only a "twisting of perceptions" and "false judgement" when self-interest becomes a factor. Authentic astrology is without doubt applicable on a personal level, though it requires absolute detachment from the concerns of the human condition in order to yield accurate results.

[Casio]

How can you change the world? Many want to change the world besides you.
And what kind of change? for harmony or for chaos? Cause atm breaking the veil is like opening pandoras box and if ya herd of that story; you should know what could happen when you do. Every action has consequences and so yea...

Edit: also rushing the world into changing will usually lead to many disasters, that's why we let it go with the flow.
It's no different when your swamped with work, if you push too hard and rush like hell, you will most likely burn out, but if you flow, you will get it done.
The same thing can happen with this world, change takes time, the world is changing, just not quickly.


Also change is eayer to achieve if you have more people helping you trying to change the world alone is alot harder than doing it with the support of other people

[Xan]

I'm going to try a break or damage the veil, using condensed energy. Here's how I'm going to go about it, I'm going to find a stone/rock/small object and im them going to enchant it......

hmmm Shadowside.... Well, first of all, the veil only exists in the human mind as an illusory barrier in consciousness. By being overly involved with thinking and the external world there appears to us a limitation that doesn't really exist.

I didn't read all the responses to this thread and probably others have suggested the same, but if you want to shift into another dimension, simply learn how to ease into it in your awareness.

There's a thread about Phasing that might interest you at: http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=6877 (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .spiritualforums.com%252Fvb%252Fshowthread.php%253 Ft%253D6877)

And this website from Frank Kepple: http://www.astralpulse.com/frankkepple.html (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .spiritualforums.com%252Fvb%252Fredir.php%253Flink %253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.astralpulse.com% 25252Ffrankkepple.html)


Xan

[Verunia]

not trying to end the world, just trying to change it for the better.

Then stop trying to be a hero.

Maybe you could change the world for the better by sitting down and meditating on the subject, and realize how small you've made yourself look in comparison to the veil.

Forgive me for assuming, but the veil could very well be your ego..

But ego is a difficult subject here are Spiritual Forums.. :tongue:

[Shadowside]

Xan that is the psychic censor your talking about, the veil isn't imaginary as it affects the physical world where it is weaker, ever wonder why the bermuda triangle is such an odd place? That's because the veil is weak there. I'm not shifting my awareness , i'm destroying the physical limitations that the veil puts on us that dosen't allow energy to appear and effect things in a larger scale. Like throwing fire as an example. Or growing a tree in half the time. Those things MIGHT be possible if the veil were to collapse, something I'm attempting to do.

If i stop being a hero, well I guess I have to be a villian, And honestly do you really want that?

[Verunia]

If i stop being a hero, well I guess I have to be a villian, And honestly do you really want that?
Woah woah woah!.. Are you a self proclaimed hero already? And you've been doing this 8 years? Well, golly, you're doing a great job, aren't you. Anyway I merely hinted at you to stop trying to be one, well, now you've changed it all up on me and I've just lost my bearings on the conversation..

It is not simply black and white in this world. There are not just heroes or villains, it is that which is between that makes up what is human today. I asked you to stop trying, because it is a goal not worth achieving, in my opinion.

And to answer your question, yes, I'd rather have you as a villain of sorts. At least you would be doing something useful. Cheers!

By the way, you bring up a good point about the Bermuda Triangle. But there a plenty of theories out there, unfortunately, it's not an easy topic to sift through.

[Xan]

Xan that is the psychic censor your talking about, the veil isn't imaginary as it affects the physical world where it is weaker, ever wonder why the bermuda triangle is such an odd place? That's because the veil is weak there. I'm not shifting my awareness , i'm destroying the physical limitations that the veil puts on us that dosen't allow energy to appear and effect things in a larger scale. Like throwing fire as an example. Or growing a tree in half the time. Those things MIGHT be possible if the veil were to collapse, something I'm attempting to do.

If i stop being a hero, well I guess I have to be a villian, And honestly do you really want that?


Shadowside... I didn't say the veil is imaginary... I said the idea that it's a barrier is an illusion. It's not. You simply have to learn how to let go enough to ease through it.

Clinging to an identity of either hero or villain is part of that illusion. How about finding out who You really are, without ideas or labels... then see how thin those veils become and how quickly they can fade away.


Xan

[Shadowside]

I have done some heroic things before so yeah I'm an astral hero. But now im a hero gone bad a heroic villian (dramatic background music).

[Shadowside]

hmmm Shadowside.... Well, first of all, the veil only exists in the human mind as an illusory barrier in consciousness.


Well that statement isn't totally misleading then.

[Lucuno]

Xan
If i stop being a hero, well I guess I have to be a villian, And honestly do you really want that?
Usually hero's become villains in the end Mr. Batty, NOT a heroic Villain, but just a villain cause it would lead to harm of Innocence as well.
Whats so Heroic about harming Innocents with doing that huh? And no; your not the chosen one, anyone that claims that will obviously be false.

[Xan]

Shadowside... You might read one of the books by William Buhlman, who has been traveling beyond dimensional veils for many years. It's called astral projection, or out-of-body experiencing.

His books are "The Secret of the Soul" and "Adventures Beyond the Body".


Xan

[Sangress]

I second Xan.

I've been trying to tell you (you = Shadowside) the same things as he has the entire time.

Am I invisible? ;p

[Shadowside]

Usually hero's become villains in the end Mr. Batty, NOT a heroic Villain, but just a villain cause it would lead to harm of Innocence as well.
Whats so Heroic about harming Innocents with doing that huh? And no; your not the chosen one, anyone that claims that will obviously be false.

Ok obviously my sarcasm didn't click in your brain, I'm not a villian, and I didn't say that I was the chosen one. I'm doing this experiement, and if I succeed everyone's lives will suddenly become a lot more exciting. Any suggestions about making this experiment more effecient are greatly appreciated.

[Shadowside]

Shadowside... You might read one of the books by William Buhlman, who has been traveling beyond dimensional veils for many years. It's called astral projection, or out-of-body experiencing.

His books are "The Secret of the Soul" and "Adventures Beyond the Body".


Xan

I know all about projection, I've been practicing many years aswell, but instead of traveling beyond the veil, I'm bringing the beyond to the world at large.

[Sangress]

Sangress the veil has wholes in it that is a fact, It dosen't behave like water exactly, when you damage the veil, it is damaged permanently, at one time the veil probably could fix itself but it's becoming to weak to do even that.
Just read that comment. (Late, yeah...I know.)

I think I know what your perceiving and why. It is a part of the Viel, but its is by no means a hole or tear in it.

There are anomalies all over the world where energy is able to pass through the Viel at an alarming rate. It's often called Ethereal Flow or Vortexes.

This constant flow of energy enables most spirits to move freely here and there and the same goes for humans. It allows for a safe and easy transition from non-physical to physical.

These "Vortexes" or Ethereal Flows are caused by the shifting of Ley lines as the physical world progresses and nature reacts to the changes that have been wrought upon it.

These shifting of Ley lines unbalance the energy passing between states of existence, it is usually a slow natural process, but as of late it has become very rapid, like a comparison between a light wind and a tornado...this intense occurrence is chaotic and destructive in a lot of ways.

Due to this increase in velocity and power, Vortex's now often cause absences of energy after they have ended, some call it anti-energy, I simply call it a Void, or a space that repels energy.

Eventually these kinds of imbalances correct themselves in their own time.

And yes, many of these imbalances are caused by human interference, like what you are doing.

So, where you see the Viel to be broken and weak, is actually just a change in the flow of energy within and bordering both states of existence due to a natural reaction to manipulation upon the physical and non-physical world.

[Shadowside]

I second Xan.

I've been trying to tell you (you = Shadowside) the same things as he has the entire time.

Am I invisible? ;p

Your not invisible, just not important enough for me to care about your ideas, shhh the adults are talking.

On a more serious note, I did get the general picture of what you were saying, but i'm determined to bring the veil to it's knees.

[Sangress]

On a more serious note, I did get the general picture of what you were saying, but i'm determined to bring the veil to it's knees.

Good luck with that, you are officially absolutely blind to what is in front of you and so obsessed with this notion that its (if possible) blinding you further.

Hurry up and complete your attempt. I want to see whether you are blind enough to see that you've "destroyed" the Viel after it too.

[Shadowside]

i'm sorry if i hurt your feelings, It might take awhile charging it up. I give you permission to blast i told you so if I fail It should be complete around next week. I'll give you guys a holler then.

[Sangress]

You haven't hurt my feelings. I'm simply saying things as I see them and as they naturally are.

I think it's called clear sighted honesty, something people tend to misinterpret.

I'll know if you succeed before then because I'll be able to feel it acutely.

I'll follow your progress from afar. Maybe drop you some information if you need it so you don't do anything even more foolish.

Then I can say "I told you so"

[radareyes]

The delusions of grandeur in this thread are pervasive enough to make a fascist dictator blush. Shadowside, I know investment bankers and spunky baptist grandmothers with more astral prowess than you.

[Verunia]

Well why don't we dump the new age spiritual fun, and get down to the nitty-gritty.

Shadowside, I'll give you a reason why you won't succeed (I don't have all night to write a book); you come to a forum looking for attention for your goal. You actually respond to the posts, sounding not too serious but a little informed. 8 years will do that to you I guess :rolleyes:

Sorry sorry- ok, but really, I would just love to hear the answers to these questions. I am fairly interested, I just need to come back for more.

Do you really care about humanity? You don't seem like you give out any compassion except half-witty rebuttals to posts. But I don't know you so I'm not about to judge.

Do you really think that mending the astral realm with the physical world will do anything to benefit anyone? It's like you want people to jump into the unknown realms of their being without any guidance. It's a recipe for disaster.

Have you done any work to understand the deepest parts of yourself and the nature of your reality?

Do you love the world the way it is? It seems like you want to change it for something 'better' and something 'true'. Frankly, I believe we live in truth every day. We just need to convince ourselves.

And.. Why did you wait 8 years to tell everyone? (I think it's because you realized it's not going well all by your lonesome.)

[Casio]

The delusions of grandeur in this thread are pervasive enough to make a fascist dictator blush. Shadowside, I know investment bankers and spunky baptist grandmothers with more astral prowess than you.
lol! thats funny and even more so cause its true

[Shadowside]

I'll get serious for a second since everyone is trying hard to make me look like a joke.

Hmm do I care about humanity? as of right now, as a whole no. Humanity in a whole is dirty, digusting and evil. So no I have no compassion for humanity as a whole. Deep down humanity has the ability to be great, but it squanders it in pettiness and hate. Humanity only shows it true nature in times of extreme danger, That's what this world needs, a time of peril for us to drop the evil and spite and to band togther, and that's why I want the veil to drop. Humanity needs a time to redeem itself, and it will come regardless if I succeed in destroying the veil, something big is on the hozion folks, be prepared. I've kept mostly to myself for 8 years preparing myself for the future, these last two are meant for spreading the word and getting everyone else is up to snuff.

[Shadowside]

And i bet that you wouldn't get a better answer from your average banker or grandmother.

[Summerland]

And i bet that you wouldn't get a better answer from your average banker or grandmother.

Shadowside, gee , look at all the energy that you poured into this thread that you could have been pouring into your rock. :icon_frown: Better be careful that something doesn't come thru the tear in the veil after YOU!:D

[Xan]

Shadowside... Humanity in a whole is dirty, digusting and evil. So no I have no compassion for humanity as a whole.

So basically you're saying that if humanity didn't need compassion for its crazy destructive ways, then you would be willing to have it?

hmmm...

My friend, you're taking a lot of flack in this thread for your questionable beliefs and aims. I hope you are taking it to heart.


Xan

[Lucuno]

so.. his aim is to kill us all? I see.... Crazy indeed AND typical.

[Shadowside]

I can do two things at once, through entire convo i've been sitting with it focusing on it, no time was lost. And If I am mauled to death i can take solace in the fact that I was right all along.

The way you worded that was odd, so i'll be a little clearer, If humanity were to be less stupid and evil then yes, I would like it more. But I don't deal in could of's i deal with the present and the upcoming future.
To me you are the ones who have questionable beliefs so ponder on that for a second.

[Lucuno]

So you think all of man is evil, I suggest you to look at the positive things of life instead of the negative; cause the ones that focus on the negative will not get far.

[Shadowside]

so.. his aim is to kill us all? I see.... Crazy indeed AND typical.
Hmm so you admit that the typical is to be crazy and evil, how appropriate.

And please do not put words in my mouth i didn't say anything about anyone dying, I suggested that if and when the time comes that we band together against a common foe.

[Lucuno]

I don't band with people that has a desire that will risk lives of innocence.

[Shadowside]

Now tell me, is it innocence or ignorance?

[Lucuno]

Watch and learn.

[Shadowside]

So I have a question for you lucuno, If you don't want to see the destruction of the veil, why not help it out by healing it? Why are you so content to sit back and do nothing? Regardless of my interfrence, the veil will fall, it's rapidly deteriorating, it's only a matter of time.

[Xan]

The way you worded that was odd, so i'll be a little clearer, If humanity were to be less stupid and evil then yes, I would like it more.
So... you consider compassion a sort of 'liking'?

In my view what makes your beliefs questionable, Shadowside, is :

1) It seems you haven't thought things through very carefully and logically.

2) You are caught in the realm of ideas rather than exploring possibilities experientially. In other words, you're living in your head, in the very limited zone of mental speculation.

You seem to be pretty thick-skinned, at least, and not running away crying, but... There's a great deal more to be discovered in these areas you are interested in than you've glimpsed so far, if you're willing to open up to unknown possibilities.


Xan

[Lucuno]

So I have a question for you lucuno, If you don't want to see the destruction of the veil, why not help it out by healing it? Why are you so content to sit back and do nothing? Regardless of my interfrence, the veil will fall, it's rapidly deteriorating, it's only a matter of time.
^ Sign of ignorance.

You do not know what I do, so don't assume anything..

[Shadowside]

It isn't speculation, I know for a fact that the veil can be damaged, that is fact. I also know that once the veil is weakened, it is very difficult to repair, that is also fact (an ally of mine makes it his life's work to restore the veil, which i find... kinda pointless)
I also know that astral abilities and magical practices are amplified to a large degree under these veil weak points. That is fact. So I ask myself what damages the veil? This is my first attempt at tearing it apart, by using brute force. I'm trying to find out if the veil is weakened when a large spritual pressure is contained within a small area,(a similar theory exists in physics that deals with space time and heat) That is my experiment in a nutshell.

[Shadowside]

^ Sign of ignorance.

You do not know what I do, so don't assume anything..
Everything stated in my post was fact not ignorance. The veil WILL fail, as it is weakening AS WE SPEAK, So I ask you again, do you want to see the veil fall? If not, then why arn't you healing it? there is no neutrality in this, doing nothing means that you do want to see it fall. Pick a side, heal the veil or destroy the veil, your choice.

[silent energy]

shadowside, so you have to like something for you to have compassionate for it? Isn't that selfish...why not have compassion for humanity because it needs our compassion because the power of our compassion can heal humanity and for selfish reasons lol giving compassion feels great inside. I'd bet you would have way more fun feeling and giving compassion than trying to damage the veil.

[Sangress]

Sure, humanity is idiotic, ignorant and cruel most times, but that's simply because it's part of human nature to be that way in order for them to survive.

Evil and wrong and bad are all perceptions, in the end it doesn't matter what you think because what your seeing isn't the full picture.

You are part of the human race and it should be your responsibility to advertise the better half of the species rather than slandering your own kind and then pushing them into unnecessary struggles that may or may not result in anything positive or productive.

You find "fact" in things that have already been explained to be false in my own and others previous statements, yet you don't bother to think otherwise or even entertain the notion that you may be misinterpreting what you see.

Perhaps it would be a logical idea to take other peoples advice or wait until you are experienced and knowledgeable?

Maybe doing something based on an external influence rather than a theory might not be too far below your standards. But then again, from your enormous 8 years of experience and your friend who apparently has a job specifically to keep the Viel "in tact" might just make you the better of the rest of us and give you more right to be selfish and ignore the misgivings of the human race and throw away common sense.

Speaking or writing to you, Shadowside, is like communicating to a brick wall, you render useless every piece of information against your own perceived notions of truth.

I personally do not care if you do what you want to do. I know it will not change anything at all because I have worked with and through the Viel extensively in order to better my own chances of survival, rather than for curiosity and to gain a certain effect or reward like yourself.

But I do care about where your mind is at, and that you seem to be extremely misguided and blinded by your own "truth" in relation to the world beyond the walls of your mind.

Do me a favor and spend another 8 years understanding the nature of energy, the universe, laws of the spiritual world, all things human related as well as historical events....and do this from personal experience and get rid of your preconceived notions of how the world and humanity should be and open your mind to the world and stop seeing things through that pathetic filter of a narcissistic and selfish perception.

Then you can consider what you are attempting to do, and understand it, and then accept that what you are striving for is utterly pointless.

[Shadowside]

to be truthful i'm ashamed to be human. Priests molesting children, Murder treated like an everday normal occurence, People more worried about what's on tv over what's happening to the earth, cruelty, brutality, death, destruction, these are the sins of everyday and they infest us all. No escape no room to breath. It digusts me. The human race needs a wake up call, and I intend to give it to them. Come hell or high water.

All the rest of you have done is to argue against me. No proof of anything you speak of.
Just pretty words iced around putdowns, but not single one of you have actually done anything to stop the degradation of the veil, all of you are just talk, neither a help or a hinderance, Every person finds this idea as selfish, childish and evil but not a single one of you actually assits the veil that you defend in your arguements, This veil is on the verge of failure but none of you actually want to fix it. no you're just content to sit and wait until it is to late, for the clock is already ticking, and it's moving faster than you think.

[tragblack]

to be truthful i'm ashamed to be human. Priests molesting children, Murder treated like an everday normal occurence, People more worried about what's on tv over what's happening to the earth, cruelty, brutality, death, destruction, these are the sins of everyday and they infest us all. No escape no room to breath. It digusts me. The human race needs a wake up call, and I intend to give it to them. Come hell or high water.

Clearly, you only see the negative side of humanity.

[Lucuno]

Dude, what your doing is just as bad as a perv forcing himself onto a Innocent person (Aka Rape). Forcing yourself onto humanity with this veil thing is just as bad as that. So yes, your being just as bad as your "enemies", how to say it? Your becoming your worst enemy without seeing it.

[Sangress]

Shadowside, what you have said is the illogical equivalent of saying that all humans are the same, horrible creatures, and therefore you must be ashamed to be human.

There are good people in the world, and there is no point in feeling responsible or ashamed for what you consider to be other peoples misbehavior.

Take responsibility for your own behavior, not the rest of humanities.

You can try and maybe succeed in changing the world, but you cannot change the nature of humanity, that is up to each individual to accomplish.

Also, I and others do not help the "Viel" because it does not need help.

It is not breaking down at all and everyone can see that.....that is, everyone but you.

[Shadowside]

You see the problem is there's a million different evil nasty thing going on at one time, but only a small handful of good things. humanities good is outweighed by evil.
At this point sangress, you go ahead a live in your happy dreamland where nothing violent or evil goes on and the veil is colored in rainbow pastels, while I live in the real world. Maybe, when the veil is in tatters lying at your feet, you'll realize that I was right and your happy idealic world never existed in the first place. I might be alone on my veil beliefs on this site, but I have similar conversasions, around the net and I'm not the only one working to undermine the veil. Nor am I the only one to know that its close to collapse.

[Jules]

Ok guys, can I remind you all of SF's rule please

Respect: Please respect other member’s and their beliefs, opinions, and views at all times. Abuse and abusive posts (of any nature) will not be tolerated. Breaches of this ruling will result in posts being removed, warnings and if continued, DA. Mocking, and belittling other members also counts as disrespect.

Thank you.
Jules
SF Moderator

[Verunia]

All the rest of you have done is to argue against me. No proof of anything you speak of.
Just pretty words iced around putdowns, but not single one of you have actually done anything to stop the degradation of the veil, all of you are just talk, neither a help or a hinderance, Every person finds this idea as selfish, childish and evil but not a single one of you actually assits the veil that you defend in your arguements, This veil is on the verge of failure but none of you actually want to fix it. no you're just content to sit and wait until it is to late, for the clock is already ticking, and it's moving faster than you think.

You posted your plan on a forum. A public place for all to see. What did you expect? Personally, I give you a little credit for actually continuously taking part in your argument. Because I certainly don't claim to know the answers to all the worlds mysteries, someone elses belief is as valid as mine, it is worth a good poke or two.

Truly the clock is ticking, it always has been. This is nothing new. Many people are aware of this but are also aware that this is not our fault nor our cause to deal with- what is, simply, is. Your reality and your world are different from ever other trilllion human beings on the planet. Learning to respect the world for that which it is, for the beauty of the Earth is where healing will come from in the human race.

But also, I disagree with you that humans are disgusting. Your own hatred and contempt for it seems to be what is fueling this. In every human we share the same essence but we rarely find it; the world has been led to believe the material is all there is and we have accustomed to striving off of money, power, status, fame, and greed.. It's unfortunate, and I can understand why you would want to change this. But it can be no other way right now. That is why it is the way it is.

There's an innate understanding and power in this world most overlook, and it is resting in their own minds. A lot of people call it God. You don't need to be enlightened to find it, and you certainly don't need to break anything in the process, maybe except one's own beliefs. Beliefs are like eggshells, they crack when they are brought upon with strong pressure. But there's more than just the shell..

It's more than just a veil you're trying to take down. In my humble opinion.. It's you.

[Sangress]

You see the problem is there's a million different evil nasty thing going on at one time, but only a small handful of good things. humanities good is outweighed by evil.
At this point sangress, you go ahead a live in your happy dreamland where nothing violent or evil goes on and the veil is colored in rainbow pastels, while I live in the real world. Maybe, when the veil is in tatters lying at your feet, you'll realize that I was right and your happy idealic world never existed in the first place. I might be alone on my veil beliefs on this site, but I have similar conversasions, around the net and I'm not the only one working to undermine the veil. Nor am I the only one to know that its close to collapse.

I've come from the cess pits of the spiritual world, I know how "evil" the non-physical can get. So, before you judge me to be an air-head, try looking again.

No conversations and plans you have with others is going to change the true reality of the situation.

[Shadowside]

I don't how explain it more clearly sangress. Here's my plan as Simply as i can describe it, I KNOW FOR A FACT that the veil has weak points, Many people know this aswell, it's a topic on almost every metaphyscial website, I have seen these weak points with my own eyes, they are caused by an unknown factor, And i'm going to try and determine what's causing the veils weak points, and then i'm going to use that knowledge to damage or destroy the veil in a controlled environment. If my first idea doesn't work I'm going to use a stone that is the complete opposite of what i'm doing now. Then if that fails, i'll move on to thought contructs, And if that fails I'll go back to the drawing board, and try and map out the veils holes better, and determine if there placement and location is random or not. That is the reality of the situation.

[Shadowside]

I never said it could not be damaged or worn thin. I just said it was pointless because it's not any kind of separating construct at all.

Going back over the conversation i see that you contridicted yourself, interesting.

[Shadowside]

Also, I and others do not help the "Viel" because it does not need help.

It is not breaking down at all and everyone can see that.....that is, everyone but you.
caught in your tracks.

[Shadowside]

So can it be damaged or not? make up your mind. Score one for the brick wall!

[Sangress]

Going back over the conversation i see that you contridicted yourself, interesting.

I was telling you what I had not yet stated which you seemed to assume I had.

Also, my version of "damage" refers to my explanation about Ethereal Flow. Because it is often seen as damage when it is essentially not.

caught in your tracks.
Unfortunately, you have misread. I stated that the Viel is not breaking down, not that it is possible for it to break down.

So can it be damaged or not? make up your mind. Score one for the brick wall!

As I have said the entire time..which you seem to have ignored...no, the Viel cannot be damaged.

Is this a competition now? How petty.

[Shadowside]

That dog won't hunt, monsignor.

[Shadowside]

face it, you admitted that it could be damaged. And if it can be damaged, it can be destroyed.

[Shadowside]

'I should have caught it earlier but seeing how i was arguing with ten people at once, I must have missed it.'

[Sangress]

Technological errors aside....

I just tried to explain that I did not say the Viel could be broken and I have already explained what I know, which you seem to be unwilling to consider or challenge because you are set in your logic.

I'm finished with this post. Nothing more for me to say or attempt to show for the benefit of this thread.

[Xan]

The veil cannot be damaged because it is not a 'thing'... it's merely a gap in consciousness. When the gap is filled with expanded awareness it merely disappears.


Xan

[Xan]

double post....

[Xan]

double post...

[Shadowside]

Sangress you twisted you own words and backpedaled when got caught. Xan, simply put there is a curtain of energy around this earth that divides the astral from the physical, it isn't imaginary mental gap in consciousness. The veil is a very real thing that lives breaths and dies as we do.
Sangress, Xan neither of you are going to let up, and neither am I, This simple topic has turned into a back and forth argument with no point, both of you are not contributing at all merely undermining me. I am asking both of you nicely to find another topic to post on, I realize that I have no authority in this matter but all the same we are starting to sound like broken records and I'm not looking forward to getting banned because this convo got out of hand as it's doing right now.

You'll here from me next when my experiment concludes.

[Xan]

No, my dear, the veil is not a living thing... simply a transition between frequency dimensions.

Although you see us as undermining you, allowing that you may be on the wrong track would actually support you in finding out what will really work.

That's my last word on it.


blessings
Xan

[Shabda]

Sangress you twisted you own words and backpedaled when got caught. Xan, simply put there is a curtain of energy around this earth that divides the astral from the physical, it isn't imaginary mental gap in consciousness. The veil is a very real thing that lives breaths and dies as we do.
Sangress, Xan neither of you are going to let up, and neither am I, This simple topic has turned into a back and forth argument with no point, both of you are not contributing at all merely undermining me. I am asking both of you nicely to find another topic to post on, I realize that I have no authority in this matter but all the same we are starting to sound like broken records and I'm not looking forward to getting banned because this convo got out of hand as it's doing right now.

You'll here from me next when my experiment concludes.
wow, you're really over complicating a thing that is literally 1st nature to everything that lives...

[Lucuno]

Guys; just let him be, he will learn this lesson I speak of sooner or later.
Arguing with him is a waste of time, look at his post record, to me what I see is a possible troll just trying to get SF rolling, so yea; just ignore him. We're only feeding him what he wants; which is called "attention".

[Shadowside]

You know I could just start this post war all over again with a retort; but It'll be so much sweeter if i wait, destroy the veil, and comeback with evidence of it's removal. If you don't think i'm right or if you think i'm just some stupid troll then leave, no one's making you stay here arguring with me.

[Kaere]

That's gone as far as I'm willing to let it.