Lets do an experiment

[Astral Explorer]

Originally Posted by psychoslice

Yes as I have said I have already done that, and yes it did feel as if I was floating here and there, it was a good past time, as also my religion was, until I found that that was nothing but a belief in something that cannot be proven. But I understand that you believe it works, where i don't, so lets just leave it at that.

I know it works, not believe. If you had experienced astral projection on levels that I have I am sure you would know the same thing. You said yourself all you did was float a little bit around, that is basically the baby stages of astral projection. I have been to unimaginable places, had conversations with a consortium of spirits which have told me things I could of never known myself, and the list goes on. If you aren't willing to put in the work to find out the truth about astral projection then you will never know the truth, at least not until your physical life ends and you get wacked in the face with the cold hard facts. Either way you will find out the truth one way or another, it's just a matter of would you rather find it out before you die and be able to learn, grow, and evolve from it? Or would you rather wait until your life is over and likely have to be reincarnates and try again since you passed on the opportunity to spiritually evolve?

[psychoslice]

Originally Posted by Astral Explorer

I know it works, not believe. If you had experienced astral projection on levels that I have I am sure you would know the same thing. You said yourself all you did was float a little bit around, that is basically the baby stages of astral projection. I have been to unimaginable places, had conversations with a consortium of spirits which have told me things I could of never known myself, and the list goes on. If you aren't willing to put in the work to find out the truth about astral projection then you will never know the truth, at least not until your physical life ends and you get wacked in the face with the cold hard facts. Either way you will find out the truth one way or another, it's just a matter of would you rather find it out before you die and be able to learn, grow, and evolve from it? Or would you rather wait until your life is over and likely have to be reincarnates and try again since you passed on the opportunity to spiritually evolve?

I have already found my truth, or should i say the truth, i have already had an experience in Consciousness, the answers come to me from within as also the questions, i use to feel that I projected to other worlds, not baby steps. What I share is what i intuitively feel from within Consciousness, this is why I cannot believe in something that is told to me, my on experience tells me that I am all there IS, that I am not separate from anything, that I don't have to project myself to anywhere other than where I am now, for where I am now is everywhere.

[amylou]

Originally Posted by psychoslice

I have already found my truth, or should i say the truth, i have already had an experience in Consciousness, the answers come to me from within as also the questions, i use to feel that I projected to other worlds, not baby steps. What I share is what i intuitively feel from within Consciousness, this is why I cannot believe in something that is told to me, my on experience tells me that I am all there IS, that I am not separate from anything, that I don't have to project myself to anywhere other than where I am now, for where I am now is everywhere.

The act of movement in a projection doesn't have to take place. You are correct. We don't have to leave ourselves and go anywhere. We increase our level of consciousness and experience. That is why the astral projection experience changes as we do it more. Eventually, it's just a shift of consciousness and movement doesn't have to be experienced. We continue to experience movement if we want to, but it's an illusion. We are already everywhere all the time.

[psychoslice]

Originally Posted by amylou

The act of movement in a projection doesn't have to take place. You are correct. We don't have to leave ourselves and go anywhere. We increase our level of consciousness and experience. That is why the astral projection experience changes as we do it more. Eventually, it's just a shift of consciousness and movement doesn't have to be experienced. We continue to experience movement if we want to, but it's an illusion. We are already everywhere all the time.

Gee, i like that, well said, i shall contemplate on that.

[Kontufuto]

Well I read the 9 pages and thought I'd take a spin on this experimental journey too! I don't get here very often but when I find a topic that I find relaxing and entertaining (like this one) I enjoy the humor and frustration at the same time! FWIW I can handle Barnacle's experimental challenge! The question isn't can't each one of us know as well. The real answer is that we already know the answer without any effort but we all mask the answer because we are here and that is reason we don't know! If we weren't here then we are in the know!! amylou is the closest to the answer as anything relating to consciousness is why we are here in the first place!! We are here because we want to forget that we already know and conditions are mocked up that predicates the need for proof and the scientific method. The opposite to consciousness is illusion and that is the physical universe plain and simple. If it wasn't for our all powerful knowingness of consciousness in the first place (experiment with this one: ask your higher self if you know or don't know) then most of us wouldn't consider this exercise in futility in the first place!! So those who know are not here and those who don't know are here! That is why no one so far said they can do it because we are here and don't want to know!!

[psychoslice]

Very philosophically put Kontufuto, but still makes no sense lol, we are no closer than we were from the beginning of this thread, I myself know that no one truly knows, just testing the waters.

Hello Psychoslice,

thoughts, feelings, personal experiences can not be proven in scientific way. One minute before I thought of my girl with love. Was it so? Yes, absolutely. Can it be proven? No. Can you doubt it? Yes, of course. Is there any problem? I don't see any. As I see, nobody wants to prove to you anything. Your own experiences belong to you, and you don't have to prove them anyway. It's a foolish idea to think, what you can not prove, that does not exist. I think, this is a great limitation af the western science. If you have a step-by step provement, it does not change anything. For me what works, that works, it's so easy.

[psychoslice]

Originally Posted by Yetti

Hello Psychoslice,

thoughts, feelings, personal experiences can not be proven in scientific way. One minute before I thought of my girl with love. Was it so? Yes, absolutely. Can it be proven? No. Can you doubt it? Yes, of course. Is there any problem? I don't see any. As I see, nobody wants to prove to you anything. Your own experiences belong to you, and you don't have to prove them anyway. It's a foolish idea to think, what you can not prove, that does not exist. I think, this is a great limitation af the western science. If you have a step-by step provement, it does not change anything. For me what works, that works, it's so easy.

I cannot agree with the science part of what you said, science needs to be proven, just imagine if it didn't, there would be all sorts of commotions going on, the drugs that medical science makes would not be tested, why test it when we only need to believe it works, see how silly that sounds ?.

Hy Psychoslice,

yes you are right, in the science there is a big of commotion, and often very big mistakes, but big results also, of course. Medical materials must be tested, just like AP methods, if they work or not. It's not enough to think that it works, it must really do. In the science it begins almost the same way than in the spiritual life, as first comes an idea, an intuition, than they test if it works or not, and then they try to find a proof. Some great mathematician said once, that he can prove any experimental result, and the opposite also, because of the many different methods he knowes.

BUT belief and experience is something personal, that does not need to be proved. I think you don't want to understand what I tell you, only because of the discussion.

[psychoslice]

Originally Posted by Yetti

Hy Psychoslice,

yes you are right, in the science there is a big of commotion, and often very big mistakes, but big results also, of course. Medical materials must be tested, just like AP methods, if they work or not. It's not enough to think that it works, it must really do. In the science it begins almost the same way than in the spiritual life, as first comes an idea, an intuition, than they test if it works or not, and then they try to find a proof. Some great mathematician said once, that he can prove any experimental result, and the opposite also, because of the many different methods he knowes.

BUT belief and experience is something personal, that does not need to be proved. I think you don't want to understand what I tell you, only because of the discussion.

I will listen to anything that makes sense, and again can be proven, beliefs maybe personal but that doesn't make them true, even in an experience doesn't make it what you may think it is, we may all experience the same thing and all have different opinions of that experience, then who's experience is right or wrong, so yes in that sense we cannot really argue or debate, which I think is happening here.