Buddhism and kundalini

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by Melahin

Maybe, but the OP asked this:



So I guess you both have your right to your opinion; like with all sheep they are not all in the same flock, neither might all sheep in the same flock agree with the shepherds direction... yet I wonder if they squabble about it?

Here is this:

The psychic heat Drod is produced by the space particles and the heat manifested from the friction of the wind element. This is another fundamental element as it supports and gives power to the consciousness, like the power of the fire that can launch rockets to space. The power is called medrod or 'digestion fire' in medicine and Tummo in yoga tantra. The heat (fire) sustains life and protects the body/mind. The psychic fire increases the wisdom, burns the ignorant mind of the brain and gives realization and liberation from the darkness of unawareness. That is why yoga describes Tummo as the aggressive fire which ignites from below navel, pierces the chakras one by one and reaches the sky of the crown chakra. The tummo burning arrow married with the celestial bride leads to enjoy the life of transformation of samsara. They give birth to the son of awareness from the blissful garden of Vajrayogini.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tummo

[running]

Originally Posted by Valerian

Originally Posted by running
"this is why i have a disgust towards buddhism. time after time 90% of the time fhe ignorance from them is astounding.

those tutors if anything should be your students if you wished to be one. there own dogma and lack of real experience is nothing but a hindrance.

9 times out of 10 i would guess one could go further, faster, staying away from idiots of that sort.

i seriously doubt you would of died or become mentally ill if you road it out. let the energy do her thing. it probaboy wouldnt of brought you to a bliss and silence that stayed. but you may have experienced it more than you have before. making you one step closer to it becoming your experience without breaks. meaning continuous.

i have seen people open up and experience the bliss and silence. i never seen one die or become mentally ill. not that it couldn't happen. but in this world anything could happen. but it doesnt make it likely."

When making judgement about peoply as 'idiots' without having met them is not usually recommended'

Russel Williams was recently persuaded to agree to the making of a book available on Amazon "Not I Not Other Than I. He has been interviewed on Conscious TV and although his teaching are eclectic he has been Honorary President of the Manchester Buddhist Society for probably more than 50 years. He has recently celebrated his 97th birthday and still holds groups at the house that he gifted to the Society, twice weekly. There are videos of him on YouTube posted not by himself. He is a quiet and humble man who is truly an enlightened man - believe me!

When he made those three possible reactions to the rising of the Kundalini, he was talking to me as my friend, not a student, in his own home with his wife. It was very personal because he knows me, and my state of health both mentally and physically. To another person, he would have said something applicable to that person. That is how a good teacher, including the Buddha, teaches.

As for myself, I am a former meditation teacher with my own students, some of whom still keep in contact. At my body age of 79, I have had many experiences in this life and I am also influenced by teachings and experiences in alternative lifetimes as well as this one.

May your own journey, running, be as blessed as mine has been,

Namasté
Valerie

what they said was dogmatic and dumb. maybe they had different intentions and i wasnt there so all i can go by is what you said. let me explain. when the second chakra opens you feel sexual energy. that is pretty normal. to say thats not our way is dumb. cause it has nothing to do with way. it has to do with opening and clearing. and pretty much everybody if not everybody is going to experience sexual energy in the opening and clearing process. the second chakra has sexual energy. everybody i have talked to anyway. myself included.

saying not being our way is not helpful and tells me there more into beliefs than experience. unless they meant some other thing. again i wasnt there.

all that is important as i have experienced and have heard from others is the opening and clearing your way to bliss and silence. then it will eventually become permanent.

after it has become permanent what had been experience is just what had been experienced. like taking a trip. you may see mountains, trees, rivers, ocean and so on. but the destination is the destination. everything else is just a memory of the travel.

[running]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

Hi running :)

To help with the discussion.

Kundalini and Tummo are the same type of energies. The difference is that Tummo is usually taught when the practioner has much greater clarity of mind than with Kundalini yoga. Starting energy practices earlier can be very effective, but the danger is one will be caught up and get ahead of themself with the energy effects. The key in both cases is having a good teacher/guru.

Tummo is Buddhist.

Buddhism focuses on clarity of mind first which lessens the issues one can have from energy work. Without a teacher/guru to help provide such clarity one tends to overload often. At the same time one tends to progress faster in my experience with energy work which is why you will see Buddhist teach vase breathing early on which is a safe and gentle energy practice.

glad to see you around! was worried about you since you were gome for a bit. glad your ok! thought maybe something happend to u.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by django

Buddha is sometimes depicted as having an upright cobra flared over his head, in fact multiple cobras, which is classic kundalini iconography, and yet original Buddhism doesn't seem to have anything to say about kundalini. So this made me curious - what is the Buddhist attitude to kundalini?

We generally consider all experience impermanent, and craving for experience as the root of suffering, and the work of Buddha was to understand and resolve suffering. Hence Buddhism involves the cessation of suffering, which is basically the end of desire. People often come to sit and they expect special kinds of spiritual experience, and then become disappointed if 'nothing happens'. Hence we don't promote any kind of special experience - only the bare attention to 'this' experience just as it is, whatever that might be. When the body starts to open up and there is an energy flow, that practice remains just the same. To a Buddhist meditator there is no difference to free flowing experience and a hard solid experience, and should desire for the former and aversion to the latter arise, one knows their balance of mind is being disturbed by egocentricity.

When the body starts to open up to an energy flow, it's important to understand the importance of keeping a sound balance of equanimity.

The practice of meditation is solely the practice of awareness with equanimity - regardless of what kind of experience a person has.

[Jeremy Bong]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

I answered this already in detail.

Your racism is shocking.

I would encourage others to use google and you can find the same answers i have provided earlier.

Your answer is Tibetan Buddhism or the same as Hinduism that running had learned. Then you're the same ------- Hinduism. Chakras and Yoga stuffs nothing new, kundalini, bliss and silence. Why promote in Buddhism section. I'm glad you're back but your learning always cling to the Tibetan Buddhism nothing more. And that's a pity.

Why Hinduism is Buddhism? Give me a link if you like.

[django]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

I answered this already in detail.

Your racism is shocking.

I would encourage others to use google and you can find the same answers i have provided earlier.

If the practice of Tummo is found in only one expression of Buddhism and not in Buddhism's original canon, I tend to agree with sky that Tummo is not a fundamental aspect of Buddhism and probably shouldn't be called a Buddhist practice.

Googling Tibetan Buddhism I find that Tibetan Buddhism incorporates Madhyamika and Yogacara philosophy, Tantric symbolic rituals, Theravadin monastic discipline and the shamanistic features of the local Tibetan religion Bön.

This is far from the original teachings of Sakyamuni Buddha, and is not just a simple reinterpreatation of his teachings but a mixing of belief systems that has been perceived as negative in earlier posts.

The resulting mix if it occurred nowadays might be seen as a kind of new age Buddhism.

In terms of this thread and my original question, it has been made clear that Sakyamuni Buddha doeasn't refer to kundalini in the Pali canon.

As an analagous example I would suggest that just because Mormon's believe that Kolob is the heavenly body nearest to the throne or residence of God, it doesn't then follow that Christians in general ascribe to this belief, or that the validity of Kolob as a planet near where God lives is a fundamental Christian tenet.

Mention of Kolob is not in the Christian bible, just as Tummo is not in the Pali canon.

[running]

Originally Posted by Jeremy Bong

Hinduism that running had learned..

i didn't learn hinduism. my journey was through intuition and feeling. but the experience is the same tradition or not. bliss is bliss and silence is silence. so it really doesnt matter the tradition in the big picture. as far i as i see it anyways.

[Jeremy Bong]

Originally Posted by running

i didn't learn hinduism. my journey was through intuition and feeling. but the experience is the same tradition or not. bliss is bliss and silence is silence. so it really doesnt matter the tradition in the big picture. as far i as i see it anyways.

Formerly, you have said that you went to learn from Hindus Guru and now you said, you never learned Hinduism or maybe just part of it. Mind you tell me , how you know and learn your bliss and silence or kundalini?

So it's Hinduism --- kundalini. You may not care much but the founder of this practice don't say this way. Everything dharma or practice is connected. Nothing is "free" of charges.

[django]

Originally Posted by Valerian

Thank you for your interest in my earlier post about my actual experience of the kundalini, django.

What I have not mentioned anywhere except by saying that it was a sexual experience which I hadn't expected, the lead up is itself quite amazing. My tutor at the time was in his early thirties and I had already been appointed to a position where I was responsible in maintaining the behaviour of the group members (all new to meditation) and the ambience.

I was at the time severely sexually repressed. I was also very dogmatic - I was right and no-one else was. Everything in the small shrine room had to be perfect. The flowers had to be 100% fresh with no droopy petals, etc. My tutor took me to task about this on a couple of occasions which I ignored.

On this particular day, tutor said to me (and although we are still in touch some 40 years later I have never told him of this trigger). He said,"Valerie, Samatha meditation is also known as 'sexual magic'. I was shocked to the very core and my mind went totally numb.

The arising of the kundalini was as if everyone in the world was simultaneously experiencing a massive orgasm. It was wonderful but fear arose when it went past the heart and into the base of the neck.

I began to be difficult in the group and refusing to do what I was asked. I was so full of vibrant energy that everybody noticed the change. I painted my nails vivid red, wore cosmetics, bright new clothing, dancing around inside shop window displays when music was played in store. I loved Def Leppards Pyromania which I bought and played full blast in my car. Men walked and looked like Greek Gods and when I attended the meditation building, it was noticed with some alarm that I was the centre of attention for the men!

Whilst I wasn't sent to work in the garden, I was given the daily exercise of mindful walking outside for a minimum of half and hour regardless of the weather.

I do not regret preventing the rising of the kundalini through the crown because it was extremely powerful and I was not ready or prepared for that to happen at the time. I am sure the 'dancing and screaming' around the shrine was a premonition for it to be avoided. I have had smaller, gentle arisings without any problems - in fact I have welcomed them and still do.

The image of the huge snake rising above the Buddha is what attracted me to this thread. The Buddha was far more spiritually advanced than I was. For him it appears as protection, but not for me at that time.

Unfortunately, as the energies dissipated over the many months the sexual repression which was never addressed returned in full. It is only very recently after reading "The Sublime Life and Songs of Drukpa Kunley" a Tibetan Lama, that I was able to release these feeling which had been strengthened and enforced by the Established Church's views on women, marriage and sex.

Thankyou for sharing your story Valerie, it’s certainly very relevant to this discussion. Thinking about your story from all you have described I imagine your premonition was probably spot on, presuming you were in tune enough with yourself to be given that moment of perfect guidance from your subconscious.

Very likely you saved yourself a lot of pain and anguish, while still able to enjoy the smaller more tame releases now.

[django]

Originally Posted by Gem

We generally consider all experience impermanent, and craving for experience as the root of suffering, and the work of Buddha was to understand and resolve suffering. Hence Buddhism involves the cessation of suffering, which is basically the end of desire. People often come to sit and they expect special kinds of spiritual experience, and then become disappointed if 'nothing happens'. Hence we don't promote any kind of special experience - only the bare attention to 'this' experience just as it is, whatever that might be. When the body starts to open up and there is an energy flow, that practice remains just the same. To a Buddhist meditator there is no difference to free flowing experience and a hard solid experience, and should desire for the former and aversion to the latter arise, one knows their balance of mind is being disturbed by egocentricity.

When the body starts to open up to an energy flow, it's important to understand the importance of keeping a sound balance of equanimity.

The practice of meditation is solely the practice of awareness with equanimity - regardless of what kind of experience a person has.

Thanks Gem, this is a really clear way to understand Buddhism's attitude to kundalini or anything else - kundalini as just one more possible human experience which would be treated with the equanimity extended to any other experience.

I like simple