Different afterlifes?

[Jeff4freedom]

Shabda,
Good points...

The only "judgment" in the death experience....

Is our own.... about ourselves..

and that is based in the ignorance of duality.

And it only occurs very shortly during the stage when the consciousness first removes from the brain and moves into the brain stem..... during that stage where folks say <"they see their lives passing before their eyes"

There is no Entity out there judging us...

that's another little handy lie the Religions put out there to control the Sheep.

Judgment is solely a human concern...

Your suggestion that folks get comfortable with OBE's is a good one. I was trained in Dying without actually cutting the cord that binds us to our bodies.....

I personally believe this should be taught in school... But the religions have pretty much controlled so much of humanity's progress by filling them with lies about these matters that should be common knowledge.

When we understand the process of Death.... it facilitates our souls growth.... and the Growth of the Whole.

It's interesting that the "Church" is probably the entity most responsible for retarding the evolution of Mankind..... on the pretense of......

what the heck do they claim their purpose to be...

Get us closer to God?

Too Funny

[Shabda]

what's funny is that every Saint, who's experiences began each religion, DID talk about and recommend it...

[theophilus]

If you believe in reincarnation you should read this:

http://eternal-productions.org/PDFS/articles/Reincarnation%20Exposed.pdf

[Jeff4freedom]

Shabda, Yep, funny how all that kinda got misplaced.. he he

[Shabda]

Originally Posted by theophilus

If you believe in reincarnation you should read this:

http://eternal-productions.org/PDFS/articles/Reincarnation%20Exposed.pdf

and why should i?? just because i disagree with you?? this proves not one thing about reincarnation

[Jeff4freedom]

OK Here is the text to what Theophilus posted.... I'll reply... But once again mention the guy who starved in the pantry.

Reincarnation Exposed
Nearly one-third of Americans now believe in Reincarnation. Reincarnation, in its purest
form, comes to us from the Hindu religion. Today it also embraced by most Wiccan
groups, New Agers, and others. Reincarnation teaches a birth-death-rebirth cycle based
on a person’s Karma. A bad person will come back as a lower form. A good person will
be reborn to a higher station in life.
Actually this isn't what everyone believes about Reincarnation, in fact I don't know anyone who believes it possible to come back in a lower form...unlike the Christian Doctrine...there is no punishment for "bad behavior"... That is just what has reflected in the Christian Doctrine because of human dualistic judgment.
If perfection is ever achieved, one may escape this
treadmill-like existence and either merge with the divine or melt into the universe.
God’s Word reveals that reincarnation is a deception which contradicts both the biblical
doctrine of the Resurrection and the observable evidence. Here are some of the many
problems with Reincarnation:
1) If Reincarnation is true, mankind should be progressing. Human nature and conduct
should be improving. However, the truth is, moral depravity is worsening as the Bible
anticipates (Matthew 24:12; 2 Timothy 3:1-5; etc.).
This is a limited view because the Christian mind does not understand the evolution of souls. It is the Nature of Human existence that there are always a greater number of younger souls (those responsible for the "moral depravity", because once a soul reaches a certain stage it merges into the "Spiritual Sun". The best and the "Highest are no longer in human form...
2) The vast majority of the population has no memory of their prior lives. If we’re all a
product of previous life-cycles, why don’t we remember our previous lives? How can we
work off bad karma if we don’t recognize our prior mistakes?

Once again the "vast majority" is not evolved to the point where this memory is possible. That is built nto the system...and I don't have time to go into detail on that right now. But the fact is, once we reach that stage of evolution where we face our previous ... judgments.... we don't need memory of the previous lives.... the lessons just keep coming back until we "get it". People always say, "How come this or that terrible thing just keeps happening to me over and over again, and it's because they are refusing to face their judgments about it.

3) Though there are some who claim to recall past lives, the Bible reveals that demons
have existed for millennia. These demons are able to place thoughts in a person’s mind in
order to deceive (1 Chronicles 21:1; 1 Timothy 4:1-2; Revelation 12:9; 16:14; etc.).

Yep, the Christians were always good about blaming anything beyond their comprehension on demons... I've been killed more than once by lovely Christians who didn't like the fact that I refused to be a Blind Sheep and follow them blindly, but rather chose to speak directly with angels and Spirits.


4) If we are all being recycled, where are all the new babies coming from? There were an
estimated 100 million souls a few thousand years ago, but today we’re approaching 7
billion people. Reincarnation denies a Creator God, so where are all these souls coming
from?

Who the hell writes this stuff. Reincarnation does not deny a Creator, but most who understand it don't buy into the Judgmental Superhero Christian idea of God... And how is it mutually exclusive that people reincarnate but no new souls are born. This is typical Christian BABBLE to ignorant sheep speech... Guess what, some of us aren't that ignorant. New souls are created on an exponential level... As I said there are always more young souls than old because new ones keep being created (and become Christians)...and the old ones leave Human form.

5) India is the cradle of Reincarnation, yet India is one of the world’s most woeful
nations. Though the people are intelligent and industrious, and natural resources abound,
cows and rats eat their fill while many humans starve. Countless city streets are awash
with filth, lined with starving beggars, and suffering is everywhere. With thousands of
years to perfect Reincarnation, and countless gurus and holy men, why isn’t India the
shining star of human progress and spiritual evolution?

Because India is whee Christians go in their new Life to learn humility... he he What makes this author think that we reincarnate in the same place? There are areas on the earth that have different purposes. India has it's. It has nothing to do with the belief in reincarnation. God that is sooo stupid. Tell me then, in this Christian Nation how is it that we could elect a total Moron like GW Bush. It must be because Christians believe in "life everlasting at the feet of God, or in Hell ..." Same silly logic.

6) Gandhi stated that Reincarnation is a burden to great to bear. He saw the fruits of this
practice around his country. All abroad was hopelessness and despair.

????

7) To break free from Reincarnation, one must live a harmless life. You can’t even kill a
microbe. Yet our immune system kills millions each day. This means there is no hope of
ever escaping the wheel of Karma.
This guy sure comes up with some bogus doctrine. Sure, some folks in the world who maybe also believe in Reincarnation also believe in complete Harmlessness. But some Christians rape babies and murder each other... What is the point here?

8) If you see a beggar wallowing in the gutter don’t you dare help him! He is working off
bad Karma. If you help him now, he will just have to come back in another lifetime to
work off his bad karma all over again. This is why India had no hospitals or charitable
institutions until the coming of Christian missionaries.

Yeah, Christian Missionaries are great. Have probably cuased more suffering over the years than any other group. Just look at what was done to the Calif. Indians, Indigenous folks everywhere who didn't accept the lies...
That statement was just lame..... moronic thinking. Do all Christians think like morons?

The truth is Reincarnation offers no hope, provides no answers, ignores the clear
evidence, and contradicts our God-given conscience. It is a demonically inspired
philosophy intended to keep its adherents slaves to sin and death.

OMG... Total **. The moron should study it before they pontificate about it.. They are just making them self look stupid except to anyone who is dumber than they are....and can't be too many that dumb.

But what does the Bible teach? God’s Word does teach that “Whatever a man sows, that
he will also reap” (Galatians 6:7).

Yep, that's Karma There are repercussions to sin – both in this life and the
next. So a believer in Christ can use the notion of bad karma as a springboard to explain
that the penalty for sin is death
Penalty for sin is death... well we all die, with that logic we might as well sin away.
and then share the true Gospel of Jesus Christ.
The Bible completely refutes the theory of Reincarnation. Hebrews 9:27 states “It is
appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment.” Notice, we only die once and
then we stand before God to be judged.
Written to inspire fear in foolish sheep.... no basis in Reality
And Paul writes “To be absent from the body [is]
to be present with the Lord” (2 Corinthians 5:8). Once we die, we go to be with the Lord
– we are not reincarnated and sent back to earth.

Wow, I never once remember seeing the word "reincarnated" in the Bible
Scripture also affirms that once believers die, we then rise “and thus we shall always be
with the Lord” (1 Thessalonians 4:17).
Furthermore, remember that during Jesus’ transfiguration, Moses and Elijah appeared as
Moses and Elijah (Mark 9:1-5). Though they had lived many centuries earlier, they were
still Moses and Elijah – not different persons.
In addition, when Jesus ascended to heaven the angels standing by said “This same Jesus,
who was taken up from you into heaven, will so come in like manner as you saw Him go
into heaven” (Acts 1:11). In other words, Jesus will return as Jesus not a different
incarnation.
Scripture also explains that Jesus died once – never to die again (Romans 6:9).
Throughout God’s Word, the resurrection is taught – which directly refutes Reincarnation
(John 11:25; 1 Corinthians 15; 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17; etc.). Jesus’ resurrection is
testified to by Old Testament prophets and many New Testament witnesses. The
historical and eye witness testimony for Jesus’ resurrection is extensive and irrefutable.
In fact, after His resurrection, Jesus was seen by over 500 eyewitnesses at one time (1
Corinthians 15:6). Refer to our article on the Resurrection for more evidence.
Finally, the resurrection not only agrees with the evidence, but it offers true hope. Jesus
promises all who will trust and follow Him: “Because I live, you will live also” (John
14:19).
“I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall
live” (John 11:25).

Once again if you feel the need to fix your car with instructions in a cook book..... it's quite possible the car will break down again. You are using a bogus text to make an argument. That makes the argument equally bogus.

Originally Posted by johnatre

I am so confused, I don't know if I believe in heaven and/or hell. Or rebirth. I guess I just need proof. Do you mind sharing your beliefs on the afterlife? I would enjoy reading them, as long as they aren't a book a piece o_o

All I know about death and the afterlife is that I'm afraid of it.

Thanks,
johnatre

Johnatre.you might want to check out some books about NDE's. People who have near death experiences usually come back with a completely different outlook on what lies beyond, one so profound that it usually changes their lives. I know what to expect and have absolutely no fear. In fact, I will be glad to go back to Summerland when it is time. there really is nothing to fear, only beauty, contentment and meeting old friends.

[Shabda]

i cant say i disagree with your findings or opinions jeff!

This sounds like magic, but I believe what we think it will be, it will be. If you think heaven is a glorified church in the sky, it just may well be.

I believe that its something you must find out for yourself. I grew up in the church and nothing I've learned from the bible have I have not been able to disprove it. However, little I've read from the Quran or Bahgavgita (spelling? not sure if it's a religious text or more philo.) or a collection of Taoist beliefs and my families own Native American beliefs (which are vary from each tribe) have I been able to disprove as well. I believe we all recieve information from spirtual sources, it jsut how we *intrepret* them that is different.

Much of the people on this forum and even those who do not can see spirits or feel them. With my own expriences, I have learned that they do exist and that there is an afterlife. Often times that tiny voice you hear can be your grnadmother, uncle, spirit guide, or even an angel. Just sit in silence one day, meditate, and ask.

Also, do not believe that hell is a literal place. I think that hell is a state of being. The further away from peace and spirituality/God you are the unhappier and unsettled your soul may be. For example, a murderer will find it difficult to truly be at peace bringing him to a state of unrest and pain during the afterlife. That is what I think hell is. Heaven, in my mind, is the oppisite.

Even though I look at spirits and afterlife from a religious standpoint it may not help you much. As my friend says, it's been too integrated with culture so that you are *told* what *others* believe and it may stop you from finding out for yourself. You'll find that religious text have many many similarities and every relgious text I've read has wanted to bring peace, spirituality, understanding, and love. Not punishment, hurt, and pain. So as far as religious influences go please dont feel in pressure or get caught up tiny arguments about it. I think, and this is merely a suggestion, that you should study what interest you and what pulls you in will lead you to an answer. Meditation may help as well.

SOrry for his being so long x_x