Zen, a practice without thinking??

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by avisitor

Yes, I did ... however not in the way you expected.
Sorry that I don't live up to your expectations.

Can you try and answer them another way because I don't see where you answered them. That is if you want to of course...........thanks

'So the question is, do you realize all he has said that you quoted and if so why not share in your own words..........if not, why share them at all? Cause it sounds good?'

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by Xan

We have to use concepts in this modern world but we don't have to get bogged down in them. Why not just keep letting go ongoingly?

Whether it's concepts or self image or familiar feeling patterns, it's only the clinging and resisting that keep us trapped in the limitations of the mind.



Xan

If you use the word term 'spiritual growth' in a sentence then it is something you believe in. If you talk to someone like Riverstone, he would say there is no such thing.
It's just that simple. Call it what you want, cling a little or a lot...it's a way to provide purpose and sense of something that is just not there..............or for the sake of argument 'may not be there'.

[Xan]

James... I would not presume to know what Riverstone would say about anything other than the few words I have read from him here.

If you feel you have not and are not growing in consciousness, which means spiritually, that's fine. It's neither my own experience nor my observation of you recently.


Xan

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by Xan

James... I would not presume to know what Riverstone would say about anything other than the few words I have read from him here.

If you feel you have not and are not growing in consciousness, which means spiritually, that's fine. It's neither my own experience nor my observation of you recently.



Xan

Ok, lets get back on track and just assume that Riverstone has truly realized the essence behind the words avisitor posted. If you read them, you will see that he would not use the term 'spiritual growth'.....and yet you do.

Originally Posted by WhiteShaman

'So the question is, do you realize all he has said that you quoted and if so why not share in your own words..........if not, why share them at all? Cause it sounds good?'

When I was in college and read Shakespeare, I thought it was very good. However, I would never attempt to rewrite him. Would you?
Did I realize everything Shakespeare had to say?? I don't know. But, I don't think I did.

Why share Shakespeare? Cause there is more to it than just a simple story.
And, maybe sounding good is enough for now??

As I have said, I am a novice.

[BlueSky]

The danger in saying this .. is that there is no spiritual growth, no conceptual mind, no non-conceptual mind, ...
Yet it was given birth here as it was spoken of.
And now, you will seek to grow spiritually rather than the experience.
That is the danger of using words.

Riverstone (modified by James)

[Xan]

Originally Posted by WhiteShaman

Ok, lets get back on track and just assume that Riverstone has truly realized the essence behind the words avisitor posted. If you read them, you will see that he would not use the term 'spiritual growth'.....and yet you do.

So.... ?

from the original quote:

Awareness does not reject anything, it sees the arising thought, reflects the thought,
And it stops reflecting it when the thought is gone.


Xan

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by avisitor

When I was in college and read Shakespeare, I thought it was very good. However, I would never attempt to rewrite him. Would you?
Did I realize everything Shakespeare had to say?? I don't know. But, I don't think I did.

Why share Shakespeare? Cause there is more to it than just a simple story.
And, maybe sounding good is enough for now??

As I have said, I am a novice.

Thank you for the honesty. I'm no Riverstone but my intent in asking you this was to maybe point out that there is more to learn about ourselves in asking the question, why we believe Riverstone, than there is in any other form of spiritual practice. You like his words because you relate to them. You relate to them and that defines you. You become more and more defined as this pattern goes on and what you really want is to become less and less defined. This will lead you to the beginning.
I come in peace. Thanks for putting up with me.

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by Xan

So.... ?

from the original quote:


Awareness does not reject anything, it sees the arising thought, reflects the thought,
And it stops reflecting it when the thought is gone.


Xan

So....? Is there such a thing as 'spiritual growth'?

[Xan]

I've grown spiritually a great deal over the years... meaning I'm increasingly aware in the essence of being that is already and always here. Haven't you?

I've also found any concept or words may be used without being 'wrong' or 'right'... They're just tools to use for communication, unless I get caught in clinging or resisting.


Xan