Beliefs vs. Truth vs. Facts of Life

[sound]

Originally Posted by NightSpirit

Truth is in the eye of the beholder; belief is an adopted program; facts are only as solid as their research (eg...we once thought the earth was square). In saying all this, none of them can hold water.

the middle one is interesting NS ... so by program do you mean conditioning? If that is what you mean do you 'believe' that we continue to adopt new programs until we leave this physical experience, or alternatively, that we are eventually able to let go all beliefs/programing?

[sound]

Originally Posted by TzuJanLi

i sense the benefit of simplicity.. like the sculptor who, when asked how he carved such an exquisite elephant from a block of wood, replied: "i removed everything that didn't look like an elephant"..

Nice! A lot less complicated than trying to explain every movement and angle of the knife blade ... you either get it or you don't ... its that simple really

[GentleStrength]

Beliefs - The beliefs you hold "create" the reality you experience and thus become your truth since they are reflected back to you. Most beliefs are inherited from parents, family and friends from an early age and are rarely ever examined as to how well they create a reality you would prefer. Changing or adding beliefs will make dramatic shifts in the reality you experience.

At age 15 or so I read Seth's Nature of Physical Reality and at one point in the teachings of beliefs I set the book down and wondered if I could just believe I was happy and have it be so. Really thought about it for an hour or so and then decided to give it a try. Been happy from that day to this which was a pretty dramatic shift from my teen years!

Not everyone necessarily wants to be happy but it was what I wanted and one brief decision changed my reality "completely". After that I have taken the time to examine the beliefs I had already accepted and re-evaluated them as to whether or not I wanted them to continue to be a part of me or if I should change them to something else.

It can get kind of tricky too when you have beliefs that aren't obviously connected but work together to create a specific effect. Basic example -
1. I am a good person
2. Good people suffer (generally accepted when thinking of others)
Effect - you must suffer since you are a good person per your belief

Other than universal truths, truth is the reflected validation of your reality which has been created by your beliefs.

Love and Light

The worst part about the truth is that...it cannot be explained.

[NightSpirit]

Originally Posted by sound

the middle one is interesting NS ... so by program do you mean conditioning? If that is what you mean do you 'believe' that we continue to adopt new programs until we leave this physical experience, or alternatively, that we are eventually able to let go all beliefs/programing?

Hi sound

I guess conditioning is a big chunk of it, but it can come from what others say, what we read & hear etc.

I'd like to think that we could strive towards letting go of all beliefs, but honestly, I don't really think we can while in the human state. Beliefs can be the fore-runner to many experiences we have. And yes, life is not static so our beliefs are bound to keep changing with life circumstances.

[sound]

I have an affection for 'the old ghost' too GS lol ... I was slightly older than 15 when i first came across his material ... probably about 20 yrs ago now i guess ... I am unable to say that i have never experienced sadness since reading those books however, I will say that they were instrumental in the changes which occurred in my life at that time ... i also accept that we create our reality through our thoughts and beliefs.

Originally Posted by GentleStrength

Beliefs - The beliefs you hold "create" the reality you experience and thus become your truth since they are reflected back to you. Most beliefs are inherited from parents, family and friends from an early age and are rarely ever examined as to how well they create a reality you would prefer. Changing or adding beliefs will make dramatic shifts in the reality you experience.

At age 15 or so I read Seth's Nature of Physical Reality and at one point in the teachings of beliefs I set the book down and wondered if I could just believe I was happy and have it be so. Really thought about it for an hour or so and then decided to give it a try. Been happy from that day to this which was a pretty dramatic shift from my teen years!

Not everyone necessarily wants to be happy but it was what I wanted and one brief decision changed my reality "completely". After that I have taken the time to examine the beliefs I had already accepted and re-evaluated them as to whether or not I wanted them to continue to be a part of me or if I should change them to something else.

It can get kind of tricky too when you have beliefs that aren't obviously connected but work together to create a specific effect. Basic example -
1. I am a good person
2. Good people suffer (generally accepted when thinking of others)
Effect - you must suffer since you are a good person per your belief

Other than universal truths, truth is the reflected validation of your reality which has been created by your beliefs.

Love and Light

[GentleStrength]

Originally Posted by sound

I have an affection for 'the old ghost' too GS lol ... I was slightly older than 15 when i first came across his material ... probably about 20 yrs ago now i guess ... I am unable to say that i have never experienced sadness since reading those books however, I will say that they were instrumental in the changes which occurred in my life at that time ... i also accept that we create our reality through our thoughts and beliefs.

Didn't mean to say I have "never" been unhappy since that time but my base emotional state changed in the moment of that decision to happiness rather than a depressive one. I tend to move back into a happy existence pretty quickly these days if something happens to move me away from it.

Glad to meet another "old-timer" here, when to find good spiritual teachings we had to trudge through the snow for miles... uphill... both ways!

Love and Light

[NightSpirit]

GentleStrength

It can get kind of tricky too when you have beliefs that aren't obviously connected but work together to create a specific effect. Basic example -
1. I am a good person
2. Good people suffer (generally accepted when thinking of others)
Effect - you must suffer since you are a good person per your belief

I call these UGR's (unwritten ground rules). They are how people are influenced by others. As I had stated in my thread about needing to feel accepted, its part of being human that we want to be accepted by people we respect and its likely we will follow in how they live...be it negative or positive. Because we have pre-existing views on everything, its likely we'll be biased by those and is a template to how we will most likely react.

[sound]

Originally Posted by NightSpirit

Hi sound

I guess conditioning is a big chunk of it, but it can come from what others say, what we read & hear etc.

I'd like to think that we could strive towards letting go of all beliefs, but honestly, I don't really think we can while in the human state. Beliefs can be the fore-runner to many experiences we have. And yes, life is not static so our beliefs are bound to keep changing with life circumstances.

Its interesting stuff isn't it, to say the least. So we experience truth ... some will say 'What i believe is the truth' ... 'Only the truth is believable' ... 'I know the truth' ... 'I know what i believe' ... 'Please believe me, i am telling the truth' lol ...

Hmm, I think that ...

Belief is the way we explain the truth
The truth is often how we think things are
Facts of life is simply reality, nothing more or less

Often people don't even think to form beliefs about real things (like a tree, or a stone) unless they want to understand it, in which case they'll need to form their own idea about what that thing is (truth) and then explain the reasons behind their thoughts about the tree (a belief.)

People can exchange beliefs and truth and mold them into one single thing if they want. If the belief becomes the truth, then it can be linked directly to reality in a single moment, it becomes quick and conveniant. To make it even more comfortable and easily accepted they can weave aspects of reality into the truth and belief too.

In the end, that real thing, a tree doesn't change its nature regardless of whether anyone believes it is a god or accepts that belief as being true and real or not.(I'm only using the god as an example because its the first thing that came to mind.)

It's still a real tree...unless it IS a god. ;p

Have I confused everyone enough?