Questions about being a Vegan!

[Fikre]

1. Where goes the line between usable and non-usable things?
Is eating ants wrong? They don't feel pain to my understanding, they don't miss their fellows after the fellows have been killed to my understanding. Why is eating an ant anything worse than eating a carrot?

2. If we don't kill animals, wouldn't that create imbalance in nature? Wouldn't these animals eventually starve or get eaten by predators?

3. Is there any unbiased major study about veganism being healthier? I sometimes hear how lab-made supplements are bad, how they are nowhere near the nutrients gotten from actual food and so on. But vegans need to eat a lot of supplements (b12 being the most obvious one).
I've heard vegan activists say how eating meat leads to cancer and other sicknesses, but is there any evidence that it does when done in moderation?


I've been vegetarian for maybe two years, now I'm eating more and more vegan because dairy makes my breath smell, stomach feel bad and skin feel dry. Eggs I never ate because I find them disgusting, vegan, vegetarian or omnivore, no difference. I use leather shoes, wool socks and shirts. I've been thinking about going vegan a lot, but I don't want to put effort if the effort is just naive and doesn't actually help the world.

1. The key is in what you wrote... to your understanding. I don't know if ants feel pain or have emotional lives. I'd rather err on the side of compassion.

2. No. Nonhuman animals are farmed, they aren't wild and out in nature, living natural lives. The only predator for "food animals" is human. (It's also a myth that animals in the wild will overpopulate if not hunted. But that's another issue.)

3. Vegans do not need a lot of supplements. That's a myth. Whether one eats other animals or not, a decent diet provides the nutrients we need. Some people need additional B12, some do not. This is true for iron, Vitamin A, etc. This is also true for meateaters. (For the purposes of this discussion, I am not addressing the matter of depleted nutrients in nearly all our food.)

As for your question about eating meat "in moderation"... Define moderation.

You can do a search for studies on strict vegetarianism's health benefits. (Veganism is an entire lifestyle, not just diet. Strict vegetarianism refers to diet only.) Dean Ornish, T. Colin Campbell, Neal Barnard and more have done extensive research on vegetarianism and strict vegetarianism. Campbell's research was mostly done while he was a professor at Cornell University.

Going vegan does help the world. Just as we don't see the benefit of not dropping that small bit of paper on the ground, it helps keep the planet a little cleaner. Veganism is about compassion, about not participating in cruelty and torture. Is being kind to other humans naive? Is being kind to other humans helpful to the world? I say yes. I believe we should extend our respect and kindness to all beings.

There are three reasons for going vegan:
- Ethical
- Health
- Environmental


If you really want some serious and thought-provoking answers to your questions, go here:
Gary Francione's FAQs on the rights of nonhuman animals
Pay special attention to the Animal Kill Counter on the page (and on every page on his site).


Bottom line for me is the desire to add to the peace in the world. A quote from Ralph Waldo Emerson comes to mind:
You have just dined, and however scrupulously the slaughterhouse is concealed in the graceful distance of miles, there is complicity.

And then there is this, from Jeremy Bentham:
The question is not, Can they reason? nor, Can they talk? but Can they suffer?

[knightofalbion]

Originally Posted by Everly

... err on the side of compassion.

[/i]

When in doubt ...

Great quote and fine post!

[kris]

Originally Posted by Fikre

I've been thinking about going vegan a lot, but I don't want to put effort if the effort is just naive and doesn't actually help the world.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/moby/m...b_5889850.html

Originally Posted by kris

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/moby/m...b_5889850.html

Great article! (I have it bookmarked on my other computer and it's now getting bookmarked on this one so I don't lose it.)

[athribiristan]

Read the Secret Life of Plants. Clearly plants experience the full range of emotions the same as we or other animals do. Erring on the side of compassion, when one is fully informed, means we need to stop eating altogether.

[Fikre]

I have terrible problems getting my proteins and calories from vegan diet.
The protein powders cost like 3x whey proteins do, soy (when I make it) tastes terrible and isn't good when eaten everyday in large amounts, beans, lentils, peas taste terrible. Basically all protein is excluded from a tasty diet for me because I can't make food.
Does anyone else have these problems?
Vegetarian diet is so easy, this is hard as anything can be.

[Fikre]

Can you people recommend some snacks that have:
-No gluten
-Little sugars (so not too much fruits etc.)
-At least 25 grams of protein
-At least 400 calories

Eating a bunch of almonds isn't too exciting anymore

[athribiristan]

My suggestion is not eating a vegan diet. Bunch of nonsense. Read the book I suggested.

[knightofalbion]

This fellow is vegan and a true inspiration ...
http://www.greatveganathletes.com/ve...egan-strongman

I don't understand why you can't get all the protein you need, and more, from your food?

There are a couple of vegan bodybuilding forums. I would advise signing up to one of them. They'd be able to give you advice on shakes and formulas and the like, if that is your thing.

Nothing worth doing is ever easy. Stay with it ...