a question about Karma please

Sorry if this post is in the wrong area. Anyway ,I unserstand such things as :

progressing through payment of karmic debts, reconnecting and "fixing" spiritual problems of the past ( is this generally correct?) but then the other day my friend mentioned to me that GRACE can supersede KARMA. Once the lesson(s) is/are learned then we may spiritually grow and continue on the path so to speak. We are here to learn,not to suffer,right?

can someone sort of give me/us clarity on what I speak of? Thanks!

peace,
Satch

Karma, as I understand it, isn't so much about paying debts or "fixing" problems of the past, so much as being more like the "energy" you carry into, during and out of this life.

I'm not sure what you mean by Grace superceding Karma...would you mind expanding that thought?

IMHO, we are on a continual spiritual journey, constantly being faced with lessons we have chosen for this lifetime. Pain is often a part of the learning process, but it doesn't always lead to suffering. Suffering is what happens when we try to ignore or avoid the lessons in front of us. Personally, I believe that we are here to learn not to suffer.

those are some nice thoughts and gives me a clearer understanding.thx,
Satch

dear satchitananda,here are some words of bhagawan sri sathya sai baba..

"If you place complete faith in the Lord at all times, you will receive His Grace. Grace takes away the pain of Karma. The Lord can save man completely from Karma."

here is a little bit out of an article which explains a little about karma:

The law of "Karma" (causation) and theory of rebirth

Creation is governed by an unalterable law - the 'Rita' of the Rig Veda. Nothing is arbitrary. God is not a capricious tyrant. The law of Karma, which is fundamental to Hinduism lays down that we reap the harvest, we have previously sown. The action is the seed, its consequences are the harvest we have to reap. As we sow, so we reap.

A corollary of the above is the law of rebirth. We go through many births before we are able to reach back to our source, i.e, God, and get released from the vicious circle of birth and death. That stage is called "Moksha", the final redemption.

another one:

It is not possible for anyone to escape from the consequences of what one does knowingly or otherwise. You have to face up to the consequences of all your actions, whether good or bad. Clearly, therefore, the doctrine of Karma stands as a cardinal principle that governs a person's life. One has to live and die with this principle. It is this Karma which determines one's joys and sorrows. And it is through Karma that you are endowed with this life itself.

hoping this helps u in understanding about karma...neeti.

karma is a programme recorded on gene

I've copied this from another post of mine, since it sums up my understanding od Karma:

So many people talk about Karmic debt, but Karma really isn't punishment, nor is there a book with a tally of our good and bad deeds. As I see it, Karma refers to how we react to what others do to or for us, and how what we do to and for others impacts us.

We can't control how someone reacts to our actions, good or bad, toward them. We can only control how we react to what others do toward us. Our reactions shape us, and help us experience the lessons needed for both spiritual and personal growth. That's at least how I view Karma; an opportunity for growth, not punishment

I feel that karma and reincarnation go hand-in-hand. I see life, this one and our past lives, as being about learning from our experiences. And how we react to those experiences is what Karma is. Good karma will be attracted to us when we react in a positive way to our experiences, negative karma when we react poorly. Free will also gives us the option of not reacting, which creates no karma. And the balance or imbalance of our karma is what makes us who we are, good, bad, or otherwise. The only punishment involved in karma is the emotional baggage we create for ourselves. Then we may create our own living hell.

By the option of not reacting, I mean not reacting to something someone else might try to do to you. If you insult me and I shrug it or laugh it off, it has no impact on me. The same would be true if I insulted you, not that I would, since I like you. Obviously every decision we make personally has an impact on our lives.

I think suffering comes from our own negative attitudes and energies rather than any outside karmic influence which some unknown entity keeps track of. Rather than a record being kept somewhere, karmic negativity is self contained, although we can inflict the negativity onto others.

I'm talking either ignoring, not reacting, or reacting in a way not expected by the person acting toward us. Let me give some examples of how I see karma working, which is reactionary rather than causative for the most part.

If I sent you a PM with what I thought was a terrible insult, that is going to cause negative energy and feelings in me. Now if when you get my PM, you feel my comments are funny, and laugh them off, they will have either a neutral or a mildly positive effect or energy on you.

The way you reacted doesn't change the negative energy the PM caused me. And my unkind intention doesn't change the neutral or positive energy your reaction caused upon you. So I see karma being more an issue of one's reaction than one of cause and effect. And as for rules and laws, from what I understand karma to be, there are none. Everything we need to know or learn spiritually is within us already. We only need to access it through our meditation. Looking outside ourselves for answers only confuses the issue, and us.

John

In my understanding, karma is a record of an "imbalance of energy" that one has caused, and to bring this to our attention (to help us become responsible, loving creators), the energy returns and makes itself felt at some time or other. Our spiritual task is then to "look into" the whole situation, as thoroughly as possible understand the ins and outs of it and why it created imbalance, and then release it by Absolute Forgiveness (if we are capable of doing that sincerely) - which is where the "Grace" comes in. By this Grace of forgiveness, the "sin" (read karma or imbalance) can be erased and rectified.

Pounamu

On a deeper level,I believe reincarnation offers us an explanation for the apparent unfairness in life. It allows for the possibility that the rich man in this life will be poor in the next,and vice versa. It puts our ills,misfortunes ,premature death or long-term suffering in context,not as accidents of birth but as episodes in a grand scheme in which the law of cause and effect -karma - ensuresthat the balance will always be restored and that there will always be opportunities for us to improve ourselves,however low we sink.

[peteyzen]

Originally Posted by m.namasivayam

karma is a programme recorded on gene

No its not, with respect, karma is a spiritual law and is not etched in some physical gene, In my not so humble opinion.

More importantly in reply to the opening question in this thread, Yes emphatically, grace can remove karma, if the divine being so wishes, or it is appropriate to your development it can happen.

Some folks dont believe in karma, they may be right , who knows but my experience is that it does exist and it is based on ones intent.
Try not to see karma negatively, see it as the result of skillful or unskillful behaviour. What you are now is the result of your past intentions and what you now intend will create your future.