Can we really cure diseases like cancer with positive thinking?

Originally Posted by markings

It gets even stranger. The "Tibetan Book of Living And Dying" contains quite an extensive session on Tonglen as a remarkably effective healing practice. It consists of taking on the feelings and pain of others during this meditative state.
On the surface this doesn't sound very clever and positive when one deals with one's own severe health problems. However, the intention to relieve the pain of others, to ease their burden, and at the same time one's own problems seem to get diminished. Maybe it works by reducing self-absorption.
These are laudable goals and some very good results are reported.

It's true. I've done it. I dislike the idea of using names to describe things like this though. They tend to imply that a certain person or discipline discovered a technique which is never true. Things like this have been with humanity since the beginning. Long before their was any such thing as a Buddhist people were doing this. We empaths are well versed in such things. We sometimes come upon them accidentally and often use them to good effect. There is no need to take the pains into yourself though. That is avoidable.

How does it work? On the ethereal level such things as proto physical manipulation are very easily done. The healing changes are made to the ethereal body and then the physical body has no option but to follow. Remember that the ethereal is the basis of the physical. Not the other way round. Those in attendance then call it "magic" and wonder. But natural laws are always followed. There is no such thing as something from nothing. Everything in manifestation has a cause. This is also the basis of other obscure techniques.

Some cultures have no name for those who wield these powers. In other cultures the name of shaman is given. Others simply call these types healers. Man made names are not important. Understanding is.

How, exactly, does it work? The practitioner gains access to the ethereal body of the subject and makes desired changes. It is that simple. This is the way that the Master Jesus changed water into wine and other "miracles". It is literally mind over matter. And where does the new material come from? Don't forget that matter is only energy. All we need to do is to accueulate sufficient energy and shape it as desired. The energy of any dimension to which we have access may be used.

Do we readily create on the physical level? Yes. We also easily create on the astral and mental planes. We can create on any level to which we have competence. It's only a question of realization and will. Most of the time our doubts get in the way and we are stopped. In this case the Buddhists have developed a method of training which prevents this happening. It is good.

But are we interfering with the karma of another? Possibly.

It is not something that can be learned. Those with this trait are born to it.

[sky]

Originally Posted by bartholomew

It's true. I've done it. I dislike the idea of using names to describe things like this though. They tend to imply that a certain person or discipline discovered a technique which is never true. Things like this have been with humanity since the beginning. Long before their was any such thing as a Buddhist people were doing this. We empaths are well versed in such things. We sometimes come upon them accidentally and often use them to good effect. There is no need to take the pains into yourself though. That is avoidable.

How does it work? On the ethereal level such things as proto physical manipulation are very easily done. The healing changes are made to the ethereal body and then the physical body has no option but to follow. Remember that the ethereal is the basis of the physical. Not the other way round. Those in attendance then call it "magic" and wonder. But natural laws are always followed. There is no such thing as something from nothing. Everything in manifestation has a cause. This is also the basis of other obscure techniques.

Some cultures have no name for those who wield these powers. In other cultures the name of shaman is given. Others simply call these types healers. Man made names are not important. Understanding is.

How, exactly, does it work? The practitioner gains access to the ethereal body of the subject and makes desired changes. It is that simple. This is the way that the Master Jesus changed water into wine and other "miracles". It is literally mind over matter. And where does the new material come from? Don't forget that matter is only energy. All we need to do is to accueulate sufficient energy and shape it as desired. The energy of any dimension to which we have access may be used.

Do we readily create on the physical level? Yes. We also easily create on the astral and mental planes. We can create on any level to which we have competence. It's only a question of realization and will. Most of the time our doubts get in the way and we are stopped. In this case the Buddhists have developed a method of training which prevents this happening. It is good.

But are we interfering with the karma of another? Possibly.

It is not something that can be learned. Those with this trait are born to it.

According to Buddhism,Tonglen will only interfere with not yet ripened or manifested karmic seeds.

It is not meant for the practitioner to take on the the suffering of others/the world but to acknowledge it's existence and accept it. When you do this then you can give freely to others to help them in their suffering without judgement.

It's unrealistic to try and take the burden of suffering from others unto yourself, but it is possible to ' hold their hand ' along the way and help them carry their burden.

Originally Posted by sky123

According to Buddhism,Tonglen will only interfere with not yet ripened or manifested karmic seeds.

It is not meant for the practitioner to take on the the suffering of others/the world but to acknowledge it's existence and accept it. When you do this then you can give freely to others to help them in their suffering without judgement.

It's unrealistic to try and take the burden of suffering from others unto yourself, but it is possible to ' hold their hand ' along the way and help them carry their burden.

The Buddhists are, as always, sensible folk. They understand the necessities for us all to carry our own burdens in life. but they serve ordinary folk engaged in ordinary living whereas we write for those who wish a more complete explanation of our livingness. For these, admonitions and requirements for mere obedience, however sensible, is not enough.

[sky]

Originally Posted by bartholomew

The Buddhists are, as always, sensible folk. They understand the necessities for us all to carry our own burdens in life. but they serve ordinary folk engaged in ordinary living whereas we write for those who wish a more complete explanation of our livingness. For these, admonitions and requirements for mere obedience, however sensible, is not enough.

Each to their own.....
Some look within, others look outside for explanations to' livingness ' some even look for answers from beyond, whatever works for you .

[shiningstars]

Originally Posted by bartholomew

It's true. I've done it. I dislike the idea of using names to describe things like this though. They tend to imply that a certain person or discipline discovered a technique which is never true. Things like this have been with humanity since the beginning. Long before their was any such thing as a Buddhist people were doing this. We empaths are well versed in such things. We sometimes come upon them accidentally and often use them to good effect. There is no need to take the pains into yourself though. That is avoidable.

How does it work? On the ethereal level such things as proto physical manipulation are very easily done. The healing changes are made to the ethereal body and then the physical body has no option but to follow. Remember that the ethereal is the basis of the physical. Not the other way round. Those in attendance then call it "magic" and wonder. But natural laws are always followed. There is no such thing as something from nothing. Everything in manifestation has a cause. This is also the basis of other obscure techniques.

Some cultures have no name for those who wield these powers. In other cultures the name of shaman is given. Others simply call these types healers. Man made names are not important. Understanding is.

How, exactly, does it work? The practitioner gains access to the ethereal body of the subject and makes desired changes. It is that simple. This is the way that the Master Jesus changed water into wine and other "miracles". It is literally mind over matter. And where does the new material come from? Don't forget that matter is only energy. All we need to do is to accueulate sufficient energy and shape it as desired. The energy of any dimension to which we have access may be used.

Do we readily create on the physical level? Yes. We also easily create on the astral and mental planes. We can create on any level to which we have competence. It's only a question of realization and will. Most of the time our doubts get in the way and we are stopped. In this case the Buddhists have developed a method of training which prevents this happening. It is good.

But are we interfering with the karma of another? Possibly.

It is not something that can be learned. Those with this trait are born to it.

Grateful for your sharing of your experience, bartholomew. I find it all very interesting. Thanks.

shiningstars

[shiningstars]

Originally Posted by bartholomew

But are we interfering with the karma of another? Possibly.

I would add on this point, for information only as I have learnt it, the Buddha specifically taught that the [(precise working out ) of the effects of kamma are one of the four imponderables.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipit....077.than.html

Karma in the Buddhist sense is defined as intention, and through intention, one acts through body, intellect and speech.

One therein owns one's own karma and its impacts/outcomes.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/d...thi/kamma.html

Also, there is another dimension of karma - in my opinion - and that is as a collective consciousness, there is a shared quality of karma/consciousness. The butterfly effect. Our actions and speech impacts another, like waves in an ocean.

The chain of causation. Cause and effect. This is why in my view environmental degradation etc. is owned by every single person on this earth - not just the "authorities".

One does ultimately own one's own kamma though as well, Buddha does teach about ending of kamma but it is a detailed topic overall.

Just some rambling thoughts.

Thanks,

shiningstars

Originally Posted by shiningstars

I would add on this point, for information only as I have learnt it, the Buddha specifically taught that the [(precise working out ) of the effects of kamma are one of the four imponderables.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipit....077.than.html

Karma in the Buddhist sense is defined as intention, and through intention, one acts through body, intellect and speech.

One therein owns one's own karma and its impacts/outcomes.

http://www.accesstoinsight.org/ptf/d...thi/kamma.html

Also, there is another dimension of karma - in my opinion - and that is as a collective consciousness, there is a shared quality of karma/consciousness. The butterfly effect. Our actions and speech impacts another, like waves in an ocean.

The chain of causation. Cause and effect. This is why in my view environmental degradation etc. is owned by every single person on this earth - not just the "authorities".

One does ultimately own one's own kamma though as well, Buddha does teach about ending of kamma but it is a detailed topic overall.

Just some rambling thoughts.

Thanks,

shiningstars

Thank you for your reply. Can I get more details on ending of kamma?

[markings]

Originally Posted by bartholomew

But are we interfering with the karma of another? Possibly.

This is a red herring because no matter whether we do, or not do, we are constantly influencing the situation, and therefore other peoples 'karma'.
There are 'sins' of commission and 'sins' of omission and both are equally important.

As I don't even know my own karma, let alone that of someone else, how am I supposed to make an informed choice?

[gratefulgirl]

How can we help another cure themselves or become a healer to them

I am trying to help heal my son of acne with no luck whatsoever

Originally Posted by markings

This is a red herring because no matter whether we do, or not do, we are constantly influencing the situation, and therefore other peoples 'karma'.
There are 'sins' of commission and 'sins' of omission and both are equally important.

As I don't even know my own karma, let alone that of someone else, how am I supposed to make an informed choice?

When faced with this question I almost always choose to reject fear and proceed....