Christianity - the cult of Jesus?

[Mathew James]

Originally Posted by A human Being

But it seems to me that an awful lot of Christians put the emphasis on the man, and not the teachings. They put Jesus on a pedestal, and act unworthy of him, and to me it just seems like passing the buck - 'I'm imperfect, but Jesus is perfect, so I'll look to him to save me,' they seem to be saying. They may pay lip-service to his teachings, but so often they don't appear to actually live it.

you are most likely correct. Jesus taught people to sell every thing they own and give the money to the poor, then follow him. Never met a "christian" that did that, and the priests/pastors that claim they do it have more worldly possessions than most people.

mj

[A human Being]

Originally Posted by Quirkybird

I suspect that if Paul hadn't been such a prolific writer we might never have heard of Jesus! I also wonder how much of what is recorded in the gospels about Jesus has any basis in fact? I think the less than credible stories surrounding him are grossly exaggerated or untrue. If Jesus was alive today I wonder if he would be astonished by what is claimed in his name?

I doubt he'd be too surprised, though I suspect he'd shake his head wrily. Yeah, I often wonder about the New Testament version of events (eg water into wine, feeding the five thousand) - were these miracles dreamt up by his disciples to create a mythology around him and lend more weight to his words? I very much doubt I'll ever know, so it's academic really.

PeteC-UK - still haven't got around to reading the Gnostic Gospels, though I was reading about them on wikipedia (I know, best not to take that as Gospel ) before.

[Miss Hepburn]

Originally Posted by A human Being

Now don't get me wrong, I think there is inestimable value in Jesus' teachings. He emphasised love, compassion, non-judgment, repentance, and humility, amongst other things, and in my view he was right to do so. 'Get your own house in order,' he seems to be saying - and rightly so. Also, he points the way to the realisation of one's own divinity.

But it seems to me that an awful lot of Christians put the emphasis on the man, and not the teachings. They put Jesus on a pedestal, and act unworthy of him, and to me it just seems like passing the buck - 'I'm imperfect, but Jesus is perfect, so I'll look to him to save me,' they seem to be saying. They may pay lip-service to his teachings, but so often they don't appear to actually live it.

And THIS was why I was banned from an active Christian Forum....when I realized the above
and started a thread, "Christ is too much in Christianity".

He pointed continually to the Father....my point was only..."Hey, guys.....what happened
to the Father?" And I was banned; ha!

[Miss Hepburn]

Originally Posted by Quirkybird

... If Jesus was alive today I wonder if he would be astonished
by what is claimed in his name?

But he is..'astonished' is not the word, tho...as found in the James E. Padget
messages...that I found out about right here on this Forum.

[Miss Hepburn]

Originally Posted by Mathew James

you are most likely correct. Jesus taught people to sell every thing they own and give the money to the poor, then follow him. Never met a "christian" that did that, and the priests/pastors that claim they do it have more worldly possessions than most people.

mj

I don't recall Jesus "teaching people" the above...a rich guy asked him, and Jesus
told HIM what he needed to do, what he needed to hear in particular
...why? Bec he was so attached to his money.
Jesus' message in John 10:10 was that he came for us to live an abundant life..(abundance
in everything, joy, love, peace is my interpretation...all around abundance...not austerity
at all.)
And I have met Christians that think poverty is the sign of being a true Christian and
remain impoverished..and
put down anyone financially successful. A real enticement to follow Jesus...be homeless
and poor, struggling in life...hmm, don't think that was the point of his life.

My take anyway.

[A human Being]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

And THIS was why I was banned from an active Christian Forum....when I realized the above
and started a thread, "Christ is too much in Christianity".

He pointed continually to the Father....my point was only..."Hey, guys.....what happened
to the Father?" And I was banned; ha!

I'm caught between finding that hysterical and bloody annoying.

Actually, I'm leaning towards the latter.

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

I don't recall Jesus "teaching people" the above...a rich guy asked him, and Jesus
told HIM what he needed to do, what he needed to hear in particular
...why? Bec he was so attached to his money.
Jesus' message in John 10:10 was that he came for us to live an abundant life..(abundance
in everything, joy, love, peace is my interpretation...all around abundance...not austerity
at all.)
And I have met Christians that think poverty is the sign of being a true Christian and
remain impoverished..and
put down anyone financially successful. A real enticement to follow Jesus...be homeless
and poor, struggling in life...hmm, don't think that was the point of his life.

My take anyway.

One of my favourite Jesus quotes (and I've got a few of them) is, 'For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?' Wealth and abundance aren't bad, in themselves, it's when you pursue material things to the exclusion of everything else that you'll 'lose your own soul.'

[Mathew James]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

And I have met Christians that think poverty is the sign of being a true Christian and
remain impoverished..and
put down anyone financially successful. A real enticement to follow Jesus...be homeless
and poor, struggling in life...hmm, don't think that was the point of his life.

My take anyway.

I do understand your point, but imo stuggling in this world is a good thing, in the end the poor and the meek will inherit the kingdom!

but if people want to chase after worldly things and all the comforts in it, good for them, after all didn't Jesus own a nice house.

mj

[PeteC-UK]

Hi Folks..

Human; "Are you familiar with the expression 'self-fulfilling prophecy'? Weren't other people also claiming to be the Messiah?"

AH BUT - make no mistake here - Yeshua is indeed the One that all those prophecies spoke of..For sure He is - the very Heavens declared it,just as those prophecies predicted..!!

The Star of Bethlehem,was a real astrological event - only it was predicted some 300 years before the event,and at a time when mankind suposedly had no telescopes or means of charting the stars so accurately..WE HAVE SUCH MEANS - modern software can be used to quite literally turn back time - rewind the stars in their orbits to any point in history..Now,we are slightly off with a date here,bt bare in mind that we measure far more accuratey now than ever before,and also,we have CHANGED OUR CALENDAR,the whole way of doing it,since those prohecies were made..

Christs birth was actually around the 5 March in the year 5BC as WE measure it today..Hence,Christ is actually a PISCES..Hence the symbol of the fish..Very important metaphysically,for Pisces is the end of the zodiacal material path,those who have already passed through the earlier Zodiacal incarnations,and have almost completed the first stages of natural evolution..We are like 4 years 9months out in our dating,that is all,and as I say,the changes noted above easily account for this say 5 years out of some 2000 - thats a pretty accurate timeline..

AT THAT TIME,5BC,the stars arranged into a truly spectaular conflagration,and it occurred right above Bethlehem,would be most prominant n that region..So rare,it happens once in literally MILLIONS OF YEARS - a Zodiacal sign is formed known as THE SEAL OF SOLOMAN..Thats very important also see,becuase this whole issue of the seal,metaphysically,deals specificaly with the merging of HUMAN and DIVINE presence - its all about ASCENTION - and of course Yeshua completes this path at the end of His physical life,ascends and returns at Will !! Indeed,it is only AFTER the full event that yeshua actually starts to convey the deeper teachings to the disciples..Before this it is parables..

We have prophecy - one amongst hundreds - and we have PHYSICAL CORROBORATION..The star event DID happen,only 5 yers ealrier than we think now..More startling than that is the prophecies themselves,the odds of succeeding..See,scientists ran statistical analysis based on just the first EIGHT that we know for sure Yeshua fulfilled..Things like bloodline,what tribe,place of birth..JUST EIGHT out of hundreds - and the odds turn out to be almost INCALCULABLE....Truly staggering..

For a man,any man,to be born ito those prophecised circumstances,specifically laid out hundreds of years before,the odds say that literally 1 in billions x bilions x billions..Indeed,ONLY EIGHT prophecies,and science stopped counting because simply,they realised that there had not even been enough people born EVER to balance the statistics..The odds are greater than 1 against ALL THE PEOPLE EVER BORN ENTIRE HISTORY !!

In other words,it is a certainty,if a man fullfilled just those EIGHT criteria,HE IS the Messiah of prophecy..Yeshua fullfilled many in His life directly,and many since could be interpreted in favour also..No doubt about it,the star event was a real world phenomena that has no credable accounting for it..HOW does ancient man predict this special arrangement when it only happens once in millions of years..No man had ever seen its like before,and nor will we for millions of more years to come - definately some Divine foresight apparant there - so all in all,it looks wholly authetinc..My mate yeshua,who is Christ,is the direct representative of the true source of Al Creation,Our Father..BUT,this true source is not the god of the jews found in the bible..

Jesus wasn't rated by the people in the neighbourhood in which he grew up apparently! They knew him best and didn't regard him as special!

Originally Posted by A human Being

Now don't get me wrong, I think there is inestimable value in Jesus' teachings. He emphasised love, compassion, non-judgment, repentance, and humility, amongst other things, and in my view he was right to do so. 'Get your own house in order,' he seems to be saying - and rightly so. Also, he points the way to the realisation of one's own divinity.

But it seems to me that an awful lot of Christians put the emphasis on the man, and not the teachings. They put Jesus on a pedestal, and act unworthy of him, and to me it just seems like passing the buck - 'I'm imperfect, but Jesus is perfect, so I'll look to him to save me,' they seem to be saying. They may pay lip-service to his teachings, but so often they don't appear to actually live it.

But heck, maybe I'm wrong - I'm open to different perspectives on the subject. Anyone got any thoughts?

Well yes, religion has surely polluted the waters of Christ's teachings. I have read the Bible cover to cover more than a few times in my day. And it's beyond me how anyone can read that book and just walk away with only, "I'm dirty sinner, I'm unworthy, I'm a worm and could never be like Jesus."

The book says so much more than all of that! Sure there is a "sin" problem; but the book says that if we confess that God remembers our sins no more and drops them in the sea of forgetfulness. So why all the nonsense about Jesus teetering on the edge of his throne in heaven, just chomping at the bit to bash mankind for their wrongs?

According to the book, the wrath of God is for those truly wicked people who do terrible wrong, never repent and laugh in the face of God and reject him! So why so many church people flinging messages of judgement at other "believers?"

I agree, Churchianity rules the day and it is a far cry from what a Christian should or would be..