Church Meditations- (Weird Stuff)

[Amilius777]

Baile-

I don't think Jesus has a necessarily different or better connection to God/Christ than the other big religious figures.

If we go down the list you got- Buddha, Patanjali, Shankara, Guru Nanak, Lao Tzu, Confucius, Moses, and of course Jesus.

Among these Souls who walked in earthly flesh, they either manifested or could touch that same one-infinite Christ Consciousness (Cosmic Christ, mind of God, Christ light),

It is not that Jesus is some sort of competitive figure among the others.

He was "a savior" of the world. He was a Christ, a messiah. He had a bigger role and job than many other prophets. A boss offers a worker a bigger job or raise depending on how much they are able to handle based on their past impressive work ethic. The Christian Saints say the same thing. God doesn't give you more than you can handle. That is why so many Saints and mystics of every religion seem to have bigger tests than we do. They are holding a higher vibrational energy in their bodies.

Jesus' job was more of an entire life-event; not so much about him as a person. He took it upon himself to live a perfect exemplarly life of the Christ Consciousness so others could pattern themselves after it for future generations and centuries.

But at the same time, the Christ Energy with or without Jesus is always at work in our lives and the lives of many other figures throughout history.

Jesus' historical imprint was simply a marker of human history from BC and AD. There are Christs always around. We are to be a Christ to others. That is what Christian means. Jesus was a Christ for the world; a "world savior".
There are various higher levels of the divine realms where this type of soul comes from. And when we say "higher" we shouldn't think in terms of beter or more successful. It is higher in the sense that it is transcendent, all connected, communal fellowship, oneness, above anything of human belief systems.

If Christ is that universal consciousness which is trying to save not only souls from their own egos but planetary histories, galaxies, Creation itself, I'd say Jesus tapped into that Thing and revealed in his own life what is going on ALL the time because Christ is beyond Time or one-time events. It is ALWAYS happening.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by Amilius777

.If Christ is that universal consciousness which is trying to save not only souls from their own egos but planetary histories, galaxies, Creation itself

Spirit is everything. Everything of both the material realm and spiritual realm is comprised of Spirit; is Spirit. There is nothing one can add to Spirit, to that which is already everything and complete. Anything you can dream of adding to that completeness, would already be an aspect of it. It already contains everything you can possibly imagine. There is nothing new under the sun.

Knowing that, why would something that is everything, and that requires nothing, need to save souls and galaxies? Save them from what? If Spirit is everything and complete, then nothing would require saving. It would already be saved. Or, it would simply be what it is, saved or unsaved, it doesn't matter because Spirit requires nothing more. "Needing to be saved" identifies a lack of some kind. But again Spirit, being complete already, requires nothing, now or in the future. As for "saving creation," in what scenario would the creation need to save itself? How would that even work?

There are two modes of dialogue that happen with topics of this sort. There are the on-point spiritual and occult observations as they apply to the individual's self-realization path: "He took it upon himself to live a perfect exemplary life of the Christ Consciousness so others could pattern themselves after it for future generations and centuries." This is the natural oil finish conversation; you can feel and observe the wood grain, and see what the object is actually made of.

Or these topics turn into what I call the new-age version of the same old religious conversation: identifying Jesus as Christ, and speaking of his life and death as a God-directed holy mission to save humanity and/or transform evolution. This to me is the gaudy gobs of thick paint conversation; the save-the-world Hollywood blockbuster-film version of the story; the saccharine-sweet Disney tale; the emotive and heart-rending musical score.

The religious tale of the hero who died to save us, in fact does us a disservice. It deflects the focus and responsibility away from where it's meant to be: not Jesus as Christ or the world needing saving; but the individual, and the individual's personal self-realization path to Spirit union. Jesus (and Buddha and others) completed what we're currently in the process of. That is the singular universal truth that applies to every human being, regardless of the religion or spiritual path they follow. The rest is just Christian-specific belief doctrine, particular to the Christian-oriented individual who chooses to believe it, and has nothing whatsoever to do with any reality other than that.

[Baile]

BTW, beliefs are fine, they are what they are and we all have them. I'm simply pointing out the difference between a universal spiritual discussion pertaining to human self-development topics that affect all of us; versus Christian-specific religious doctrine theorizing about the evolutionary purpose and intent of God and Creation Itself. The former is practical spirituality, the latter is faith-based religious speculation. When I discuss these topics, I'm only interested in the former, because that's as much as we can actually know, plus it's all that even matters.

[Amilius777]

Baile
I completely agree with you.
And I think maybe you are getting stuck behind that word "saved". Saved has a negative connotation as Richard Rohr and Eckhart Tolle would say.

Saved is very eastern. Liberated is more Jewish. And Enlightened is more Eastern.

They all mean the same thing which is "reunion with God". Self-realized is also the same thing because the person has learned to readjust the aspects of Self to their proper place. The True Self (divine-self, Soul) is the state where the individual acts and thinks from, whereas the false self or ego takes it's place below the true Self and is it's instrument. That is self-realization, divine union, etc.

It is being liberated from one's ego, attachments, passions, and ultimately their karma.

Unfortunately Jesus has been turned into the Blockbuster "save the world by my death" thing. And I don't believe in that whole thing. I may need to reword what I was trying to say.

Jesus is a "world savior" or "world liberator", "universal Enlightened master".
He wasn't just another great spiritual teacher like ones we have today who don't get me wrong they know more about the Self than most of us do. No one taught them, Life did. But there are degrees and grades of Spirits in the spiritual World. There are more than we can count.

Majority of highly evolved souls finish Earthly incarnations and continue on in the Spiritual world for further evolution. You know this already. We've talked about it in other topics. Very rarely does a soul choose to continue their evolution in the Earth if they don't need to. They do this out of compassion and mercy for humanity. Most of us continue on in Spirit for our "master Degree" and never come back. There is a level where the soul probably can not ever come back. It is a grid of power equivalent to "The Angelic".
Anyway, these saintly spiritual souls who come back are the many Saints of history- St. Francis, Padre Pio, Theresa of Avila, Anthony of Padua, Kabir, Shankara, Nichiren Buddha, and Sai Baba of Shirdi to name a few.

They are of many diverse religions. They posses miraculous powers due to the intense Religious life they have dedicated themselves to and can exhibit deep connections to God. What they necessarily believe or say isn't as important as to the Lives they live. They are here for their own development into their True Selves and also for the rejuvenation of Faith and patterns of spiritual enlightenment. They are "the Saints' because they give their lives totally to suffering humanity; and many of them are known to have suffered for the sake of others.

Jesus or Buddha were like them but even higher. They had a bigger "job description" just as a boss levels up his worker with the offer of a bigger position but with more responsibility. The soul can either take it or leave it. If they leave it they continue on in the divine realms. No judgment from God. Earth life is so hard as it is. That is why majority of Saints ascend (ascended masters) and did what they came to do. St. Francis probably won't be coming back. But there is that even rarer type of soul like Christ or Buddha who comes as a savior, or as a Christ, a Redeemer.

Their life is not only for uplifting the masses of humanity, their life is an entire testimony to the Truth of the universe; the Christ Consciousness.

Jesus "died for the sins of the world" doesn't mean anything unless someone tries to understand what that meant. Jesus suffered and died while finding a Way back to God for his people and future generations and humanity. He went to death as a loving service or sacrifice in his mission to attain a oneness with the Father and forgiveness of others. His way is the higher Way of Grace (positive karma) - a way out of our self-created sufferings which can only be done by Forgiving all those who wrong us, and surrending our self-constricted ego to our bigger Spiritual Self. All of this is symbolized in the Cross. It is not about the blood, guts, and mess of the whole thing like you see in Mel Gibson's movie. The movie has wonderful drama and beautiful depiction of Jesus' dedication for others and loving until the end, but the film also goes back to that literal fundamentalist mentality. I am sure the crucifixion was a terrible ordeal that Christ went through but READ the Gospels yourself. They don't dwell on the blood and suffering. THey are a small paragraph in every Gospel and the rest is all about his teachings. They actually dwell more on his resurrection than death.

That is just how Jesus went about it, how he had to go about it. It was a divine ministry that would benefit the world entirely. But did the world become less sinful or a paradise like in the Hollywood movies? No. Because that is not what Jesus' death and resurrection was about. He was bodily resurrected because his Soul was at a level where he could command the things of the natural world to obey his consciousness. He probably isn't the only one who could have done this, but he did it and it was allowed by God for the sake of the world to see that "death is an illusion." The reasons for what God allows and what thoughtforms he wants dwelt upon is entirely His/Her/It's Will and purposes. Why didnt Buddha come back? Does that make him less or more? No. Everyone and thing is a different instrument of the Divine.

So reread my post from earlier Baile. His death and resurrection has nothing to do with the whole "save the world" or "express lane to the Afterlife" lol. That is what has ruined Christianity big time along with Islam. They have become these religions that are about Express Lanes to Heaven instead of having Heaven here and now on Earth as the great prophets all taught; the minor ones, the major ones, and the Divine ones.