What skin is it off anybody's hiney if love is the cause of all?

[hybrid]

Originally Posted by TzuJanLi

Greetings..

..
"To call into one word", that would apply equally to the expressions: "Love is all", "God is all", or "awareness is all", isn't that so..

yes but people use this abstraction to express their experience and not to use their words gainst them

maybe i don't want to argue, hybrid..

hahahaahahaaahahaha

maybe i just want a civil discussion, but.. when civil discussions don't go the way you think they should, you begin the hostilities.. just sayin'..

Be well..

this is an example of a post that provoke hostility

[hybrid]

Originally Posted by Gem

YI think what it boils down to is, the truth needs precedence over everything else, myself included, for a personal preference is fine and good, but it's a damned thing if it rules my life... (hence the saying holier than thou?)

holier than thou are self righteous people.
for someone who can make distinction between a universal truth from personal preference ( to know which one to impose or not to somebody else) , that's smarter than thou. lols

is the I-thought the lover or the beloved? if it is an object who is the subject?

[Silver]

Originally Posted by hybrid

my apologies SG

I don't think there'll be any butter melting in your mouth anytime soon, the way you speak to people in general.

[hybrid]

i don't know what you meant exactly but it sounds like an insult.

Originally Posted by Silvergirl

I don't think there'll be any butter melting in your mouth anytime soon, the way you speak to people in general.

and the energy smells bitterness

Greetings..

Originally Posted by hybrid

yes but people use this abstraction to express their experience and not to use their words gainst them

Hi hybrid: This is exactly what my post references, if you don't like what someone posts, this is the result, not civil discussions to resolve differences.. you don't even try, you just blame others..

Originally Posted by hybrid

hahahaahahaaahahaha

Same as my previous comment..

Originally Posted by hybrid

this is an example of a post that provoke hostility

No, it is a post that is exasperated with your antics, with your unwillingness to rely on civil discourse to explore a more harmonious reality..

You have stated on multiple occasions that you do not like me, so.. i will ask you, do you have any intention of a civil discussion with me?

Be well..

[hybrid]

ho hum.... as usual i have to spell it out for you...

look tzu, that's a loaded question.

Originally Posted by TzuJanLi

i will ask you, do you have any intention of a civil discussion with me?

Be well..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question

Greetings..

Originally Posted by hybrid

ho hum.... as usual i have to spell it out for you...

look tzu, that's a loaded question.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question

Hi hybrid: no, that was not a "loaded question".. i stated a fact, that you have stated on multiple occasions that you do not like me.. and, i'm really not interested in whether you do or not.. then, i asked a straight-up question, "do you have any intention of a civil discussion with me?".. i am interested in the answer, so that i will know what to expect.. i keep initiating openings into potentially civil discussions about ways to move toward a more harmonious reality.. so, i'll ask again, do you have any intention of having civil discussions with me?.. this question is not linked to a false premise, either you do or you don't.. the question only pertains to a future event, with no past condition implied at all, it does not assume that you haven't had civil discussions.. i am only interested in this point forward..

Be well..

Originally Posted by hybrid

that's what i said, loving one self is a phrase that can mean a lot of things.
but to literally love one self as in telling your self " i love myself, i love myself, i love myself" is ridiculous.

I'm drive-by commenting, don't have much time these days to get deep into the flow of conversation. What I'm writing may be completely irrelevant to what you're saying hybrid, it just sparked a creative response and I thought I'd share (aren't you all lucky?)

But I think there's something to systems like NLP and subconscious belief structures. If someone has a lot of emotional self-loathing and internalized a negative self-image then the thought "I love myself" never occurs and there is even more emotional weight creating the aversion to saying out loud the statement "I love myself." Psychological disposition is composed of a system of self-supporting belief structures and interpretation schemas. The thought/interpretation "I'm a failure" selectively looks at the world and focuses only on the evidence which supports the belief/disposition and actively ignores evidence to the contrary. There are several feedback loops or self-maintaining systems at play. Selective attention to focus on belief-supporting evidence. Emotional inertia and indulgence in passivity, meaning it takes real effort to fight the orientation of the emotional investment. Then there is one's own identity and self-image, how a person understands themselves. When something comes up to challenge this state, the person begins to enter into existential crisis. "Who am I, if I'm not a failure? Who am I if I'm not a loser?" So our identity is deeply tied into these deeply emotionally embedded belief/interpretation schemas.

For someone who is averted to the thought "I love myself", the forced physical act of saying "I love myself", first dead-pan and then exploring putting positive emotion behind it, actively combats the feedback loop and challenges the belief/interpretation schema. The flow of energy that went into giving life and support to the negative belief gets retracted, the neural pathway is interrupted, a person can feel numb and disoriented because they are forcing themselves into a different psychological state. Plato's talks about this phenomena in the Meno when the people who undergo true socratic inquiry into their beliefs become numb as they challenge the underpinings of what they've emotionally invested themselves into. The numbness is a retraction of investment, entering neutrality and the crisis of "I don't know what I believe anymore, who i am..."

This kind of challenging the psychological molasses we are stuck in appears to be a kind of affirmation, but I propose its completely different than an affirmation. An affirmation (in spiritual circles) is used to affirm or re-enforce a positive belief, but I've seen the practice taken to extremes of wishful thinking. What I'm focusing on is the opposite of affirmation, the challenging of what we're invested in to reach a truly neutral position. The pendulum does have to swing past middle in order to find middle.

I'm speaking from personal experience here as I've been a depressive and have had to work through (still am working through) many of my negatively oriented belief schemas. Tapes play over and over in our minds that we're not even aware of. We hear the mental chatter, the thoughts, but the thoughts are tied to beliefs and beliefs are tied to emotional orientation and emotions select actions, etc... If you are in any way averted to performing the following act, then you would benefit from performing it: Stand in front of your mirror (preferably naked) and look at the image and tell that image "I love you" over and over again, but each time changing the nuance and character used to express the phrase. "I love you." "_I_ love you". "I LOOOOVVEEE You." "I Love YOU." etc. etc. Make it silly expressions, heart-felt expressions, etc. If you can't do that when you're alone then you are caught in a negatively oriented, self-maintaining, emotionally sucking psychological state. If you've never done it before, DO IT as a psychological experiment. As you do it, watch and feel how each expression affects you.

That experiment is just one example of a system of activities that I call "Tuning". (I don't know what it's called by other systems, its something I've stumbled onto myself and it has been the most powerful means of personal empowerment I've come across.) In the activity of Tuning, you explore the full range of self-expression, fighting past the aversions, awaking dormant/inactive neural pathways, challenging our default identity, and empowering us with a broader repertoire of self-expression enabling a sense of truer self. The concept of Tuning can be applied to everything. You body posture. Try out all postures, then stretch and contort yourself, relax, explore the body postures again, all the while listening internally to how you feel and what emotion is generated from the posture. Vocally, practice saying words and singing, exploring a wide range from silly high pitches squeaky voices to deep resonant chanting. In breaking free of your default expressions you are breaking out of the mental ruts which disempower you and prevent you from being able to choose a different way of being.

The person that practices anything resembling what I call "Tuning" is far more dynamic than a person who clings to their aversions of self-exploration. Repeating "I love myself" over and over again can be an effective means of tuning, challenging our aversions and breaking free of the ruts we fall into. Being able to say "I love myself" without feeling uncomfortable or awkward is the first step to making the statement a reality.

Sorry hybrid if this has no relation to what you were saying. I had to honor the creative spark and capture the thoughts (as well indulge in avoiding school work).

*back to lurking*

Well said Top.

We all have our pet definitions of love - but it seems we can all agree, if we are honest, that what we point to when we are pointing at it is opening, in whatever nuance of complexity or simplicity we have in mind.

The implications of this are staggeringly vast to me when I think about it.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by hybrid

holier than thou are self righteous people.
for someone who can make distinction between a universal truth from personal preference ( to know which one to impose or not to somebody else) , that's smarter than thou. lols

is the I-thought the lover or the beloved? if it is an object who is the subject?

It is like you hold a thought, all other thoughts aside, and a space opens up which we'd call something like empty mind, but I can not see a mind, I see thought... and in front of me see kinds of things, love is way of seeing, but what sees is behind me and sees right through me.