Observation

[Gem]

I notice the thread has one star, which is vote of "Terrible". I am very proud of that rating and appreciate the sense of humour of the voter teehee.

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by Ground

Noticing myself is noticing emptiness of truth. Now do you want me to ascribe a truth or a non-truth to what is a non-truth?

Just because you might observe your own nature being emptiness of truth, there is still you with a personality and function in this world to notice yourself. Don't let my asking disturb your emptiness. Unless of course your personality is non functioning and your walking around connecting to the world like some kind of zombie.

Things happen and are neither one nor different from awareness. Awareness' reactivity cannot be predicted and is beyond ordinary categories.

Rules are the province of ordinary mind. Authenticity is the province of awareness

.

So is kindness/kind hearted part of your authenticity and awareness of you being you? Lets just drop the rules you apply to your ground of being relating for a moment and perhaps get more in touch with your essence which is inclusive of many things you portray and emit to the world as a human being.

[Ground]

Originally Posted by naturesflow

Just because you might observe your own nature being emptiness of truth, there is still you with a personality and function in this world to notice yourself. Don't let my asking disturb your emptiness. Unless of course your personality is non functioning and your walking around connecting to the world like some kind of zombie.

Hmh ... you don't seem to accept my way of expressing myself linguistically/verbally. Should I express myself as yourself?

Originally Posted by naturesflow

So is kindness/kind hearted part of your authenticity and awareness of you being you? Lets just drop the rules you apply to your ground of being relating for a moment and perhaps get more in touch with your essence which is inclusive of many things you portray and emit to the world as a human being.

"Now do you want me to ascribe a truth or a non-truth to what is a non-truth?"
you did not answer that question.
if you replied 'truth' I could not say anything since there is no truth because nothing exists without imputation.
if you replied 'Non-truth' I could say: My heart is full of boundless hatred and boundless kindness.

[naturesflow]

[quote]

Originally Posted by Ground

Hmh ... you don't seem to accept my way of expressing myself linguistically/verbally. Should I express myself as yourself?

It was a simple question that you seem to want to avoid answering more directly..So it has nothing to do with your way/my way, that's just your own perception coming into the picture, of what was, a simple question, that could have been answered as yes or no. :)

[Gem]

Originally Posted by naturesflow

Thankyou Gem. There is so much wisdom and awareness in this for me right now. I appreciate your sharing the depth of understanding you have obviously gained and practiced to find for yourself.

Yep it's all through the real lived experience which includes deliberate practice, and it's not that I'm saying anything 'true' - it just how you speak to me which leads me to mention what might be meaningful - so you take it one way as it means to you and someone else might see it meaningful in a different way. I mean, the conversation isn't producing a fixed knowledge with is 'right'; the exact contrary is true, it produces meaning which is transformational.

I am observing myself reading this and I am aware of a small emotional "charge" moving through me as I read this. I have realized in this moment, that my physical body is catching up to me as I know myself now, if that makes sense. That was the realization reading through your offering and awareness. When you have been disconnected to yourself in everyway, it kind of makes sense that you "get used" to the nature of coming back into yourself deeper physically. I think your mention of the takers, hit home in me also, so allowing that movement to take me deeper into that place feeling this.

Its interesting this is not really something I notice because I simply just give for no reason other than just being me, so what you shared has opened up something important for me to observe and notice in myself with this in relation to others in the shared space.

Yep, you are yourself, and a generosity flows from that - and to me an ideal way of interacting would be through generosity and appreciation. I believe these to together bring about abundance so there is a lot to share.

I could have not mentioned the whole observation in me but I just wanted to share how in your open sharing of your own experience's, I was able to gain something important to reflect upon deeper in me.

I find that rewarding, because it means there is understanding of this whole topic I'm raising... which can't be comprehended in a 'brain like way'.


As I like to say, "Real learning is transformation".

A little bizarre hey...

That's a good thing.

[Ground]

Originally Posted by naturesflow

It was a simple question ...

to which I responded simply straightforward from my perspective

Originally Posted by naturesflow

that you seem to want to avoid answering more directly..

Let's put it that way: my answer did not meet your expectation which is why you don't accept it.
Maybe better to ask people that do provide the answer you are expecting?

Originally Posted by naturesflow

So it has nothing to do with your way/my way, that's just your own perception coming into the picture, of what was, a simple question, that could have been answered as yes or no. :)

I have tried to express why your question cannot be answered with yes or no, i.e. I could only answer it with yes or no if I would intentionally and effortfully apply ordinary mind and even then I would have to randomly select yes or no. Having only the two options 'yes' and 'no' but having no clue what 'yes' means in this context and no clue what 'no' means in this conctext how could I decide?

So equanimity or evenness naturally are present without effort and leave up to ordinary minds questions like 'Am I this?' and 'Am I that?' and all that importance they attach to questions like these because they attach importance to self which appears as if inherently existing while it does not so exist.

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by Ground

to which I responded simply straightforward from my perspective


Let's put it that way: my answer did not meet your expectation which is why you don't accept it.
Maybe better to ask people that do provide the answer you are expecting?

I have no expectations at all. In my follow on discussion I wasn't holding you in this way, so I am not sure where you found this in you to mention this.

I have tried to express why your question cannot be answered with yes or no, i.e. I could only answer it with yes or no if I would intentionally and effortfully apply ordinary mind and even then I would have to randomly select yes or no. Having only the two options 'yes' and 'no' but having no clue what 'yes' means in this context and no clue what 'no' means in this conctext how could I decide?

I am sure you know in yourself whether you are kindhearted in your intent towards yourself and other life. As you would know if your intent towards life is one of "I don't give a damn" about others. I am certain you would observe your own nature interacting and being towards others and yourself. But I understand if you were to observe and mention this, it might portray you as actually having a heart in all that awareness you speak and that might not come across as holding your position as you wish to be portrayed and understood as.

So equanimity or evenness naturally are present without effort and leave up to ordinary minds questions like 'Am I this?' and 'Am I that?' and all that importance they attach to questions like these because they attach importance to self which appears as if inherently existing while it does not so exist.

I think you have taken the simplicity of my asking into something more than it needed to be. Of course I understand that you don't have to label yourself this or that. But an awareness of loving kindness is something most Buddhist teachings do cover and express as something that can be noticed. Evenness or equanimity is allowed to express itself in feeling and observation of itself heart centred.

[A human Being]

Originally Posted by Gem

I notice the thread has one star, which is vote of "Terrible". I am very proud of that rating and appreciate the sense of humour of the voter teehee.

I notice quite a few threads are being given 1-star ratings recently, I'm guessing it's the same person who's responsible for all of them. Anyway, I found the thread very illuminating and I gave it 5 stars, and I salute your ability to have a sense of humour about it - I find it frickin' tiresome and petty, quite honestly.

(Which, I know, says everything about me and nothing about the person administering the ratings.)

[Ground]

Originally Posted by naturesflow

I am sure you know in yourself whether you are kindhearted in your intent towards yourself and other life.

I have no clue what you are talking about.

Can you please elaborate?

What does the expression 'I am kindhearted in my intent towards myself and other life' mean to you?

Please give examples of everyday manifestations of that what it means to you.

Also if you would please comment on permanence and transience because the single characterization 'kindhearted' does not leave room for change and transience and thus appears to be a kind of metaphysical and/or essentialist view 'kindheartedness existed in all times and will exist interminably'.

Originally Posted by naturesflow

... As you would know if your intent towards life is one of "I don't give a damn" about others. I am certain you would observe your own nature interacting and being towards others and yourself. But I understand if you were to observe and mention this, it might portray you as actually having a heart in all that awareness you speak and that might not come across as holding your position as you wish to be portrayed and understood as.

If I had to label my outlook towards 'life and others' I would label it 'rational'. Rationality and equanimity or evenness go well together whereas emotionality is incompatible.

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by Ground

I have no clue what you are talking about.

Can you please elaborate?

What does the expression 'I am kindhearted in my intent towards myself and other life' mean to you?

Please give examples of everyday manifestations of that what it means to you.

Also if you would please comment on permanence and transience because the single characterization 'kindhearted' does not leave room for change and transience and thus appears to be a kind of metaphysical and/or essentialist view 'kindheartedness existed in all times and will exist interminably'.

Example ok..

Kind hearted firstly, can be viewed as an awareness of self in its own actions, that doesn't require one to attach to it as a fixed reference point that isn't open for change and the transience nature of itself in so many ways of being itself..

SO getting back to an example.

A lady in front of you while your out walking, falls over, she starts to cry, she tells you she isn't hurt and she is ok physically... She begins to cry deeply and stays on the ground, not moving but crying really deep and hard.

Describe in detail how you respond to her and this situation. (Don't leave out any details and if you don't know how you would respond, just imagine how you would if it were to occur.)