The spiritual conversation is difficult, and therefore, skillful

I'll try until my account get's deleted as requested.
I found that in my honesty There's just too much people taking offence.

My questions about the validity of the chakra's was a dreadful experience. A few asked how I viewed them, Most just got angry and wanted to know Why I wanted to kill my self in the conscious removal of them.

Helping a lightworker see that what she felt is part of a natural human experience also got me cornered into the box of trying to stifle an emerging soul..

A quick dive into the non-duality subforum had me in full mirroring sociapth, narcisistic jerk like behaviour in which I myself had to ask the moderators to clean up big time as it was just to awful to continue...

Not to mention the discussions over on the buddhist forum where everybody seems to Know what Guatama the Buddha meant. And then start disregarding the most basic sutta's as insignificant..

To me this forum seems to be for most an escape into a fantasy realm fueled by old-age stories of light and love. As soon as you get real.. Discussions ends and assumptions start to rear their ugly heads..

Continued honesty (in my humble opinion) will get someone cornered and even "removed/suspended" ahum...

So...
Apart for my enjoyment in heated debate, disagreements and internetdrama there's not much "spiritual" clarity to be found here. Or any of the forums for that matter.

It may even be just me and the way I carry myself on-line which feels off, because it couldn't possibly reflect all of me..

With Love
Eelco
(who is a big black sabbath fan and if he had to pick a favorit guitarist Tommy Iommi would come as close as they get.)

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by catsquotl

I'll try until my account get's deleted as requested.
I found that in my honesty There's just too much people taking offence.

My questions about the validity of the chakra's was a dreadful experience. A few asked how I viewed them, Most just got angry and wanted to know Why I wanted to kill my self in the conscious removal of them.

Helping a lightworker see that what she felt is part of a natural human experience also got me cornered into the box of trying to stifle an emerging soul..

A quick dive into the non-duality subforum had me in full mirroring sociapth, narcisistic jerk like behaviour in which I myself had to ask the moderators to clean up big time as it was just to awful to continue...

Not to mention the discussions over on the buddhist forum where everybody seems to Know what Guatama the Buddha meant. And then start disregarding the most basic sutta's as insignificant..

To me this forum seems to be for most an escape into a fantasy realm fueled by old-age stories of light and love. As soon as you get real.. Discussions ends and assumptions start to rear their ugly heads..

Continued honesty (in my humble opinion) will get someone cornered and even "removed/suspended" ahum...

So...
Apart for my enjoyment in heated debate, disagreements and internetdrama there's not much "spiritual" clarity to be found here. Or any of the forums for that matter.

It may even be just me and the way I carry myself on-line which feels off, because it couldn't possibly reflect all of me..

With Love
Eelco
(who is a big black sabbath fan and if he had to pick a favorit guitarist Tommy Iommi would come as close as they get.)

For what it is worth, I totally agree with you, but wish you would reconsider.

Can you ever appreciate how difficult it has been for me too? I mean heck, I am really 'old school' when it comes to Chakras, Kundalini and all that...tried countless times to explain how Chakras are not physical...they cannot be turned on and off like a lightswitch and aren't even all 'rainbow coloured'...but of course, nobody else on here has read the Hatha Yoga Pridipika by Swami Svamarama *sigh*

My knowledge is based on stuff that was written thousands of years ago by all those dudes who kinda "invented" Chakras...suffice to say, I don't visit that forum anymore.

OMG...the Non-Duality forum...don't even get me started there...but it's apparent they've never had to deal with a full-on Advaita Vedantin before who shows up going "so tell me again, who is this "I" that you "ARE" and what "owns" the mind to say "my mind is my enemy?" and "what is the "enemy" you speak of if NOT the mind itself which, of course isn't Brahman anyway"?...yup they went into full-on meltdown.

Also, I'm pretty close to Vajrayana Buddhism in my beliefs, which would go down faster than a lead balloon in the Buddhist forum, so I usually stay away.

I doubt they've ever seen a "real" Tantric Hindu on this forum before. lol

Meanwhile, gonna miss the chat about Vishistadvaita...was looking forward to it.

My favourite guitarist is Steve Vai:

For the Love of God
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiTXGswyAls

[Raziel]

Originally Posted by catsquotl

I'll try until my account get's deleted as requested.
I found that in my honesty There's just too much people taking offence.

My questions about the validity of the chakra's was a dreadful experience. A few asked how I viewed them, Most just got angry and wanted to know Why I wanted to kill my self in the conscious removal of them.

Helping a lightworker see that what she felt is part of a natural human experience also got me cornered into the box of trying to stifle an emerging soul..

A quick dive into the non-duality subforum had me in full mirroring sociapth, narcisistic jerk like behaviour in which I myself had to ask the moderators to clean up big time as it was just to awful to continue...

Not to mention the discussions over on the buddhist forum where everybody seems to Know what Guatama the Buddha meant. And then start disregarding the most basic sutta's as insignificant..

To me this forum seems to be for most an escape into a fantasy realm fueled by old-age stories of light and love. As soon as you get real.. Discussions ends and assumptions start to rear their ugly heads..

Continued honesty (in my humble opinion) will get someone cornered and even "removed/suspended" ahum...

So...
Apart for my enjoyment in heated debate, disagreements and internetdrama there's not much "spiritual" clarity to be found here. Or any of the forums for that matter.

It may even be just me and the way I carry myself on-line which feels off, because it couldn't possibly reflect all of me..

With Love
Eelco
(who is a big black sabbath fan and if he had to pick a favorit guitarist Tommy Iommi would come as close as they get.)

Offence is a tactic I find.

Many things offend me but I don't go nuclear because I realise that it's my offence - not actually offensive.

Beta males get me going (although I in no way consider myself Alpha) because it's often just a ploy to get ladies through faking opinion.
There is a spiritual version of this whereby scripture or buzz words are used but everything else posted is filled with a clear bias - perhaps the poster needs it to be true but their need doesn't outweigh reality to anyone but them.


I won't dig up anything thats happened to me here but if I were to never correct misinterpretations of what I have said very clearly I can bet that the thread would stay as is - correcting said misinterpretations often end up with mods involvement - convenient to the person painting me in a certain light.

It's the whole "punch a nazi" thing - doesn't matter if a person is not actually a nazi - only the virtue of the person attacking.

It's a shame if you go since I feel that there are likely lurkers who benefit from the more down to earth, honest or sincere posts despite the demands & wails of the many disciples of various schools who would like you to be quiet.

I'll pop in and out until everyone is using the aforementioned offence tactic - by which time it is essentially an echo chamber.

People of all faiths have made valid points to me - if something is a fair point - it just is.

I have no dog in the fight since it's pretty clear that it's all just guesswork.

.

[Shivani Devi]

Well, seeing as how we are talking about guitarists now, spiritual metal and obscure meaning...

My favourite guitarist is really a 'toss-up' between Steve Vai and Jon Petrucci of Dream Theater.

Now, this song should provide inspiration about honesty and being true to yourself despite criticism from others...enjoy it:

As I Am - Dream Theater
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dx4sh8FXZzA

[Raziel]

Rather than being nice and comfortable, this sort of discourse is truthful, and that can be discomforting because each one faces their own home truths. No one faces the home truths of anyone else, so psychoanalysing, accusing, and 'you language' in general does no good for anyone, and only presents risks of harm. Caveat being, complimentary remarks can be encouraging.

As we speak more deeply on the spiritual dimension of us, we are bound to hit on obstacles which hold emotional contents in ourselves, which makes it a difficult topic, so it requires our best skills, both in how we transverse our inner worlds, and in our expressed conversation.

It would appear that during our conversation the above is not exactly true - home truths can be shared & faced by others.

Perspectives & experiences can unite - even from different ideology (rock & metal music may be a factor).

.

[Raziel]

Originally Posted by angelic star

It's hard to go Carpe diem these days. Given how impatient people have become and there is such hurry with everything, carpe diem is more like meditation in today's world. Most people might as well start from there.

I'd see them as opposites personally.

Meditation being still self reflection or me time - carpet diem being available whenever it fits.

The rushing around is carrot on a stick mentality but you can have multiple goals at the same time - its making use of gaps or opportunities that aren't signposted but exist.

I chose to over share in an interview once - I don't put on air or graces as its living a lie that I can't keep up - the over sharing got me a better job!

Thinking about it that's happened twice - years apart.

Being a parent I'm essentially a Butler for a 2 year old (as well as chef, barber, wiper, cleaner, chauffeur, coach & punching bag - plus Father) but I try to keep an aspect of myself for later on or during the gaps to do my own thing.

.

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by Raziel

It would appear that during our conversation the above is not exactly true - home truths can be shared & faced by others.

Perspectives & experiences can unite - even from different ideology (rock & metal music may be a factor).

.

Yes, rock and metal music...old fred and ginger musicals...potatoes and tomatoes....

I'm a very complex and multi-faceted personality and quite the lateral thinker, so I am mentally flexible.

However and that being said...if I am to be totally honest, there's also a 'superficial spirituality' and a more deeper, involved one occurring here...two different levels of it.

All this love, light, pretty rainbows and pink unicorns is totally unrealistic and one must fully embrace their shadow as well, and not demonise it or consider it 'evil' in order to have the total and all-rounded true spiritual experience.

Like I said before, I'll go and watch really heavy Tantric stuff (which is not all about sex as a common held New-Age belief), study Swami Satyananda (Vigyan Bhairav), get into some deep Shamanic trance journeys, listen to Mahamrityunjaya Mantra...come back on here and it's like I am in 'spiritual kindergarten' or I'm eating a slice of bread after having a delicious 3-course meal and I'm like "what the...?"

yes, dark is the hero
side that fights for

[Raziel]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

However and that being said...if I am to be honest, there's also a 'superficial spirituality' and a more deeper, involved one occurring here...two levels of it.

All this love, light, pretty rainbows and pink unicorns is totally unrealistic and one must fully embrace their shadow as well, and not demonise it or consider it 'evil' in order to have the total and all-rounded true spiritual experience.

Like I said before, I'll go and watch really heavy Tantric stuff (which is NOT all about sex as a common held belief), study Swami Satyananda, get into some deep Shamanic trance journeys, listen to Mahamrityunjaya Mantra...come back on here and it's like I am in 'spiritual kindergarten' or I'm eating a slice of bread after having a delicious 3-course meal and I'm like "what the...?"

How strange!

I almost raised this point but I didn't want to encourage "Freud" since that's where it gets taken.

Shadow work is something I did on my own without hearing about it.

Later I heard Michael Tsarion (Irish chap) point it out in his unique way & thought ha!

I talked about not fearing my dark half in my earliest postings about two years ago. I treat it as a demon that I feed my enemies to.
Its protected me when perhaps I should have come to harm because I looked someone square in the eyes & dared them to let him out.

I'm really soft natured but you become a target - I realised that we have anger & aggression for a reason, but not to allow it to control me.
The comprise with my dark half is that I let it be dark when there is justification.

I don't bury it & pretend it doesn't exist. Its quite addictive so you have to be careful but my destruction means it doesn't get fed at all (how I see it).

There are those that feel that without men there would be no aggression in the world, having seen the shenanigans between arguing ladies I can attest that it would still exist, perhaps on a crueller & personal basis but it would arise ...

We all have it - its not something that exists to lock away fovever ...

What would be the point?

I saw a documentary on Yazidi women soldiers who are going after Isis & it's obvious that the same energy (multiplied by a million) is required to face true horror. They haven't became celibate hippies, they decided to get militant & take responsibility for their own liberation.

.

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by Raziel

How strange!

I almost raised this point but I didn't want to encourage "Freud" since that's where it gets taken.

Shadow work is something I did on my own without hearing about it.

Later I heard Michael Tsarion (Irish chap) point it out in his unique way & thought ha!

I talked about not fearing my dark half in my earliest postings about two years ago. I treat it as a demon that I feed my enemies to.

Its protected me when perhaps I should have come to harm because I looked someone square in the eyes & dared them to let him out.

I'm really soft natured but you become a target - I realised that we have anger & aggression for a reason, but not to allow it to control me.

The comprise with my dark half is that I let it be dark when there is justification.

I don't bury it & pretend it doesn't exist.

Its quite addictive so you have to be careful but my destruction means it doesn't get fed at all (how I see it).

In a situation whereby I am incorrect I have eliminated an option via that process, I don't get caught up in the error. On to the next option & see if that works ..


There are those that feel that without men there would be no aggression in the world, having seen the shenanigans between arguing ladies it would still exist ...

We all have it - its not something that exists to lock away fovever ...

What would be the point?

.

Let them bring up Freud...you counter with Jung.

Then, if you really wanna drive it home, you serve up Nietzsche for dessert.

My "dark half' isn't about negative emotions or demons or anything like that. It's about exploring the subconscious, diving deep into that ocean...the veiled mysteries of life and just being totally esoteric...believing that "God' and "Satan'...'Good' and "Evil'...'Dark and Light' are two sides of the same coin and I wouldn't be a non-dualist otherwise...

Even so, like you said before...there's always a dot of white in the black and a dot of black in the white...so there are no absolutes within the nature of duality.

The snake swallowing its tail is what encircles it:



Let me know if I'm going too deep for you.