WHOM TO WORSHIP SHIVA or KRISHNA ?

[neil]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Threatening you? We just had to make it seem that way so you'd be more open to direct communication with us - we do whatever needs to be done; even testing your inner strength and faith in the face of your darkest fears and without even as much as a warning!

You say that you are SO full of love and yet, where true love abides, evil cannot, so what is wrong with this whole picture, Neil?

What you saw as a threat was us trying to draw your power out to fight us; to see what you are really made of.... What a total disappointment! Thing is, you are no threat to us, so why would we even bother with you? You think very highly of yourself, don't you? Too bad we don't share that sentiment.

Shivani/Dianne is going to bed now... When she wakes up, you can have her back... But know this and know it well; we never do ANYTHING against her will and wishes... I wonder where that Ajay character got to? We haven't finished our game yet.

Goodnight and sweet dreams.

for those forum members that are following this thread, I will be directing my response to this post to the spiritual beings that are speaking to me through Shivani, via PM.

[ajay00]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

For example, I see Lord Shiva as God... Now, being omnipotent, omnipresent, omniscient, etc God can appear as anything He/She wants to and for ME, Lord Shiva appears as the being that Ajay calls "Shankar", even though I am ALSO aware He/She can appear as a Pillar of Light (Jyotir Lingam), as a Mountain like Kailasha or Arunachala, as a Divine teacher/Adi Guru like Dakshinamurthy or Lakulisha... I could go on and on (infinitely, in fact) ... The unity in diversity that I see is ALL Shiva (expressed through Shakti). There is no beginning or end TO Shiva!

See, the point is that the Vedas only describe the Shivalingam as representing a pillar of light. This is what Swami Vivekananda also states, and Vivekananda is a highly respected saint in India, with his centres in every district in India and his words are often quoted by Indian prime ministers .

The former Prime Minister Rajiv Gandhi declared his birthday as 'Youth Day' in India.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swami_Vivekananda

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

For Ajay, Lord Shiva and Shankar are two SEPARATE entities and this is DUALITY, not UNITY... Now, I have NO problems letting Ajay believe what he does (that Lord Shiva is limited to ONLY appearing as a beam of light and NOTHING else) ...UNTIL he starts criticising me for believing what I do, misquoting the Vedas in the process then questioning my faith if I don't buy the mistranslated and misquoted version... Then my gloves come off.. Unity, love and tolerance be damned! How can one be or remain thus under those circumstances?

These are all stated by Swami Vivekananda , who is considered as a great scholar in his own right, by many Hindu scholars themselves. Same too with Swami Sivananda.

To declare yourself as higher than Vivekananda in scholarship is akin to daydreaming.

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

In the past two months, Ajay has been recruiting online for a doomsday cult.

Even Hinduism, is a doomsday cult as it teaches about Pralaya at the end of the kali yuga. Same with Christianity and Islam, with talk about 'Judgement Day' or Qiyamat.

The Kali Yuga is full of tamas, and tamas is associated with destruction.

However the focus of the Brahmakumaris is not on destruction, but on warding off destruction by creating positive energies and vibrations.

It is the negative energies and vibes that bring about such destruction.

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

I have counted 15 posts mentioning the Prajapita Brahmakumaris with links to their website and events since the beginning of this year alone and if he keeps it up, gonna report him for breaking the forum rule on advertising.

The Prajapita Brahmakumaris teach their seven day course free of costs, and does not charge anything unlike other Hindu institutions.

I have studied their courses and meditation and was not charged anything, and was even given free quality food cooked by the sister nuns there. I believe this is a valuable resource accessible to the common man and even poverty stricken for developing their quality of life.

The Prajapita Brahmakumaris have their headquarters in Mount Abu, Rajasthan, with centres in every Indian state and in countries all over the world. The Hindu nationalist leader and prime minister Narendra Modi and L.K.Advani have also attended their functions and inaugurated them.

P.V.Sindhu, Indian winner of the silver medal in the olympic games in rios, is also a practicioner of the Brahmakumaris meditation, and has mentioned their role in her interviews.

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Since inception, the BK's have been wrong about the world ending... Twice and now they give us all until 2036. You know, if they have been wrong about the world ending before, of course they can get something like "God's name" wrong as well, isn't it?

These are just misinterpretations and stuff of that sort, durinng the tensions of the cold war by some who just had a superficial understanding of the Brahmakumari theology. The Brahmakumaris focus is on female empowerment, and they have done a great job in India which suffers from evils like female infanticide, dowry burnings, human trafficking and sex slavery, discrimination and violence against females and other evils.

They have helped increase the self-esteem of women doomed hitherto to the four house of the wall and purdahs, to become educated, develop a career and become independent.

The Prajapita Brahmakumaris is the only spiritual organisation in the world led, administered and taught by women. And they have set a positive example in this regard to a male-dominated religious and secular world, and encouraged women to break the glass ceilings in their careers and modern world.

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Also, about that "surrender to us" contract the BKs get you to sign... I have already surrendered to GOD, so I don't think that's gonna work!

I have never been given such a contract. Such a so-called 'contract' would itself repel anyone. Some are committed to the organisation as full-time workers all over the world for propagating the free teachings out of free will.
Some have even voluntarily dropped out of the organisation as well. There is no compulsion in all this.

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

And of course you realise that NONE of this would have EVER happened, if Ajay didn't tell me that I don't understand Hinduism because I was NOT born in India, then goes on to preach about tolerance, inclusion and non duality... So if he really wishes to take me on under these circumstances, I will totally enjoy ripping him apart... It is why Kali exists... To do just that.

Aum Namah Shivaya

I do believe in nonduality and inclusion, but as someone born and brought up in India and Hindu culture, I have access to great sages, saints and ancient temples in India than yourself who has been brought up in Australia with a different culture.

Obviously a difference exists. You have even taken up the name of Shivani Devi after conversing with me, with Shivani Behan being a famous teacher of the Prajapita Brahmakumaris. She was awarded the Nari Shakti award by the Indian president Ram Nath Kovind in 2018 for her role in female empowerment in India.

http://www.pmtv.in/live/

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by ajay00

See, the point is that the Vedas only describe the Shivalingam as representing a pillar of light. This is what Swami Vivekananda also states, and Vivekananda is a highly respected saint in India, with his centres in every district in India and his words are often quoted by Indian prime ministers .

The former Prime Minister Rajiv Gandhi declared his birthday as 'Youth Day' in India.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swami_Vivekananda




These are all stated by Swami Vivekananda , who is considered as a great scholar in his own right, by many Hindu scholars themselves. Same too with Swami Sivananda.

To declare yourself as higher than Vivekananda in scholarship is akin to daydreaming.




Even Hinduism, is a doomsday cult as it teaches about Pralaya at the end of the kali yuga. Same with Christianity and Islam, with talk about 'Judgement Day' or Qiyamat.

The Kali Yuga is full of tamas, and tamas is associated with destruction.

However the focus of the Brahmakumaris is not on destruction, but on warding off destruction by creating positive energies and vibrations.

It is the negative energies and vibes that bring about such destruction.





The Prajapita Brahmakumaris teach their seven day course free of costs, and does not charge anything unlike other Hindu institutions.

I have studied their courses and meditation and was not charged anything, and was even given free quality food cooked by the sister nuns there. I believe this is a valuable resource accessible to the common man and even poverty stricken for developing their quality of life.

The Prajapita Brahmakumaris have their headquarters in Mount Abu, Rajasthan, with centres in every Indian state and in countries all over the world. The Hindu nationalist leader and prime minister Narendra Modi and L.K.Advani have also attended their functions and inaugurated them.

P.V.Sindhu, Indian winner of the silver medal in the olympic games in rios, is also a practicioner of the Brahmakumaris meditation, and has mentioned their role in her interviews.





These are just misinterpretations and stuff of that sort, durinng the tensions of the cold war by some who just had a superficial understanding of the Brahmakumari theology. The Brahmakumaris focus is on female empowerment, and they have done a great job in India which suffers from evils like female infanticide, dowry burnings, human trafficking and sex slavery, discrimination and violence against females and other evils.

They have helped increase the self-esteem of women doomed hitherto to the four house of the wall and purdahs, to become educated, develop a career and become independent.

The Prajapita Brahmakumaris is the only spiritual organisation in the world led, administered and taught by women. And they have set a positive example in this regard to a male-dominated religious and secular world, and encouraged women to break the glass ceilings in their careers and modern world.





I have never been given such a contract. Such a so-called 'contract' would itself repel anyone. Some are committed to the organisation as full-time workers all over the world for propagating the free teachings out of free will.
Some have even voluntarily dropped out of the organisation as well. There is no compulsion in all this.



I do believe in nonduality and inclusion, but as someone born and brought up in India and Hindu culture, I have access to great sages, saints and ancient temples in India than yourself who has been brought up in Australia with a different culture.

Obviously a difference exists. You have even taken up the name of Shivani Devi after conversing with me, with Shivani Behan being a famous teacher of the Prajapita Brahmakumaris. She was awarded the Nari Shakti award by the Indian president Ram Nath Kovind in 2018 for her role in female empowerment in India.

http://www.pmtv.in/live/

I'm not even going to bother breaking all that down into single quotes I can more easily reply to.

I am just deciding whether to do this all at once or slowly and deliciously... However, impatience is a character flaw:

The only decision I need to make is where do I begin?

What The Brahma Kumaris Don't Want The United Nations To Know:

https://www.fecris.org/uncategorized/bk/

Oohh... Juicy! Explains a lot about how they infiltrated the Indian political system.

However, I am just getting warmed up:

Whatever happened to Lord Shiva?

http://www.brahmakumaris.info/forum/...php?f=6&t=3175

I particularly became turned on reading THIS part:

Currently, we are still researching the history of the organization and the evolution of BK philosophy. To be quite frank ... it, and they, are a total mess. Especially from an orthodox Hindu point of view. It is as if they took Hinduism and threw it in a blender, swirled it around and ground it down ... and then picked out the pieces which they thought were best for marketing.

They've borrowed or stolen nearly all of their religion from Hinduism but re-invented and re-interpreted it. They use the names and basic frameworks ... but for their own ideas, e.g. the Kalpa of 4 ages being 5,000 years old.

In fact, they even have the audacity to claim that *they* are the original religion and Hinduism has borrowed from them, or rather that Hinduism is a corrupt, impure, partial copy of Brahma Kumarism. That is word for word what they believe.

What has become clear is that the BKs have also re-invented themselves and re-written their history several times ... and attempted to hide or cover up their previous messes to stop anyone seeing it ... therefore the current interpretation of their philosophy probably only dates back to the late-50s, early-60s when it was being influenced by an enthusiastic but amateur BK scholar called Jagdish Chander. It's a matter of history that their founder Lekhraj Kirpalani was not well educated and not well educated in religion. He was not even particularly religious.

It's more that the BKs think of Brahma, Vishnu, Shiva (Shankar to them) as levels of consciousness or states of being rather than individuals. In short, they don't exist as gods. There are no otherworldly gods or deities in BKism, and no other Godly realms, apart from their one God Shiva and his Soul World. They talk about "Shankar Puri", a realm in some spiritual dimension where their souls go when they are in the purest level and it is this level of consciousness will will cause the End of the World.

Yes, they called their primary guru and spirit medium Prajapti God Brahma (but not Lord) and, yes, he and others had visions of himself as Vishnu ... but they now understand these symbolically, e.g. Vishnu is symbolic of the perfect human being with male and female qualities balanced.

Of course, such understandings are not unique and we can pretty much be sure they were borrowed from somewhere else too. The BKs have tended to add words and ideas to their religion, taken from elsewhere, as new people come along.

For me, much of it is simply marketing. They adopt what they think will sell best and the Hindu market is their primary market place to they adopt Hindu words and concepts ... but they are not following or selling Hindu. They belong to no Hindu tradition, have no respect for any tradition except their own and the leaders try and operate a kind of monopoly over their ideas in order to protect their position ... there's no debate about them and little to no democracy in the religion.

You accept what you are told, repeat it unquestioningly, and are rewarded for conforming, good behaviour and, most of all, sticking around the longest.

Here is that link again:

http://www.brahmakumaris.info/forum/...php?f=6&t=3175

What about a statement from an ex-leader of the cult? Let's go there, shall we?

Ex Brahma Kumari cult leader reveals all:

https://robertchaen.com/2017/08/27/24150/

I am really enjoying this..

More will follow when I am not restricted to using a mobile phone and have access to a laptop because cutting and pasting walls of textual evidence using a small mobile phone is way beyond annoying.

Of course you can deny all this as much as you like, but when dealing with a brainwashed cult member, that is pretty much to be expected. I await it eagerly.

About my name "Shivani Devi"... YOU did not give me that name, that is a LIE! A blatant, boldfaced MISTRUTH! The Devas themselves gave me that name, when I was looking for another name to use in place of "The Necromancer" on this forum. However, now that I know that your cult leader shares the SAME name, I shall be changing it again.... Mark my words!

It is also the job of the Destroyer to destroy ignorance (Tamas) as well as liars and those who corrupt the Scriptures for personal or political gain... It is about time I made those supplications.

Only the purest of good can win out against evil. Not "good" performed in the name of egoic, self justification... It is where humankind continues to fall.. Hung by the very noose it fashions for itself.

However, since it is obvious I have not made myself perfectly clear in the first dozen or so replies I have made to you on this issue, please let me do it THIS way and it may just start sinking in...

I am not effing interested in joining your effing cult, so just sod off and I don't give a damn what you think of me, because you have no idea of who I really am and you could never even come close.

Aum Namah Shivaya

[ajay00]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

I'm not even going to bother breaking all that down into single quotes I can more easily reply to.

I am just deciding whether to do this all at once or slowly and deliciously... However, impatience is a character flaw:

The only decision I need to make is where do I begin?

What The Brahma Kumaris Don't Want The United Nations To Know:

https://www.fecris.org/uncategorized/bk/


Oohh... Juicy! Explains a lot about how they infiltrated the Indian political system.

However, I am just getting warmed up:

Whatever happened to Lord Shiva?

http://www.brahmakumaris.info/forum/...php?f=6&t=3175

I particularly became turned on reading THIS part:



Here is that link again:

http://www.brahmakumaris.info/forum/...php?f=6&t=3175

What about a statement from an ex-leader of the cult? Let's go there, shall we?

Ex Brahma Kumari cult leader reveals all:

https://robertchaen.com/2017/08/27/24150/

I am really enjoying this..

More will follow when I am not restricted to using a mobile phone and have access to a laptop because cutting and pasting walls of textual evidence using a small mobile phone is way beyond annoying.

Of course you can deny all this as much as you like, but when dealing with a brainwashed cult member, that is pretty much to be expected. I await it eagerly.

About my name "Shivani Devi"... YOU did not give me that name, that is a LIE! A blatant, boldfaced MISTRUTH! The Devas themselves gave me that name, when I was looking for another name to use in place of "The Necromancer" on this forum. However, now that I know that your cult leader shares the SAME name, I shall be changing it again.... Mark my words!

It is also the job of the Destroyer to destroy ignorance (Tamas) as well as liars and those who corrupt the Scriptures for personal or political gain... It is about time I made those supplications.

Only the purest of good can win out against evil. Not "good" performed in the name of egoic, self justification... It is where humankind continues to fall.. Hung by the very noose it fashions for itself.

However, since it is obvious I have not made myself perfectly clear in the first dozen or so replies I have made to you on this issue, please let me do it THIS way and it may just start sinking in...

I am not effing interested in joining your effing cult, so just sod off and I don't give a damn what you think of me, because you have no idea of who I really am and you could never even come close.

Aum Namah Shivaya

You have just given links to a blog and forum of some disgruntled people who have left the brahmakumaris citing all kinds of idiotic comments after misinterpeting the brahmakumari theology. You can see many such in the numerous atheist forums in the net as well criticising all other religions including Hinduism.

The regimen in the Brahmakumaris is strenuous, getting up at 4:00 am at brahmamuhoortham, vegetarian food and so on. Most people can't follow it, and make all kinds of excuses and leave off a trail of negativity behind. It is similar to the story of the fox and sour grapes.

Major temples in India grant access to the Brahmakumaris for conducting speeches, study classes and conferences, when they are still loath to admit foreigners and forbid them strictly to visit the temples. This shows the trust the temple authorities themselves have in the teachings of the Brahmakumaris.

The Brahmakumaris however are open to all of humanity regardless of caste, creed, religion, nationality and other distinctions.

The Indian government themselves have awarded numerous awards to the Brahmakumaris as mentioned above for their constructive social work, and the UN have awarded them the UN peace messenger awards seven times.

The Prajapita Brahmakumaris are also pioneers in green energy in India and have installed the world's largest solar cooker in Mount Abu, Rajasthan, capable of feeding around 40000 people.

[NoOne]

Ajay, you lost me at 4.00 am and vegetarian food. Now that I think about it, I once visited a Brahmakumari centre in London. Like most earnestly religious and spiritual people, they were super nice and friendly, but personally I see no benefit in living this kind of strict, monastic life.

I personally have a problem with all forms of organised religion and the more it insists on following certain rules, especially in terms of diet and lifestyle, the less appealing it is to me. Do people seriously think that the gods care about what you eat, when you wake up or who and when you have sex with? I'm sorry, but such rigid views are so incredibly childish to me, they belong in the dark ages and not in 21st century society.

Anybody can have a direct relationship with the divine, if they make an earnest effort and reach out to the gods with an open heart. They couldn't care less what you choose to do in your personal life, as long as it isn't deliberately malevolent.

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by NoOne

Ajay, you lost me at 4.00 am and vegetarian food. Now that I think about it, I once visited a Brahmakumari centre in London. Like most earnestly religious and spiritual people, they were super nice and friendly, but personally I see no benefit in living this kind of strict, monastic life.

I personally have a problem with all forms of organised religion and the more it insists on following certain rules, especially in terms of diet and lifestyle, the less appealing it is to me. Do people seriously think that the gods care about what you eat, when you wake up or who and when you have sex with? I'm sorry, but such rigid views are so incredibly childish to me, they belong in the dark ages and not in 21st century society.

Anybody can have a direct relationship with the divine, if they make an earnest effort and reach out to the gods with an open heart. They couldn't care less what you choose to do in your personal life, as long as it isn't deliberately malevolent.

I totally agree with you.

I am all FOR vegetarianism, even though, I do eat meat 2-3 times a week and that would be something I would be willing to give up for the "greater good" but there are a few things I will NOT compromise on... NEVER! :

I will never give up meeting my friend in Gloria Jeans Coffee House for a cup of Joe and a slice of apple pie twice a week... In fact, I refuse to give up the 2-3 cups of coffee/tea I have each day, full stop!

I will NOT wake up any earlier than 6am and especially on weekends! Dear God, it took years before I was even able to reach THAT stage after waking up at 8am or 9am on Sundays!

I dont care about sex... I don't have a partner and I am getting too old for that anyway, but when I read that married couples have to sleep in separate rooms because children need to be conceived psychically... Well, there has not been a Virgin Birth since.... I am sure Christians could complete that sentence...

I think some married couples would have problems with this.

I am all FOR austerities,! I would LOVE to be able to do the 16 Mondays fast for Lord Shiva... The Somwar Vrat. I would LOVE to carry the Cavadee on Thaipusam... I would LOVE to do a 10 day Vipassana meditation retreat... But i will not have a cult invade every single aspect of my life, making me feel like a prisoner within it. I'd prefer to go to jail.

I also noticed that Ajay did not respond to any single allegation that was made with a refute of claim... Just how "disgruntled members" and atheists will spread falsifications about ANY religion!

At least now, people have been presented with BOTH sides of the New Religious Movement and they can decide for themselves.

Aum Namah Shivaya

[NoOne]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

I agree with you.

I am all for veegetarianism, even though, i do eat meat 2-3 timee a week and that would be somethinh I would bd willing to givve up fof the "greater good" but there are a few things I will NOT compromise on:

I will never give up meeting my friend in Gloria Jeans Coffee House for a cup of Joe and a slice of apple pie twice a week... In fact, I refuse to give up the 2-3 cups of coffee/tea I have each day, full stop!

I will NOT wake up any earlier than 6am and especially on weekends! Dear God, it took years before I was even able to reach THAT point after waking up at 8am or 9am on Sundays!

I dont care about sex... I don't have a partner and I am getting too old for that anyway, but when I read that married couples have to sleep in separate rooms because children need to be conceived psychically... Well, there has not been a Virgin Birth since.... I am sure Christians could complete that sentence...

I think some married couples may have problems with it.

I am all FOR austerities,! I would LOVE to be able to do the 16 Mondays fast for Lord Shiva... The Somwar Vrat. I would LOVE to carry the Cavadee on Thaipusam... I would LOVE to do a 10 day Vipassana meditation retreat... But not have a cult invade every single aspect of my life, making me feel like a prisoner within it.

I also noticed that Ajay did not respond to any single allegation that was made with refute... Just how "disgruntled members and atheists will spread falsifications about ANY religion!

At least now, people have been presented with BOTH sides of the New Religious Movement and tney can decide for themselves.

Aum Namah Shivaya

Yes, that is my main problem with organised religion in general. It seems to favour ritual, hierarchy and frankly, mindless rules, over direct contact with the divine.

I don't usually bring up David Icke, but I do agree with him that this must be some sort of reptilian leftover from our distant past, it appeals to the reptilian arc-complex of the brain. I think it is a trap. It is spontaneity and unpredictability that gets us out of a rut, and ultimately the "matrix" or "maya" if you prefer that term.

As for sex, I don't need it, because I have pretty much gone through the process that Gopi Krishna and others describe in connection with the ongoing process of Kundalini awakening, whereby the sexual organs take on a different role and transmute sexual energy into a higher, spiritual form and transport it into the brain, along the spine. It is not a myth and I can personally attest to its positive effects on my spirituality and the powers that come with it.

My problem is with major religions putting the cart before the horse, trying to force people to suppress their national urges or make them feel guilty about it. That is very wrong and is actually a hindrance to spiritual awakening. Once you are spiritually awakened, your sex drive will gradually diminish, but that is actually a natural process and should not be forced in any way.

As for Gloria Jeans... I used to like it when I lived in Ireland, it was the only decent coffee place in town. The last time I tried it, in Singapore, I thought it was dreadful. Terrible coffee and everything else. Maybe it's different in Australia though. There is actually an excellent coffee chain in Hungary, called Cafe Frei and I can honestly say it is the best place for coffee I've ever been to. They have almost a hundred different types of coffee from all over the world (including Malaysian Kopi of course). I also like Black Canyon, which is a Thai chain, but I haven't been in ages. Sorry for the off-topic

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by NoOne

Yes, that is my main problem with organised religion in general. It seems to favour ritual, hierarchy and frankly, mindless rules, over direct contact with the divine.

I don't usually bring up David Icke, but I do agree with him that this must be some sort of reptilian leftover from our distant past, it appeals to the reptilian arc-complex of the brain. I think it is a trap. It is spontaneity and unpredictability that gets us out of a rut, and ultimately the "matrix" or "maya" if you prefer that term.

As for sex, I don't need it, because I have pretty much gone through the process that Gopi Krishna and others describe in connection with the ongoing process of Kundalini awakening, whereby the sexual organs take on a different role and transmute sexual energy into a higher, spiritual form and transport it into the brain, along the spine. It is not a myth and I can personally attest to its positive effects on my spirituality and the powers that come with it.

My problem is with major religions putting the cart before the horse, trying to force people to suppress their national urges or make them feel guilty about it. That is very wrong and is actually a hindrance to spiritual awakening. Once you are spiritually awakened, your sex drive will gradually diminish, but that is actually a natural process and should not be forced in any way.

As for Gloria Jeans... I used to like it when I lived in Ireland, it was the only decent coffee place in town. The last time I tried it, in Singapore, I thought it was dreadful. Terrible coffee and everything else. Maybe it's different in Australia though. There is actually an excellent coffee chain in Hungary, called Cafe Frei and I can honestly say it is the best place for coffee I've ever been to. They have almost a hundred different types of coffee from all over the world (including Malaysian Kopi of course). I also like Black Canyon, which is a Thai chain, but I haven't been in ages. Sorry for the off-topic

To be fair and seeing this from all sides..

In the Hindu scriptures, it is stated that Brahmamurutha - the time that exists for about an hour before sunrise is the most auspicious time for spiritual practice due to the "vibration"... And the peace and quiet... Before everybody else, including Surya Deva (the Sun God) wakes up and destroys the ambience.

I used to do it ALL! Waking up at 4-5 am... Bathing and meditating, before doing 9 rounds of Surya Namaskar (sun salute) and chanting the Gayatri Mantra 108 times, just in time to honour the rising sun.

ALL I am saying is that these things... All these things are TRADITIONAL Hindu practices and not ONLY/JUST Brahma Kumaris practices! The Brahma Kumaris do NOT have a monopoly on Raja Yoga or the Hindu religion... They only like to think they do..

More will follow in an hour or so... I have an appointment that needs attending.

[NoOne]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

To be fair and seeing this from all sides..

In the Hindu scriptures, it is stated that Brahmamurutha - the time that exists for about an hour before sunrise is the most auspicious time for spiritual practice due to the "vibration"... And the peace and quiet... Before everybody else, including Surya Deva (the Sun God) wakes up.

I used to do it ALL! Waking up at 4-5 am... Bathing and meditating, before doing 9 rounds of Surya Namaskar (sun salute) and chanting the Gayatri Mantra 108 times, just in time to honour the rising sun.

ALL I am saying is that these things... All these things are TRADITIONAL Hindu practices and not ONLY/JUST Brahma Kumaris practices! The Brahma Kumaris do NOT have a monopoly on Raja Yoga or the Hindu religion... They only like to think they do..

More will follow in an hour or so... I have an appointment that needs attending.

Yes, I know, I meant that in a general sense. All religions have such practices. They are rather militaristic in a way. Maybe they work for some people, but for me, they're completely abhorrent. I'm just not the kind of person that likes to be told how to live my life and what to do every hour of every day. Others apparently like to lead a monastic life. My only point is that I don't believe any of it is really necessary. One can achieve spiritual awakening and even enlightenment without going to extremes. Of course some self-discipline and a certain amount of daily routine is necessary. I just believe in not taking it too seriously, letting go, relaxing and allowing the process to unfold on its own, in its own time. I always advocate surrender to the divine feminine as the best path to follow.

Anyways, good night for now.

[ajay00]

Originally Posted by NoOne

Ajay, you lost me at 4.00 am and vegetarian food. Now that I think about it, I once visited a Brahmakumari centre in London. Like most earnestly religious and spiritual people, they were super nice and friendly, but personally I see no benefit in living this kind of strict, monastic life.

The Brahmakumaris have high standards, and with high standards comes great gain in a short period of time.

Also there is no compulsion in all this. You can practice this if you want to, or drop out of it, if you do not wish to. It is all a personal choice. Take it or leave it.

In Hinduism as well, there is focus on brahmamuhoortham (4:00-6:00) meditation and prayer as well as vegetarianism, but most hindus don't do the same because of its rigor. But as with most things in life, intelligent exertion enables one to attain the seemingly unattainable.

Originally Posted by NoOne

I personally have a problem with all forms of organised religion and the more it insists on following certain rules, especially in terms of diet and lifestyle, the less appealing it is to me.

These austerities are there in all sects of hinduism. It is austerities that purify the consciousness of its desires in the form of cravings and aversions.

Nisargadatta Maharaj while making a honest living, also austerely practiced awareness as constantly as possible, without allowing the mind to be disturbed or agitated by external stimuli. This enabled him to attain enlightenment.

If austerity does not appeal to you, maybe hinduism may not be the right religion for you.