Peace.

[Iamit]

A pilgrim travelled to the temple and stood before Shiva. The warden came and said "It is our tradition not to point out feet towards Shiva". The pilgrim replied "Certainly Sir, if you will point to where Shiva is not".

From a non-dual perspective there is no peace until everything is included as Oneness manifesting, particularly the things we dont like and find unacceptable.

So although a resonance with All is One may have occurred, everything may not have been included. A clue is when you notice yourself thinking, and maybe even saying, that this or that needs to be overcome for peace to be achieved.

[Ground]

Originally Posted by Iamit

From a non-dual perspective there is no peace until everything is included as Oneness manifesting, particularly the things we dont like and find unacceptable.

That is a an expression of a rational analytical perspective (which may be based on wrong thinking), so 'From a non-dual perspective' is inappropriate.

What means 'peace'? Is it 'peace of mind' meaning 'being content and relaxed'? If so there are many people not adhering to your system of beliefs who are 'content and relaxed' independent of your concept of 'oneness'.

Originally Posted by Iamit

So although a resonance with All is One may have occurred, everything may not have been included. A clue is when you notice yourself thinking, and maybe even saying, that this or that needs to be overcome for peace to be achieved.

Well that's tricky because your doctrine quoted above may easily be understood as an exhortation to achieve or overcome due to 'there is no ... until ..., particularly the things we dont like and find unacceptable.'

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by Ground

That is a an expression of a rational analytical perspective (which may be based on wrong thinking), so 'From a non-dual perspective' is inappropriate.

What means 'peace'? Is it 'peace of mind' meaning 'being content and relaxed'? If so there are many people not adhering to your system of beliefs who are 'content and relaxed' independent of your concept of 'oneness'.

Well that's tricky because your doctrine quoted above may easily be understood as an exhortation to achieve or overcome due to 'there is no ... until ..., particularly the things we dont like and find unacceptable.'

l
What is meant by peace is the peace of no longer feeling disconnected and the peace of feeling totally connected to all. The latter cannot happen until all is included as Oneness manifest.

The problem given to the mind to solve is the suffering of feeling disconnected. The nondual solution is that nothing needs to change for connection because Oneness is already you feeling disconnected!:).

However what also arises as a consequence is that you are therefore One with all there is! This challenges previously held views that one has found aspects of the manifestation unacceptable such as suffering and Hitler. Until all that stuff is included as Oneness manifest the initial resonance with All is One is not consolidated. This consolidation is not required for connection purposes because its already Oneness feeling that, so there is never an exortation to achieve anything for connection purposes

[FallingLeaves]

I feel like there are a lot of good descriptions of things out there, however, if I try to act on one in order to manifest the results people put barriers in the way. Personally, I think the system is rigged with pretty descriptions of things so that I will be happy to try to act on them in an effort to get things people seem to want to tell me I should like, but that people are just not going to let me have. It is very aggravating.

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

I feel like there are a lot of good descriptions of things out there, however, if I try to act on one in order to manifest the results people put barriers in the way. Personally, I think the system is rigged with pretty descriptions of things so that I will be happy to try to act on them in an effort to get things people seem to want to tell me I should like, but that people are just not going to let me have. It is very aggravating.

One size does not seem to fit all.

Maybe the mind will find a size that fits your character. There are lots on offer. What seems the most promising so far?

[FallingLeaves]

Originally Posted by Iamit

One size does not seem to fit all.

Maybe the mind will find a size that fits your character. There are lots on offer. What seems the most promising so far?

from what I've seen people doing with all this, I'm not sure if I even want to partake... I probably will though eventually

[Ground]

Originally Posted by Iamit

l
What is meant by peace is the peace of no longer feeling disconnected and the peace of feeling totally connected to all. The latter cannot happen until all is included as Oneness manifest.

The problem given to the mind to solve is the suffering of feeling disconnected. The nondual solution is that nothing needs to change for connection because Oneness is already you feeling disconnected!:).

However what also arises as a consequence is that you are therefore One with all there is! This challenges previously held views that one has found aspects of the manifestation unacceptable such as suffering and Hitler. Until all that stuff is included as Oneness manifest the initial resonance with All is One is not consolidated. This consolidation is not required for connection purposes because its already Oneness feeling that, so there is never an exortation to achieve anything for connection purposes

I do not perceive 'Feeling disconnected' being negative nor do I perceive 'feeling totally connected to all' being positive.

your view is similar to buddhist view in that there is the claim of one phenomenon being utterly negative. Buddhists call it 'suffering', you call it 'Feeling disconnected'. But what buddhists call 'suffering' isn't appropriately called suffering because it isn't necessarily negative and what you call 'Feeling disconnected' isn't necessarily negative either.

Be that as it may I think your view is just an appeal to believe in what you call 'oneness' and referring to yourself it is a kind of auto-suggestion.


From my perspective - and here I am close to buddhism - feeling as such is the issue and 'feeling' here is the emotionality of liking or disliking. So it is one's emotional response towards phenomena that causes unease or emotional turmoil and therefore the contrary to peace [of mind].
In this context a kind of disconnection which then is called 'detachment' is not negative but conducive to peace.

So the fact that you are saying 'feeling disconnected' may hint at the actual issue which is just feeling as disliking.
And the fact that you are saying 'feeling totally connected to all' may hint at the actual issue which is just feeling as liking.
Feelings come and go and are utterly transient. If you are after certain feelings but reject other feelings that is an issue.

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by Ground

I do not perceive 'Feeling disconnected' being negative nor do I perceive 'feeling totally connected to all' being positive.

your view is similar to buddhist view in that there is the claim of one phenomenon being utterly negative. Buddhists call it 'suffering', you call it 'Feeling disconnected'. But what buddhists call 'suffering' isn't appropriately called suffering because it isn't necessarily negative and what you call 'Feeling disconnected' isn't necessarily negative either.

Be that as it may I think your view is just an appeal to believe in what you call 'oneness' and referring to yourself it is a kind of auto-suggestion.


From my perspective - and here I am close to buddhism - feeling as such is the issue and 'feeling' here is the emotionality of liking or disliking. So it is one's emotional response towards phenomena that causes unease or emotional turmoil and therefore the contrary to peace [of mind].
In this context a kind of disconnection which then is called 'detachment' is not negative but conducive to peace.

So the fact that you are saying 'feeling disconnected' may hint at the actual issue which is just feeling as disliking.
And the fact that you are saying 'feeling totally connected to all' may hint at the actual issue which is just feeling as liking.
Feelings come and go and are utterly transient. If you are after certain feelings but reject other feelings that is an issue.

If feeling disconnected is felt as suffering by the person feeling it thats accepted by me. Likewise with feeling positive about connection to all.

[Ground]

Originally Posted by Iamit

If feeling disconnected is felt as suffering by the person feeling it thats accepted by me. Likewise with feeling positive about connection to all.

I would prefer 'unease' because 'suffering' reminds me of this buddhist exaggeration when they use the term.

I wonder why you chose this dualism 'connected vs disconnected'.
your concept 'oneness' is a monistic concept but nevertheless you speak of 'connecting to oneness'. I mean if everything is already this 'oneness' then both, disconnecting from and connecting to is impossible.

In the translation of a text from Longchen Rabjam that I often refer to they also use the word 'oneness' but they use it as s synonym for a specific kind of 'awareness'. In contrast to you they at least explain what this word stands for and why it is applied:

Awareness - oneness - is the ground of all phenomena.
Although there is the appearance of multiplicity, to say that there is
no wavering from oneness
is to say that naturally occurring timeless awareness is
the single source.

Quoted from The Precious Treasury of The Way of Abiding, Padma Publishing 1998

So different things may be called 'one' if a common feature is focused on. I. e. a blue car and a blue shirt are 'one' considering their blueness.
Or - as in the quote - focusing on the posited 'one and only source' of phenomena different phenomena are 'one' in that they originate from the this 'one and only source'. Focusing on this 'one and only source' there is 'no wavering from oneness'.

[iamthat]

Solutions to the idea of separation are not to be found in the mind. The mind is very limited, and no thought or feeling can lead to the realisation of Unity or Oneness. The realisation of Unity/Oneness comes about through complete surrender, the letting go of everything.

Peace.