Is there value in suffering?

[ReturningMoon]

Hi everyone. I've heard a quote before that says "To the degree that we have suffered we are capable of the opposing level of joy."
Maybe this would be the value in suffering?
I have seen some cases where all that person did was suffer until the end of their life. That's the sad part.
I think maybe in this life you could reap the rewards of your suffering if you're lucky, but not everyone does.
Any additional thoughts would be appreciated.

[Miss Hepburn]

Hi, I think you have interesting threads. :)

This is my take on suffering:
1. When I suffer it gives me a point of seeing that - 'I don't like it'!!
SO, therefore - I do whatever it takes to END it. Lol.
2. By seeing that I have the power to end it...I feel I progress in confidence
and in the knowledge of learning how this place works! :)
3. Also, it teaches me WHAT is it that keeps me from NOT suffering?
Now that part is SWEET; when you figure out the Formula!

I suffer very little at this point in my life! Yay!

[lemex]

Not only do we suffer but we also cause it. My own opinion to the degree it is so frequently caused with thought we do not value it enough.

Suffering: if you don’t pass the lesson the first time you will get it again…..

[Starman]

There are a lot of people who believe in the adage “no pain no gain,” they believe that suffering pushes us to grow and better ourselves. Most spiritually oriented people were pushed or pulled into spirituality, or religion, because they have greatly suffered and were looking for some kind of relief.

I went through a lot of suffering, physical and emotional, which lead me on a spiritual quest. But I do now feel that we do not have to suffer to gain or grow. We can grow from joy just as well as we can from suffering. Although it was suffering that lead me to joy and the conclusion that joy is as good a teacher as suffering.

[Redchic12]

Is there value in suffering?

Well for me personally there was. Whenever I went thru a painful situation I always sat down and thought deeply about it . Firstly, I looked at what/where I went wrong, was it something I said or didn’t say or could I have reacted in a better way and what did I contribute to bring about such a disaster…..those kinda things. And sometimes ide talk it thru with a trusted friend.

So after doing all of that, I resigned myself to the fact that I would never make that same mistake again and I didn’t (well mostly) hence, less suffering came my way.

So yes suffering did make me a better person and I had a lot less suffering happening to me.

However, as Starman said, we can learn from Joy as well. But I won’t bore people with anymore examples of that lol

[Nikos1982]

Hello there....

I don't think it's wise to choose suffering for learning, a path that involves suffering.... sometimes though challenges come our way and we need to get em through....

Sometimes the challenge is bigger than we would ever thought.... and we don't have the option to choose it away....

Doing our best is what we can do...

Doing our best in a fine day is different than doing our best when we 're sick....

But doing our best is ultimately what we need to do....

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[Podshell]

A very sad thing is that people blame God for sufferings and also use the fact that suffering exists to add to a list of reasons why God does not exist, I say sad, because they speak without really giving thought to the actual sufferer, because even if God and a reason for suffering did not exist then what hope has that sufferer got to hold on to? Pushing tat argument would take away any hope a desperate person has left to cling on to.

[Unseeking Seeker]

About the OP, I’d say it is about recognition, our outlook to life. There seems to be no basis to believe that if we suffer more, we will experience more joy. Let us look at this proposition ~

We feel both joy and pain. Pain amplified by thought becomes suffering. So, simply by thought cessation, suffering ends and all that remains is witnessing joy and pain.

A typical Buddhist mindfulness practice asks us to constantly be aware of thoughts and emotions that arise and contemplate: ‘to whom does this experience come?’ This is quite effective, in my view. It is direct, subtle and yet deep.

So with suffering eliminated by thought cessation, out of joy and pain, the play is between desire and aversion. Who desires, who dislikes? The ego, or body identity, this transient, decaying form, which we are not.

Detachment (not indifference) positions our awareness in vibrant stillness, in silence. Then, if heart be pure and mind empty, bliss fills our emptiness. In permanence.

There is no value in suffering other than that it is a wake up call. We ask, ‘who am I?’ Not body, not mind but formless, eternal awareness. Dwelling therein, we are at peace.

Those who inquire are set free, those who live by instinct, remain bound. Such are my views.

[FallingLeaves]

Originally Posted by Nikos1982

Hello there....I don't think it's wise to choose suffering for learning, a path that involves suffering....

i don't think anyone WANTS to choose that.

But there was that story of the suffering servant, in isaiah. Made to suffer incessantly at the hands of a people who completely misunderstood him, still there were a lot of gifts given to him in return for what he went through and apparently he had a very strong place in the meaning of things. You can read the story for yourself if you want to see what he was given and how he responds to a life even though cut off from others.

And then there was job... made to suffer but never once giving up on god or even on life even though he was definitely not getting all the things people are used to having.

and in my own studies, i have reason to believe if you are going to be 'scientific' about life it is not good form to just simply discard suffering simply on the basis that you agree with everyone else that it isn't worth having. Scientists are more open minded than to just be discarding whole swaths of reality just based on personal desire for outcomes, if they want to succeed in their craft.

To me suffering has a very interesting place but in exchange for learning its gifts you've gotta accept being somewhat alone. lol.