Enlightenment

Originally Posted by sound

Whats this expression then?

The blurb says that there is no distance between the experience. That the insertion of a viewer ( self ) is a lie of the mind to fill the void. That we ARE simply what we experience. It's the delivery method that is the difference. I don't want to do the posters job for them this is just what I found take it or leave it. See ya.

[Internal Queries]

Originally Posted by Elijah

The reality of being is evident, the idea of what that presence of being is is assumed.

huh? i am that i am. that's the assumption and the assumption holds true because HERE I AM.

Originally Posted by Enlightened

I'm having to go out right now, i'll get back to this tomorrow. Feel free to e-mail me on [email protected] if you want to crack this one on one.

I'm down for whatever..

I've got high hopes for Free Bird, the real desire to want to crack this will push you to look. Good stuff.

Who is the "I" that has to go now?

Originally Posted by Internal Queries

huh? i am that i am. that's the assumption and the assumption holds true because HERE I AM.

When you say: "The existance of self is self evident."
I agree, but what is the nature of this self that is self evident?
Does it exist as the image we project upon that sense of being/self or is that simply conceptual?
When people deny the self, they don't mean the reality of being, simply the idea of what one exist as.

[sound]

So Enlightened ... may I ask please, given your belief that there is no 'us', who exactly are you referring to when you speak about all of us, collectively, waking up and saving the world?

[sound]

Originally Posted by not human

The blurb says that there is no distance between the experience. That the insertion of a viewer ( self ) is a lie of the mind to fill the void. That we ARE simply what we experience. It's the delivery method that is the difference. I don't want to do the posters job for them this is just what I found take it or leave it. See ya.

Mmm ... my question is how is that awareness of this experience created .... thinking aloud now ... I agree we are the experience but that doesn't make it any less authentic ... why should it ... in fact, that very fact has the potential to create a seeming 'dilemma' of sorts to the reasoning mind, which seems to like separating itself from its direct experience ...

As an aside, there is no way in this universe you can do the posters job for him/her unless you are a replica of their experience which i feel i can safely say you are not. Experience is extremely difficult to 'replicate' ... in fact i would say impossible actually, would you agree not human? ...

[Internal Queries]

Originally Posted by Elijah

When you say: "The existance of self is self evident."
I agree, but what is the nature of this self that is self evident?
Does it exist as the image we project upon that sense of being/self or is that simply conceptual?
When people deny the self, they don't mean the reality of being, simply the idea of what one exist as.

dance a complicated fandango with yourself if you want. it's obvious that you exist. if you did not i would not be reading and responding to your posts.

there's no way for me to know if what you project into external reality is an accurate portrayal of your internal concepts of yourself. how can i know how self honest you are? only you can know that.

[Shantyaikya]

I felt my head begin to crack. I'll keep at it.

Ok, there's a lot of discussion going on, but I'd like to clear up a few things first.

1. The 'cult' issue. This is ridiculous. I have not asked for any money, there are no 'levels', no leader, no beliefs to adopt, no followers, and no robes. I offer what I do for free, if you don't want to 'do' it, then there's no pressure. If you want to come through the gate, by all means do, but it's for no benefit to me. I'm giving up my free time to help people become liberated. Nothing more, nothing less.

2. Someone mentioned NLP. Again, ridiculous. What i'm trying to show you is BEYOND the mind, illuminating the illusion of self. In what way is that possibly some kind of mental programming? If anything, it's un-programming the belief of self. The exact opposite of what you claim.

3. One-on-one. I offer this because of the situation we have here. I'm now expected to answer every single person in one large post. I'm having to spend ages sifting through posts to answer everyone and it's difficult to give you the full answer you need. I've nothing to hide.

4. My bold claim of enlightenment. Yes, what I offer to show you is enlightenment. Actual enlightenment. But I don't like that term, it conjures up some grand feat. I'm not special, nor do I claim to be. I prefer the term 'liberated' as it is closer to the seeing of the illusion and becoming free.

I understand what I claim is hard to believe, and may seem too easy. But what comparison do you truly have? The wise master sitting atop the mountain is largely a fairytale. The Dalai Lama, having spent his whole life in deep study, isn't enlightened. So why does anything he does have any weight whatsoever?

Nothing I say is going against a lot of what's already out there, it's just simplified to it's very essence. Remember the great sages, the Buddha, and Jesus lived a very long time ago. Their message has unfortunately been largely diluted over time. 'No self. No problem.' is a Buddhist saying, I agree with it.

I expect you to have some skepticism, but just test it out. Nothing will 'go wrong'. If what I say is complete garbage, at least have the decency, and curiosity to test it. If it is complete make believe, then you can all club together and collectively make me look the fool. But I simply ask of you that you test what I say first.

Mattie - Are you contending that dropping the perception of individuality is automatic enlightenment?

It might be useful for you to precisely define what you are calling enlightenment so we can understand what you mean by this term.

As you noted, '... I came here to help you.' further explaination of the above 2 things would be very useful in understanding what you are trying to say.



Once you truly see this false self operating, it's impossible to believe in it anymore. You've seen behind the curtain, you've seen what's pulling the strings. Once this illusion is shattered, you can clearly see there is no 'self' anymore. Just a collection of thoughts and emotions collectively masquerading as a 'you'.

This is what waking up hinges on. You don't need retreats, meditation, endless discussion to wake up.

Enlightenment is the recognition of the truth of no self.

I'm NOT asking you to adopt this as a belief. A belief is something you hold in your mind as true. What i'm asking you to do, is test this.

If you close your eyes and try to find 'you', what happens? What are you seeing?

Can you locate 'yourself'?



I feel this covers a lot of users posts, i'm not excluding anyone but this is the very essence of enlightenment so let's stay on point.

[Squatchit]

Originally Posted by Enlightened

our world is dying. It's time we woke up and saved it...

Hello Enlightened

It seems you've caused a bit of a ruckus. And I also see that you're not one for answering questions...so whilst I'm hopeful for a reply, I'm not expecting one.

I'd like to ask you about what you state above.

What do you mean by 'our world'? Planet earth? The human population? What?

Seeing as you have already woken up, what are you doing on a practical day-to-day basis to save it? Whilst I appreciate you may answer you are 'waking others up' - I would like more detail. How is being enlightened saving the world?

I don't care for one-to-one discussions either so if you would be so kind as to respond here, I'd be grateful.

Cheers.

Squatch