Catholic Mystic Maria Valtorta?

What do you people think about Catholic Mystic Maria Valtorta?

http://valtorta.org/
http://www.bardstown.com/~brchrys/
http://www.mariavaltortawebring.com/

[theophilus]

I followed the first link you gave and found this at the top of the page.

A NEW 10 volume, English SOFTCOVER edition titled THE GOSPEL AS REVEALED TO
ME, by Maria Valtorta, will have the first 4 volumes available beginning this summer, with the other 6 volumes available by the end of this year. We will give pricing information as soon as we know from the Italian Publisher.

The gospel has been fully revealed in the Bible. Since then many people have claimed that God has given them some new revelation. Among these people Muhammed and Joseph Smith have been among the most successful in persuading people to follow their new teachings. If Maria Valtorta claims to have received some new revelation then she is in the same class as these people and will ultimately share their fate.

But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again: If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to the one you received, let him be accursed.

[seeker89]

Hi theophilus, I was just wondering something: I'm not a Christian in the strict/orthodox sense, but I do believe in God. I was hoping you could tell me exactly how you arrived at the conclusion that the Bible is the one and only ultimate truth? It's my view (and I'm sure many others share it) that all the spiritual teachings that exist hold the same core message, and were revealed to people in ways that fit in with their culture at the time. I ask myself, "If God chooses to reveal things to someone, then who am I to doubt that???" So yes, I am curious how you came to believe what you do...

Originally Posted by theophilus

I followed the first link you gave and found this at the top of the page.
The gospel has been fully revealed in the Bible. Since then many people have claimed that God has given them some new revelation. Among these people Muhammed and Joseph Smith have been among the most successful in persuading people to follow their new teachings. If Maria Valtorta claims to have received some new revelation then she is in the same class as these people and will ultimately share their fate.

John 21:25 But there are also many other things which Jesus did; which, if they were written every one, the world itself, I think, would not be able to contain the books that should be written.


There is nothing contrary to the Gospel. There is no new revelation, no new teachings, no new law. It is only clarified and expanded, meaning there is more truth revealed but not new truth. If God decides in time and space to give us more help and more truth why do we reject it or why do we judge Him. If you read the books try to find some errorrs and then bring them up here.

Mohamed and Joseph Smith lacked discernment of spirits as it is obvious to me and to some other people. The revelation they received could have been coming from the devil. But Maria Valtorta has no moral, dogmatic or theological errors. Even theologians and scholars can't find errors and when they do bring something up against her writings it is misinterpreted and misunderstood. There was no errors. Maybe only Protestants can find some since they do not agree with some Catholic Church teachings anyway. They think they are smarter (pride).

Catherine Emerich also had the Gospel revealed yet there was no new sect, no schismatic group, no new religion, no new dogma. New religions only come from rebellious, proud, disobedient people who since they don't have the sacrament of Confirmation can't have the gifts of the Holy Spirit (knowledge, understanding, wisdom) and they don't understand some of the simplest truths and dogmas of the Catholic Church like that we pray to Mary.

Hello. How are you doing today?

I followed your links and seen many images of so called christ and the queen of heaven. I also seen prices on all her works...i know she has passed on and in her lifetime took a vow or poverty and am not holding that against her revelation. But by their fruits they shall be known. The fruits that i have seen from her leave people in bondage to idols and trapped inside a man made system that will restrict if not outright destroy any open mindedness to the truth and will lead to people fighting against most any righteous knowledge of the Most High.

you said the following two things...

"Maybe only Protestants can find some since they do not agree with some Catholic Church teachings anyway. They think they are smarter (pride)."

"New religions only come from rebellious, proud, disobedient people"

So why do you speak well for one NEW religion yet speak ill of another...that is pride...do you not see that the protestants are daughters of your own church? Yet Catholicism is the better...hmmm...this would mean you are in hypocrisy...

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth: Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;And shewing mercy unto thousands of them that love me, and keep my commandments.


...surely you have seen/heard those words before...are they in vain?

What about these words?

And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you, And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

Like Jeremiah said in the 6th chapter "Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein."

Who said they wouldn't walk in the old way? yep, the same majority of people who still wont leave the new way for the old way. :)

Love and Blessings,
busybizarre

[theophilus]

Originally Posted by seeker89

I was hoping you could tell me exactly how you arrived at the conclusion that the Bible is the one and only ultimate truth?

I originally arrice at that conclusion because I grew up in a home that believed the Bible and I was taught that it was true. However I have found enough evidence to convince me that what I believed was true. I was asked this question on another thread today and here is the answer I gave there.

http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=520638&postcount=29

[theophilus]

Originally Posted by Enigmatic Spammos

Maybe only Protestants can find some since they do not agree with some Catholic Church teachings anyway. They think they are smarter (pride).

We don't think we're smarter. We simply test all teaching by whether or not it agrees with the Bible.

Originally Posted by busybizarre

So why do you speak well for one NEW religion yet speak ill of another...that is pride...do you not see that the protestants are daughters of your own church? Yet Catholicism is the better...hmmm...this would mean you are in hypocrisy...

I speak the truth.

Galatians 4:16 Am I then become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

Catholic Church was established by Jesus Christ-Jerusalem. The Apostles were first Bishops. There was no Bible only Catholic Tradition for several hundred years.

Lutheran church-established by Martin Luther, 1517, Germany
Anglican-Henry VIII, 1534, England
Orthodox-Schismatic Catholic Bishops, 1054, Constantinople
Calvinist-John Calvin, 1555, Switzerland
Anabaptist-Nicholas Storch & Thomas Munzer, 1521, Germany
Presbyterian-John Knox, 1560, Scotland
Baptist-John Smith, 1609, Amsterdam
Mormon-Joseph Smith, 1830, New York
Seventh Day Adventist-Ellen White, 1844, Washington, NH
Jehovah's Witnesses-Charles Russell, 1874, Pennsylvania

And it goes on and on, now exceeding 30 000 proud-myself Bible interpreting Christian denominations worldwide! I am not proud. I am not inventing new theology or new religion.

I follow Peter the Rock (first Pope) on which the Church was built.

Matthew 16:18
And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Gates of Hell are the 7 Capital Sins. First and most disgusting of all sins is Lucifer's arrogant pride. So the gates of hell are all those proud (who follow Lucifer's example) and false teachers, prophets and scholars who attack the Catholic Church and establish new church and new dogma.

Originally Posted by Enigmatic Spammos

I speak the truth.

Galatians 4:16 Am I then become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

Catholic Church was established by Jesus Christ-Jerusalem. The Apostles were first Bishops. There was no Bible only Catholic Tradition for several hundred years.

Lutheran church-established by Martin Luther, 1517, Germany
Anglican-Henry VIII, 1534, England
Orthodox-Schismatic Catholic Bishops, 1054, Constantinople
Calvinist-John Calvin, 1555, Switzerland
Anabaptist-Nicholas Storch & Thomas Munzer, 1521, Germany
Presbyterian-John Knox, 1560, Scotland
Baptist-John Smith, 1609, Amsterdam
Mormon-Joseph Smith, 1830, New York
Seventh Day Adventist-Ellen White, 1844, Washington, NH
Jehovah's Witnesses-Charles Russell, 1874, Pennsylvania

And it goes on and on, now exceeding 30 000 proud-myself Bible interpreting Christian denominations worldwide! I am not proud. I am not inventing new theology or new religion.

I follow Peter the Rock (first Pope) on which the Church was built.

Matthew 16:18
And I say to thee: That thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

Gates of Hell are the 7 Capital Sins. First and most disgusting of all sins is Lucifer's arrogant pride. So the gates of hell are all those proud (who follow Lucifer's example) and false teachers, prophets and scholars who attack the Catholic Church and establish new church and new dogma.

It was I who told you truth, so does this mean you intend to make me your enemy? I hope not, i would rather gain a brother/sister or at least a friend...but for me to remain truthful i must say, i am not concerned about gaining nor losing a friend or a foe. :)

The only truth you said was mingled with a lie...which makes it a lie.

you said "There was no Bible only Catholic Tradition for several hundred years"

Catholic Tradition is the true part and Tradition is the key word.

but

There was a Bible. The Hebrew Scriptures. The Scriptures Jesus taught from and pointed to. The Scriptures Paul an apostle instructed to study.

Luk 24:27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

Luk 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

Rom 16:25-26 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith:

2Ti 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

2 Corinthians 3:14-17 But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ. But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart. Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away. Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

[theophilus]

Originally Posted by Enigmatic Spammos

There was no Bible only Catholic Tradition for several hundred years.

Jesus and his followers had the Old Testament, which makes up 3/4 of the Bible. The New Testement was written entirely by men who were alive at the same time Christ lived.

Lutheran church-established by Martin Luther, 1517, Germany

Martin Luther didn't try to establish a new church but the get the existing one to reject its unbiblical traditions and to return to following the Bible.

Orthodox-Schismatic Catholic Bishops, 1054, Constantinople

Many of the churches under the authority of Constatinople were founded before the church at Rome so in rejecting this authority it was the church of Rome that was starting a new church.

And it goes on and on, now exceeding 30 000 proud-myself Bible interpreting Christian denominations worldwide! I am not proud. I am not inventing new theology or new religion.

You aren't inventing a new theology but you are defending one that is in error.

I follow Peter the Rock (first Pope) on which the Church was built.

So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the cornerstone, in whom the whole structure, being joined together, grows into a holy temple in the Lord. In him you also are being built together into a dwelling place for God by the Spirit.
(Ephesians 2:19-22 ESV)

The church was founded on all of the apostles and the prophets, not just on Peter alone.