Why Are We Even Here?

[WildHairedWoman]

Originally Posted by Centered

I often wonder what the point is, why exactly we are here on this plane of existence. If we come from an all knowing source, from the oneness, from an eternal with no end, then end up in this matrix of chaos that appears to be finite. What's the point?

Perhaps this is a popular ride, we all get in line to experience being human on planet earth. There is no learning if we come from an all knowing source, what is there to learn? But experience.

[Nicholas D'Arezzo]

Disregard this message......I'm trying to figure out how to navigate.

I can edit a message but I can't delete it.

Hence the pointless message.

[Busby]

Originally Posted by davidsun

The implication was that you thought the universe was 'yours' and that everyone else's universe was 'theirs' - the basic theme being 'me'-ness and 'mine'. The FACT however is that 'you', 'they' and 'we' are Its ex-press-ions and our lives are really It doing it's thang!

The Q of tnis thread would be better answered if one pondered it in terms of why is It, and what is It doing, here! Framing the Q in terms of why and what 'you' and other 'selves' are being-n-doing here is bound to result in 'your' coming up with a 'wrong' A (answer).


As though 'your' and 'our' 'conditions' were the Prime Creator. This is the 'Satanic' 'I'm 'number One' premise.

"We 'should have' 'finished' our journey eons ago", implies 'supreme' power on your/our part(s) - instead of 'understanding' that you/we are each and all part of a much 'greater' Life-Flow process and choosing to embrace and augment and maximize That.

Ego-ego-ego-e-GO!

'Your' and 'our' or 'my' 'conditions' are all we have when relating to our own or collective existence. We have our own individual physical presence and our own minds. Words like God, Soul, Satan, Spirit, Heaven and many others whether tending to be of a supernatural source or not can only be defined as personal reflections of a variety of innate understanding(s). There is no truth in any of those words as they stand, they all depend upon a personal mirroring. Each of the 8 billion POVs which exist on this planet at the moment can be said to be a correct assumption and an acceptance of the prevailing circumstances. Some people may well call this 'karma', whereas a better word could be 'evolution'.

As there is nothing else which lends itself to a better description of the 'now', then it's this 'now' which reflects reality. The only chance we have to understand what life means is to look at one's own life and experiences in order to discover the true meaning of MY world. Each person has a different world and any third party can exert its influence only by using the effects of that situation in which one finds oneself. One of these influences is called religion and hangs like a curtain over the stage of life. Hindering the sight of the actors in the play.
The real world is the one in our heads, the best thing to do is to call it (as we do) the mental world, calling it anything else (spirit, soul, god, hell) only leads to confusion.

All things stem from this mental world whether it be fish paste or the Eiffel Tower and you are the prime mover.

[davidsun]

Originally Posted by Busby

'Your' and 'our' or 'my' 'conditions' are all we have when relating to our own or collective existence. We have our own individual physical presence and our own minds. Words like God, Soul, Satan, Spirit, Heaven and many others whether tending to be of a supernatural source or not can only be defined as personal reflections of a variety of innate understanding(s). There is no truth in any of those words as they stand, they all depend upon a personal mirroring. Each of the 8 billion POVs which exist on this planet at the moment can be said to be a correct assumption and an acceptance of the prevailing circumstances. Some people may well call this 'karma', whereas a better word could be 'evolution'.

As there is nothing else which lends itself to a better description of the 'now', then it's this 'now' which reflects reality. The only chance we have to understand what life means is to look at one's own life and experiences in order to discover the true meaning of MY world. Each person has a different world and any third party can exert its influence only by using the effects of that situation in which one finds oneself. One of these influences is called religion and hangs like a curtain over the stage of life. Hindering the sight of the actors in the play.
The real world is the one in our heads, the best thing to do is to call it (as we do) the mental world, calling it anything else (spirit, soul, god, hell) only leads to confusion.

All things stem from this mental world whether it be fish paste or the Eiffel Tower and you are the prime mover.

There are truths and dynamics such as those you 'i'denfity as 'yours' and 'ours' - and then there are 'meta-truths' - just as there are physical and metaphysical dynamics and derivative experiences and happenings, consequently, related concepts and descriptions.

I 'get' and 'respect' the fact that the ones you express are genuinely yours, Busby, even as I assert that there is more worth considering than them alone.

[lemex]

Originally Posted by WildHairedWoman

Perhaps this is a popular ride, we all get in line to experience being human on planet earth. There is no learning if we come from an all knowing source, what is there to learn? But experience.

Maybe God to must experience to know. I know the perspective is it's always about consciousness here. There does though appear to be as much drama about both (different) planes.

Originally Posted by davidsun

Ahhh ... the 'I' am important (or unimportant, as the case may be - either way being the central point of) reference - of course.

And it's from that understanding that all else stems.

Originally Posted by Busby

Yes, of course, your simple question can be called 'getting down to brass tacks'. Your universe only exists because you are in it - just as, for instance, the Big Bang could only have happened if it had been observed.

Being in life is like being in an orchestra, only when the right vibrations begin do the actions turn into music and out of nothingness comes life.

Exactly, but keep that a secret because it turns Spirituality on its backside and few seem to want to cope with that for a concept. It's easier to think "That was a negative experience" than it is to think "What the hell am I creating here?"


In Africa they have a saying - "Ubuntu." It mean I am because we are.

[Busby]

Originally Posted by davidsun

There are truths and dynamics such as those you 'i'denfity as 'yours' and 'ours' - and then there are 'meta-truths' - just as there are physical and metaphysical dynamics and derivative experiences and happenings, consequently, related concepts and descriptions.

I 'get' and 'respect' the fact that the ones you express are genuinely yours, Busby, even as I assert that there is more worth considering than them alone.

Yes, of course there is 'more' than simply being in life. But exactly the word 'meta' sums up the whole confused evolved situation. Since man first started to observe (in whatever manner) his/her existence upon this planet an assumption of an existing, forming, guiding, watching supernatural 'being' has filled the world with a thousand different beliefs, belief systems, books, words, threats, blackmail, punishments and deaths. Mankind's collective imagination has created a whole world of false information. Had 'meta' been that then which it slowly now seems to be showing - to be namely (for want of a better word) a field - an energy field, one which appears to most of us sometimes as actually being an absurdity. By absurd I mean all the things that happen which lie outside logic: all that which we term 'the supernatural' such as poltergeists, apparitions, Fatimas of all kinds, spontaneous healings, stigmatas, maybe OBEs, NDEs and so on. All of which leave us in no doubt that there is something which we are not seeing or do not recognise. Of this I personally have no doubt for I have on (exact number known) been absolutely dumbfounded and for which I consider myself fortunate.
We have wasted centuries up in the clouds, now our information filled universe is starting to appear embedded in potentials which we have yet to discern. This potential lies in that second side of us called 'the mental world' otherwise known as mind.

[davidsun]

I thought this might be a good place to share this:

Creation Hymn from the Rig Veda

Before the creation of this universe,
There was neither being nor not-being,
Neither sky nor the heavens beyond...
There was only water unfathomably deep.

There was neither death nor immortality,
Nor demarcation between night and day,
That One alone breathed in its own bliss,
And by its own power, in spite of the absolute vacuum.
Nothing else was there.

In the beginning there was darkness everywhere,
Enveloping the waters.
All that existed was void and formless.
Then, by the power of thought alone,
That One gave birth to itself.

The first born was the Creative Energy,
The primordial seed of the mind.
It is through this energy that seers,
After long searching in the inmost chambers of their hearts,
Discovered the Supreme Spirit
Which joins the seen with the unseen.

This self-shining Spirit was everywhere,
In and through the universe; above and below it.
Primal seeds were sprouting, mighty forces moving,
Pulsation below, pure energy above.

Who here knows? Who can say for sure?
When it began and from where it came -- this creation?...
He who watches everything from the highest heaven,
Only He knows -- or perhaps even He does not know!

- Translated by Mark Mason, from Chapter 18 of his book
In Search of the Loving God.


the above was copied from:
http://markmason.net/chchoice.htm

More good stuff references on that page. Lots more on Mark Mason's website.

[Phaelyn]

I think we are where we belong, and looking around at what is here, that means I need to change what I am so I belong somewhere else.