Reincarnations Do we have a Choice ?

Nope, Just don't see the point in this discussion. Besides, I've run into far more than your "one person on a thread" issue. Just not inclined to argue points that have no merrit in my estimation. Much like christians, I gave up on that particular dogma some time ago. It's really a waste of time as they have chosen, (yes, they had a choice before this life experience) as they are intrenched in their belief, there is no point in a continuation of such. It is thier choice and I simply won't go too far out of my way to encourage them to think outside the box. It's really a waste of energy.

I believe we keep coming back, to learn and grow in spirit, until we are ready to ascend to the next level.

I believe we must come back until we are ready to ascend, but I am not certain about our choices of when, where, and what form. Once we are human, can we live life as something else for a lifetime, then come back to human? Does that promote any growth or knowledge of perspective?

Originally Posted by dhaga

I believe we keep coming back, to learn and grow in spirit, until we are ready to ascend to the next level.

I believe we must come back until we are ready to ascend, but I am not certain about our choices of when, where, and what form. Once we are human, can we live life as something else for a lifetime, then come back to human? Does that promote any growth or knowledge of perspective?

This seems to be a bone of contention with at least one other in this particular thread. Yes, I believe you're right for the most part. We are actually multidimensional beings and can exist on many planes at the same time. For further information, one of Seth's books covers that quite nicely. If you're not familiar with Seth, he is a nonphysical entity who had many life experiences and has attained a higher level of consciousness, much like you stated. He dictated(channeled) many lessons through a person named Jane Roberts. The particular book that describes multidimensional existences is "Seth Speaks". The most recent channeling of Seth here at my place (a couple of weeks ago), he said that he had had 48 life experiences ("give or take").

Mostly, if we chose to come back into the human experience, we do have an opportunity to review any previous experiences that we had. After considering what we did or did not acomplish, we can then decide what it is we hope to do in the next experience. As described previously, we can come back into whatever circumstance we decide. Some have chosen to just experience birth and then return. Some to experience a multitude of various issues. Being wealthy, sick or just to experience life. Seth wanted to experience being poor and came back to many children, all with different fathers and begging in the street. Since his other experiences had included wealth and good health, he decided he wanted to experience poverty.



Someone else stated that earth is the least desireable because of the lack of evolution here. As I have learned from my master teacher, we are by far the least evolved beings in the universe. So it is quite the challenge.

Anyway, as I understand it from my spiritual teacher, we are in many different realities all at the same time. Why have just one existence when there are so many to chose from?

[Perspective]

Originally Posted by WhiteDevil

makes me wonder, if you do choose, why do people choose to be ugly?, or born in poor or wortorn countries? or why would you choose to be born with terminal illness? or disability?


I've always had a thought that these could maybe be punishments for bad things you did in a previous life? who knows. this world could actually be the hell so many christian god followers are afraid of.

I was taught that we did choose & had an idea of what our life would be like...
& that "there must be opposition in all things."
We all have challenges... some harder than others...
The way I see it is those who have harder challenges either
1. Have a strong capacity to deal with it (esp. those who's struggles are inflicted by others)
or
2. Struggle with reality (esp. those who create struggles for themselves)

I don't believe in divine punishment...
More like... you run against a brick wall & you get hurt! Consequences to actions.
Maybe what determines who we become (as far as reincarnation)...
is our energy in previous lives... How we incorporated or harmonized struggles with our eternal spiritual selves...

[Internal Queries]

Originally Posted by Baldr44

Nope, Just don't see the point in this discussion. Besides, I've run into far more than your "one person on a thread" issue. Just not inclined to argue points that have no merrit in my estimation. Much like christians, I gave up on that particular dogma some time ago. It's really a waste of time as they have chosen, (yes, they had a choice before this life experience) as they are intrenched in their belief, there is no point in a continuation of such. It is thier choice and I simply won't go too far out of my way to encourage them to think outside the box. It's really a waste of energy.

i agree that it's pointless to offer differing perspectives to someone who is entrenched in their dogma. some folks just can't think outside the box in which they have so much invested. years of study and research, 5000 word theses, PHDs riding on 10,000 word dissertations and metaphysical counceling degrees framed and hanging on the wall can close anyones' mind after awhile.

ah well ... since energy can neither be created or destroyed it can't really be wasted either.

Originally Posted by Internal Queries

i agree that it's pointless to offer differing perspectives to someone who is entrenched in their dogma. some folks just can't think outside the box in which they have so much invested. years of study and research, 5000 word theses, PHDs riding on 10,000 word dissertations and metaphysical counceling degrees framed and hanging on the wall can close anyones' mind after awhile.

ah well ... since energy can neither be created or destroyed it can't really be wasted either.

Well again you go off the deep end, did I not say in a previous post that I would look into it? You certainly have enough right here in this very same thread to say that there are others who believe as I do. Yet I don't see much in the way of your belief. My metaphysical education has included many aspects of metaphysical inquiry including Western Religions, Yoga, Wicca, Hypnosis, Qabalah, Chakras & Auras, Shamanism, Pranayama, Crystals and Gemstones, Astrology, Wizzards-Adepts-Mystery Schools, Divination, Taoist Healing Arts, Reincarnation, Meditation Skils, Shadow Work, Enneagram, Psychic Skills, Witchcraft, Herbs and Natural Medicine, Angels, Gods-Goddesses & Mythology, Archetypes, Mantras & Mudras, Spiritual Symbols & Colors, Great Spiritual Masters and Teachers, Dreams and Dreaming, Channeling, Native American Studies (I'm part Cherokee) and Phenomena to name a few, over 80 courses in all. I wouldn't go so far as to say that I'm entrenched in Dogma when I have spent the last four years in study of almost every aspect of metaphysical beliefs. Seems to me that you have the closed mind. No offense intended just an observation.
In Love and Light
Jake

[Internal Queries]

Originally Posted by Baldr44

Well again you go off the deep end, did I not say in a previous post that I would look into it? You certainly have enough right here in this very same thread to say that there are others who believe as I do. Yet I don't see much in the way of your belief. My metaphysical education has included many aspects of metaphysical inquiry including Western Religions, Yoga, Wicca, Hypnosis, Qabalah, Chakras & Auras, Shamanism, Pranayama, Crystals and Gemstones, Astrology, Wizzards-Adepts-Mystery Schools, Divination, Taoist Healing Arts, Reincarnation, Meditation Skils, Shadow Work, Enneagram, Psychic Skills, Witchcraft, Herbs and Natural Medicine, Angels, Gods-Goddesses & Mythology, Archetypes, Mantras & Mudras, Spiritual Symbols & Colors, Great Spiritual Masters and Teachers, Dreams and Dreaming, Channeling, Native American Studies (I'm part Cherokee) and Phenomena to name a few, over 80 courses in all. I wouldn't go so far as to say that I'm entrenched in Dogma when I have spent the last four years in study of almost every aspect of metaphysical beliefs. Seems to me that you have the closed mind. No offense intended just an observation.
In Love and Light
Jake

all that is very nice and all but i quit being impressed with populist fallacies long ago. the fact that many others believe as you do doesn't mean that what you and those many others believe is "The Truth". though i didn't go so far as to get credentials (pffft! paperwork does not wisdom make) i too spend many years studying cultural myths and religious concepts, metaphysics and psy phenom, crystals, Law of Attraction, assorted mediation techniques, mediums, channelling and etc. i studied under and studied gurus too. **shrug** and then i tossed it ALL out because none of if was coming directly or originally from me, from my personal experiences, from my spirit. i was working from preconceived notions, concepts created by other people from their perspectives. i realized that these "masters" and gurus and teachers were no more equipped to know "The Truth" than i was so i wiped the slate clean and started from scratch. and that's why you "don't see much in the way of my belief". my concepts come directly and in originality from my own inner explorations ... not from the perspectives of someone else.

i no longer believe one can dictate to the Universe how It manifests vibrations of consciousness and Selfhood or anything else but good luck with your endeavors to do so.

Internal, it's true - a piece of paper does not create wisdom, but then neither does self-study necessarily. You say that your concepts come "directly and in originality from my own inner explorations", but what you don't seem to get is that EVERYONE'S concepts and beliefs come that way if they THINK. It matters not through which channel they come, only that they come. Widsom can be achieved by reading a simple line in a book, or overhearing a casual conversation at the supermarket checkout, which will send the thinking person off to consider, question, analyse, and delve into their own "inner explorations", just as a good teacher may have done for Baldr, or listening closely to clients for many years has done for me.
Life is not a competition Internal - we're not competing to discover who is wiser than who. No-one wins any medals for being more spiritual than anyone else. In fact, the wisest person recognises that everyone has their own path to the same destination, and must walk that path only. Those who continually tell others they are on the wrong path are actually straying off their own to do so.
Let's all just agree to differ and accept that we'll all get to the same place eventually, and also recognise that everything - even your own reality - is the result of each person's perception.
when you look at the leaves of a tree, do you KNOW for sure that the green you see is the same green I see? Maybe what I see, you would call purple and Baldr would recognise as red. We might just all be calling it green because that's what everyone else calls that particular color we see! That doesn't make any of us wrong ... just different. And viva la difference.

Originally Posted by Internal Queries

all that is very nice and all but i quit being impressed with populist fallacies long ago. the fact that many others believe as you do doesn't mean that what you and those many others believe is "The Truth". though i didn't go so far as to get credentials (pffft! paperwork does not wisdom make) i too spend many years studying cultural myths and religious concepts, metaphysics and psy phenom, crystals, Law of Attraction, assorted mediation techniques, mediums, channelling and etc. i studied under and studied gurus too. **shrug** and then i tossed it ALL out because none of if was coming directly or originally from me, from my personal experiences, from my spirit. i was working from preconceived notions, concepts created by other people from their perspectives. i realized that these "masters" and gurus and teachers were no more equipped to know "The Truth" than i was so i wiped the slate clean and started from scratch. and that's why you "don't see much in the way of my belief". my concepts come directly and in originality from my own inner explorations ... not from the perspectives of someone else.

i no longer believe one can dictate to the Universe how It manifests vibrations of consciousness and Selfhood or anything else but good luck with your endeavors to do so.

I believe you missed my point. I have spent time looking into other areas to specifically avoid dogma. Dogma as defined is "Dogma is the established belief or doctrine held by a religion, or by extension by some other group or organization. It is authoritative and not to be disputed, doubted, or diverged from, by the practitioner or believers." Yet I firmly believe that everyone is entitled to his/her own beliefs. The dogma of christianity leaves no one alone if possible. Much like another on this forum who crams scripture into others at every opportunity. I have a belief but not dogmatic in it.

By the definition of dogma, you have disputed my belief and I have not told you that you are wrong, you might even be right but not yet in my understanding.

What I hear you saying is that education is a waste of time. Learning others beliefs are not in your best interest. It is to me because to understand a persons belief structure is to understand the person and where they are coming from. To help a person is to know the person first and their belief is critical to that understanding. However it doesn't appear that you are coming from a helper standpoint. A light worker helps people out of darkness, without knowing the dark, how can you help with the light?

Originally Posted by SandybytheSea

Internal, it's true - a piece of paper does not create wisdom, but then neither does self-study necessarily. You say that your concepts come "directly and in originality from my own inner explorations", but what you don't seem to get is that EVERYONE'S concepts and beliefs come that way if they THINK.

I've been watching this conversation since it started and wasn't going to get involved but what the heck.... I can relate to what you're saying Sandy but
I'm more drawn to Internals trajectory.

"Thinking" can be as much a problem as it can be a benefit. What we think about something doesn't make it so. Thought itself is an observation of
shadows cast by the event or by the concepts we're entertaining, and yet without the direct unfiltered-intuitive-connection to what's being
observed/discussed this process of thinking can be as much about separation as it can be awareness.

Thought, needs to be approached with disciplined objectivity... there's a distinct need for sober assessments, with little to no sacred cows . If someones
thoughts have taken them to the point where they're highly religious then the stuff that they see around them will be defined in that manor.

There is only one tool that we have to work with that's up for the task of leading us out of the madness of random associations. And that's what I'm
watching Internal attempting to describe. We need to be clear... we're needing to clear-out our thoughts-about-things and replace it with direct
interaction.

We'll still be thinking about what we're doing and thinking about what we're encountering daily, but doing so with the knowing that thoughts are
the byproduct of an event, they can as easily get in the way as be helpful.

I'm watching Internal expressing this realization using the words that seem to apply. His observation suggest that our study-of-self needs to go
beyond words in order to get to the core harmonics that hums just below the surface of physical consciousness... we can best approach this from
the inside... while concepts/thoughts-themselves are externally experienced.

It appears you have a great connection with your own inner self Sandy! So I'm certainly not challenging that! :^) But sometimes we give credit to
how we're thinking-about-things as being the "solid" behind our perceptions.. I like to give credit where credit is due... I suspect you're
closer to Internal's take on this than you realize... :^)