Wanting some (guys mainly but not only)opinions on my situation. (

[7luminaries]

Originally Posted by H:O:R:A:C:E

the mating game is a game. personally, i'm not interested in the dramas.
[edit: i nearly missed the "not", lol]
the circumstances of things are irrelevant to the relationship.
if you were to develop "unconditional love", it would survive any circumstance.
there is no particular trick to establishing an "unconditional love" relationship.
(there are no circumstances that can be orchestrated to provide it... it has no conditions, meaning any/all circumstances).
don't fret over incidentals of any kind - they none of them have any merit.
^ this is all predicated on the notion that you're seeking "unconditional love".
and why settle for anything less than the genuine article?

Fairfre...I feel for you & good luck on handling this. Personally, I think you should get a restraining order or similar. Often it is valid for several months, even if not indefinitely. The main thing is that it is "on the record" and he is suspect numero uno if there is even the slightest hint of trouble in your court. The implicit threat of violence is removed as all will know who the likely culprit is. If his parents are also violent, include them as well and have them all served.

As to advice on why the gent didn't call back...you've received a lot of good advice but this from HORACE is the best IMO...spot on. Most gents aren't going to be seriously interested, and most lack even the appropriate orientation toward others. Meaning that they can't be bothered to engage deeply and get to know others beyond superficial levels. Without engagement and a desire to know, appreciate, and love another authentically as a person and as a friend first, he or she will never come to know, appreciate, and love another as an intimate partner. Another way of looking at it is, they want a lot of something (your sex, sexual fidelity, time, energy, emotional support, and even your love...whatever puts you at their disposal, basically) for basically nothing or very little contributed on their part. Not a very good or healthy arrangement, is it? particularly for you.

So don't sweat it and don't sweat 95-99% of the gents you'll date who are put off by anything they'd really have to love a person to tolerate or endure or deal with. You only care to meet and engage with the 1-5%, and the vast majority of those, only ever in friendship. Only a very, very few in this lifetime will you likely truly resonate with in an authentically loving and committed intimate partnership. Contrary to mainstream culture and to the vast majority of gents' expectations and even outright demands, it's simply not your job to give out sex, bootlicking, and various intimate favours to any of the 99%. Even those whom you can actually respect as persons and friends. As opposed to those multitudes who favour just dating/shagging/roadtesting and relying on the old "you commit to me sexually and emotionally but as for me, let's see how it all plays out, baby" approach.

IMO, the world would be a much healthier and less screwed-up place if men got off the crack of easy sex and accepted that women would not (and should not be expected to) sleep with men without authentic love and commitment between them as persons, as friends, and as partners, all. AND if women did not give out sex like crack hos desperate for any sort of connection or relationship, but rather led men in the direction of getting clean, one and all. Allowing for all to lead with the heart rather than with the desperation of blind or fearful ego, or the insatiable demands of male gonads hooked on crack.

Think of your ex as actually doing you a favour in this situation, believe it or not. When you're well clear of him and his nasty fam in future, then you can focus a bit more on sorting the 4% as your very dear friends from the 1% (or less) with whom you could truly become connected to emotionally in an authentic love of the partnership variety. Someone who's taken time to get to know & love you as you, with whom you are giving and receiving the same quality and level of love and commitment in kind. None of this can be ascertained on the first date, nor on the 10th. On the 100th (i.e., probably after 6 months or more), however, your odds of truly knowing and loving one another as persons and friends are far better, as is going forward with any sort of intimate aspect to your relationship. For certain though, anyone who can't be bothered to give you another go after a courteous first date and an honest reveal is not even worth a second thought.

And again, you need to recall that most of this is not about you at all, in the case of many you will meet. That is, the vast majority of single and uncommitted men will not be authentically seeking your best or your good. Rather you are more of an untapped sexual potential which many will seek to exploit or "tap" (shag) if they can do so with little to no real engagement or energy on their part. These gents will not be interested in the level of engagement and authenticity required by a true friendship with you, much less by a true authentically loving and committed partnership. For far too many, the fact that you have a vagina means that they simply won't spend time getting to know and love you as a person...many have in effect closed that door in their adult relationships with women due to their oppressive demands for sex and bootlicking up front or very early on, far, far in advance of any true love, friendship, or real caring.

I have a lot of male acquaintances and a few close male friends. Across a variety of ages and personalities. Despite that I am extremely reserved, most have expressed interest in dating and even in a relationship, although they are not for me in that way. However I do trust that they care for me and have my best at heart. I also have a lot of male relatives, and our family all generally get on very well and most are close and sincerely caring. All the men I trust have been honest and in agreement on this point. Even gents on coffee dates, total strangers whom I wouldn't trust otherwise, have agreed on this point. Most say it's 95% opportunist to 5% serious (regarding single and unattached men in their orientation toward women), whilst some of the older gens (70+) have offered 90/10. I share this freely with women in a variety of settings because often men are not honest on this point and bro code and similar things can tend to obscure the truth.

It is what it is, and this is simply where many are spiritually and emotionally. Women must share in the full responsibility for this situation at present, every time they get emotionally and physically involved with someone who offers less than authentic love and a meaningful commitment. This 95% orientation (opportunist) for single and unattached men, for the most part, only changes if the gent himself consciously changes it & moves into the 5% orientation (serious), and EVEN THEN, it only applies to YOU if he has also taken the time to get to know you personally, and EVEN THEN, only if he is mature enough to honour and rise to the love in his heart...to manifesting his love and commitment day-to-day. Etc. As you can see, 1% is very possibly high.

All this is to say, don't worry about it...be who you are and don't focus on trying to sort why the 99% of singletons don't, won't, or can't be an authentically loving and committed partner, even whilst many would hook up or even shack up with you long-term in a heartbeat. I would also say don't underestimate authentically loving friendships of either sex -- these are more precious than gold (or rubies, LOL!), as they say.

Bottom line, if you are interested in authentic love in all your relationships (whether with fam, friends, and in committed partnership), then the less time you spend with those who are not out for your best, the better. And the more time you have for yourself, your family, your groups, interests, and causes, and of course for your nearest and dearest friends.

Peace & blessings,
and much love and light
7L

[TheGlow]

Thank you for the post.

Originally Posted by 7luminaries

Fairfre...I feel for you & good luck on handling this. Personally, I think you should get a restraining order or similar. Often it is valid for several months, even if not indefinitely. The main thing is that it is "on the record" and he is suspect numero uno if there is even the slightest hint of trouble in your court. The implicit threat of violence is removed as all will know who the likely culprit is. If his parents are also violent, include them as well and have them all served.

As to advice on why the gent didn't call back...you've received a lot of good advice but this from HORACE is the best IMO...spot on. Most gents aren't going to be seriously interested, and most lack even the appropriate orientation toward others. Meaning that they can't be bothered to engage deeply and get to know others beyond superficial levels. Without engagement and a desire to know, appreciate, and love another authentically as a person and as a friend first, he or she will never come to know, appreciate, and love another as an intimate partner. Another way of looking at it is, they want a lot of something (your sex, sexual fidelity, time, energy, emotional support, and even your love...whatever puts you at their disposal, basically) for basically nothing or very little contributed on their part. Not a very good or healthy arrangement, is it? particularly for you.

So don't sweat it and don't sweat 95-99% of the gents you'll date who are put off by anything they'd really have to love a person to tolerate or endure or deal with. You only care to meet and engage with the 1-5%, and the vast majority of those, only ever in friendship. Only a very, very few in this lifetime will you likely truly resonate with in an authentically loving and committed intimate partnership. Contrary to mainstream culture and to the vast majority of gents' expectations and even outright demands, it's simply not your job to give out sex, bootlicking, and various intimate favours to any of the 99%. Even those whom you can actually respect as persons and friends. As opposed to those multitudes who favour just dating/shagging/roadtesting and relying on the old "you commit to me sexually and emotionally but as for me, let's see how it all plays out, baby" approach.

IMO, the world would be a much healthier and less screwed-up place if men got off the crack of easy sex and accepted that women would not (and should not be expected to) sleep with men without authentic love and commitment between them as persons, as friends, and as partners, all. AND if women did not give out sex like crack hos desperate for any sort of connection or relationship, but rather led men in the direction of getting clean, one and all. Allowing for all to lead with the heart rather than with the desperation of blind or fearful ego, or the insatiable demands of male gonads hooked on crack.

Think of your ex as actually doing you a favour in this situation, believe it or not. When you're well clear of him and his nasty fam in future, then you can focus a bit more on sorting the 4% as your very dear friends from the 1% (or less) with whom you could truly become connected to emotionally in an authentic love of the partnership variety. Someone who's taken time to get to know & love you as you, with whom you are giving and receiving the same quality and level of love and commitment in kind. None of this can be ascertained on the first date, nor on the 10th. On the 100th (i.e., probably after 6 months or more), however, your odds of truly knowing and loving one another as persons and friends are far better, as is going forward with any sort of intimate aspect to your relationship. For certain though, anyone who can't be bothered to give you another go after a courteous first date and an honest reveal is not even worth a second thought.

And again, you need to recall that most of this is not about you at all, in the case of many you will meet. That is, the vast majority of single and uncommitted men will not be authentically seeking your best or your good. Rather you are more of an untapped sexual potential which many will seek to exploit or "tap" (shag) if they can do so with little to no real engagement or energy on their part. These gents will not be interested in the level of engagement and authenticity required by a true friendship with you, much less by a true authentically loving and committed partnership. For far too many, the fact that you have a vagina means that they simply won't spend time getting to know and love you as a person...many have in effect closed that door in their adult relationships with women due to their oppressive demands for sex and bootlicking up front or very early on, far, far in advance of any true love, friendship, or real caring.

I have a lot of male acquaintances and a few close male friends. Across a variety of ages and personalities. Despite that I am extremely reserved, most have expressed interest in dating and even in a relationship, although they are not for me in that way. However I do trust that they care for me and have my best at heart. I also have a lot of male relatives, and our family all generally get on very well and most are close and sincerely caring. All the men I trust have been honest and in agreement on this point. Even gents on coffee dates, total strangers whom I wouldn't trust otherwise, have agreed on this point. Most say it's 95% opportunist to 5% serious (regarding single and unattached men in their orientation toward women), whilst some of the older gens (70+) have offered 90/10. I share this freely with women in a variety of settings because often men are not honest on this point and bro code and similar things can tend to obscure the truth.

It is what it is, and this is simply where many are spiritually and emotionally. Women must share in the full responsibility for this situation at present, every time they get emotionally and physically involved with someone who offers less than authentic love and a meaningful commitment. This 95% orientation (opportunist) for single and unattached men, for the most part, only changes if the gent himself consciously changes it & moves into the 5% orientation (serious), and EVEN THEN, it only applies to YOU if he has also taken the time to get to know you personally, and EVEN THEN, only if he is mature enough to honour and rise to the love in his heart...to manifesting his love and commitment day-to-day. Etc. As you can see, 1% is very possibly high.

All this is to say, don't worry about it...be who you are and don't focus on trying to sort why the 99% of singletons don't, won't, or can't be an authentically loving and committed partner, even whilst many would hook up or even shack up with you long-term in a heartbeat. I would also say don't underestimate authentically loving friendships of either sex -- these are more precious than gold, as they say.

Bottom line, if you are interested in authentic love in all your relationships (whether with fam, friends, and in committed partnership), then the less time you spend with those who are not out for your best, the better. And the more time you have for yourself, your family, your groups, interests, and causes, and of course for your nearest and dearest friends.

Peace & blessings,
and much love and light
7L

[7luminaries]

You're very welcome!

Peace & blessings,
7L

[Fairfre]

Originally Posted by PeteC-UK

Hi Folks..

Hmm...it would NOT put me off - people have all kinds of "baggage" and part of the thrill of anew love interest,IS finding this all about aboutthem,gettng to know thm INTIMATELY - is it not..?..

if the guy wants a SERIOUS relationship with you,then that first date incident shouldnt matter at all..The fact he now blanks you,tellsme he is just a player,wanting cheap thrills - its probably a good thng he hasnt repsonded..IF he was willing to put up wih this "baggage",he would hae dealt with it there and then - thats what mst blokes do with such confrontation - especially as on the first date he would wish to impress you - were it me,I would have asked how you feel about this ex ruinng our date - and if you agreed,then probably would have walked over to him and played his own gane - "listen mate,she is dating ME now,back off or get hurt" - especially if he walked past once,and you explain the situation to me - if he comes back again and pushes it,thens time to push back,IF IM interested in the girl,that is....

Fact is here htough,this guy is NOT interested in YOU,but probably just your body - he didnt respond at the time - didnt d anyhting about the situation at all - and at first opportunity,he ran for the hills,as it were...Bit of a "pussy" date - sure you wanna bloke like that anyway..??..

And speaking AS a bloke - your ex is ONLY doing that behaviour because you are ALLOWING him to get away with it..I mean - why even "nod" or acknowldge him at all...Why encourage him or give him ANY hiope at all..?..Same advise - go up to him,CONFRONT HIM for a change - "whats YOUR problem,do one before I lose my temper with you - you treated me like sh*t and if you think there is remotest chance of us EVER gettng back to gether,then you are a snivelling little fool - go cry somewhere else as you aint NEVER getitng this prize again"....Make it loud and draw lots of attention - plenty of that head bobbing you women do so well - sarcastic intense scathing - throw in a few "putmedowns" as apropraite - tell the people around of his tiny manhood for instance,that kind of thing,you know - "really finger boy - you cant satisfy me anyway,I need a REAL man" - as you wave your little pinky in his face..lol..rant and get it all out..You get the idea..

Do THAT in public and humiliate him so - I guarantee he wont be back to ruin any more first dates...

Hello Pete C .
That was the first time I have ever acknowledged him in ten years ,the big bust up was ten years ago. I have always turned my back to him and chatted to others, but he has always continued to stare. I know this because whoever I'm with tell me that they don't like the way he looks at me and that it is disturbing.(that was with girlfriends).This time he was almost in my face and I figured since he was married now, he had moved on, and it was ok ,for just a nod.
Maybe that was wrong to do so, I don't know. I don't believe that is giving him hope.
Interestingly, a guy I was in an 18 mth relationship with got riled by my ex and was getting up to deck him. He knew me and the score with my ex when that happened.
But it was a FWB relationship. We both knew that ..no commitment or love to speak of..(so not that into me )..to espouse if he was ,he would do such and such.
He was offended at how my ex treated me.
Just saying it was interesting.I do appreciate your comments.

I expect I'll get some judgemental comments about the FWB thing but I'm not interested in responding to those.

[Fairfre]

For the record, because there is confusion with some folks.
My ex never physically abused me.
His father and step mother did.
My ex and all his family (including his father and step mother)between them ,verbally and mentally abused me.



Also it was my ex that finally ended the relationship.

[Fairfre]

Originally Posted by teak.

Yes. And I can't really blame him. Not that it's your fault, but who wants to deal with someone else's ex?

Teak
Thanks for the concise ,polite, non-accusatory response.

[Fairfre]

Originally Posted by HopeForever

Hi Fairfre,

I am a woman, but because I've been stalked by a sorta ex before I feel compelled to respond.
Firstly, wow, to have your ex show up at your first date with someone is just....crazy. It's a really tough situation to be in...I think it's important to consider what you said about being abused by your ex. Sounds like he was violent and sounds like you've been through a lot of pain
Ok maybe your history includes a crazy ex, but that doesn't say much about you in the end. If anything it says you're a very strong woman for going through such an experience and dealing with it the best you can.
If you're date was uncomfortable with the situation and was into you he should just be honest and say something rather than keep quiet.
From a spiritual perspective..I do think that this could be a test....if the universe sends you your ex while you're trying to move forward it could be a test to see if you're ready for this or not. Or a warning that you are not ready. The "ego" may have a fit and say of course I'm ready but maybe there is a part of you that isn't. I like to think as every person we encounter, good or bad, as a reflection of a part of yourself, good part or a wound.
I'll give you my own example, I spent the last year focused on a guy whom I had strong feelings for. I feel like I'm letting him go but that's because he's far away. I've developed a crush on a new guy. Now I don't know what will happen but if I were on a date with new guy crush and guy from past suddenly showed up, to be honest, I don't know how I'd react. The truth is that I would probably go back to old feelings if I'm honest with myself.

Hi HopeForever.
Nice to see someone that can differentiate between me and the crazy ex situation. Much appreciated.
Date guy wasn't really quiet. He was quite offended on my behalf and had a lot to say.
Maybe it is a test I don't know..a ten year long one..it's testing times generally ,thats for sure.
��

[Fairfre]

Originally Posted by 7luminaries

Fairfre...I feel for you & good luck on handling this. Personally, I think you should get a restraining order or similar. Often it is valid for several months, even if not indefinitely. The main thing is that it is "on the record" and he is suspect numero uno if there is even the slightest hint of trouble in your court. The implicit threat of violence is removed as all will know who the likely culprit is. If his parents are also violent, include them as well and have them all served.

As to advice on why the gent didn't call back...you've received a lot of good advice but this from HORACE is the best IMO...spot on. Most gents aren't going to be seriously interested, and most lack even the appropriate orientation toward others. Meaning that they can't be bothered to engage deeply and get to know others beyond superficial levels. Without engagement and a desire to know, appreciate, and love another authentically as a person and as a friend first, he or she will never come to know, appreciate, and love another as an intimate partner. Another way of looking at it is, they want a lot of something (your sex, sexual fidelity, time, energy, emotional support, and even your love...whatever puts you at their disposal, basically) for basically nothing or very little contributed on their part. Not a very good or healthy arrangement, is it? particularly for you.

So don't sweat it and don't sweat 95-99% of the gents you'll date who are put off by anything they'd really have to love a person to tolerate or endure or deal with. You only care to meet and engage with the 1-5%, and the vast majority of those, only ever in friendship. Only a very, very few in this lifetime will you likely truly resonate with in an authentically loving and committed intimate partnership. Contrary to mainstream culture and to the vast majority of gents' expectations and even outright demands, it's simply not your job to give out sex, bootlicking, and various intimate favours to any of the 99%. Even those whom you can actually respect as persons and friends. As opposed to those multitudes who favour just dating/shagging/roadtesting and relying on the old "you commit to me sexually and emotionally but as for me, let's see how it all plays out, baby" approach.

IMO, the world would be a much healthier and less screwed-up place if men got off the crack of easy sex and accepted that women would not (and should not be expected to) sleep with men without authentic love and commitment between them as persons, as friends, and as partners, all. AND if women did not give out sex like crack hos desperate for any sort of connection or relationship, but rather led men in the direction of getting clean, one and all. Allowing for all to lead with the heart rather than with the desperation of blind or fearful ego, or the insatiable demands of male gonads hooked on crack.

Think of your ex as actually doing you a favour in this situation, believe it or not. When you're well clear of him and his nasty fam in future, then you can focus a bit more on sorting the 4% as your very dear friends from the 1% (or less) with whom you could truly become connected to emotionally in an authentic love of the partnership variety. Someone who's taken time to get to know & love you as you, with whom you are giving and receiving the same quality and level of love and commitment in kind. None of this can be ascertained on the first date, nor on the 10th. On the 100th (i.e., probably after 6 months or more), however, your odds of truly knowing and loving one another as persons and friends are far better, as is going forward with any sort of intimate aspect to your relationship. For certain though, anyone who can't be bothered to give you another go after a courteous first date and an honest reveal is not even worth a second thought.

And again, you need to recall that most of this is not about you at all, in the case of many you will meet. That is, the vast majority of single and uncommitted men will not be authentically seeking your best or your good. Rather you are more of an untapped sexual potential which many will seek to exploit or "tap" (shag) if they can do so with little to no real engagement or energy on their part. These gents will not be interested in the level of engagement and authenticity required by a true friendship with you, much less by a true authentically loving and committed partnership. For far too many, the fact that you have a vagina means that they simply won't spend time getting to know and love you as a person...many have in effect closed that door in their adult relationships with women due to their oppressive demands for sex and bootlicking up front or very early on, far, far in advance of any true love, friendship, or real caring.

I have a lot of male acquaintances and a few close male friends. Across a variety of ages and personalities. Despite that I am extremely reserved, most have expressed interest in dating and even in a relationship, although they are not for me in that way. However I do trust that they care for me and have my best at heart. I also have a lot of male relatives, and our family all generally get on very well and most are close and sincerely caring. All the men I trust have been honest and in agreement on this point. Even gents on coffee dates, total strangers whom I wouldn't trust otherwise, have agreed on this point. Most say it's 95% opportunist to 5% serious (regarding single and unattached men in their orientation toward women), whilst some of the older gens (70+) have offered 90/10. I share this freely with women in a variety of settings because often men are not honest on this point and bro code and similar things can tend to obscure the truth.

It is what it is, and this is simply where many are spiritually and emotionally. Women must share in the full responsibility for this situation at present, every time they get emotionally and physically involved with someone who offers less than authentic love and a meaningful commitment. This 95% orientation (opportunist) for single and unattached men, for the most part, only changes if the gent himself consciously changes it & moves into the 5% orientation (serious), and EVEN THEN, it only applies to YOU if he has also taken the time to get to know you personally, and EVEN THEN, only if he is mature enough to honour and rise to the love in his heart...to manifesting his love and commitment day-to-day. Etc. As you can see, 1% is very possibly high.

All this is to say, don't worry about it...be who you are and don't focus on trying to sort why the 99% of singletons don't, won't, or can't be an authentically loving and committed partner, even whilst many would hook up or even shack up with you long-term in a heartbeat. I would also say don't underestimate authentically loving friendships of either sex -- these are more precious than gold (or rubies, LOL!), as they say.

Bottom line, if you are interested in authentic love in all your relationships (whether with fam, friends, and in committed partnership), then the less time you spend with those who are not out for your best, the better. And the more time you have for yourself, your family, your groups, interests, and causes, and of course for your nearest and dearest friends.

Peace & blessings,
and much love and light
7L

7luminaries
It's not that I don't understand you ,but that what your saying is completely unnecessary.
You seem to think I need explained how men are /the world is/love.

I don't .

and Please don't assume I'm "sweating" anything.
I made a simple enquiry of folks..my choice.
I do appreciate your good intentions however ,but your concern is misplaced.
Thank you.

[Celera]

I think it's fairly common to enjoy a first date and think, as the evening is ending, that you might want to see the person again, and then, on reflection, decide that the relationship isn't one you want to pursue after all. And I can certainly imagine thinking that after a first date, "well she was nice but not so nice that I want to get caught up in some drama with stalker ex and his prominent and influential family." Of course, when there is love in a relationship, you go through difficult times together, but he hasn't invested that much yet.

Has this stalking ever gone any further, any direct contact or threats? Does the ex's wife know about it? Is relocation an option for you?

Sorry you are having to deal with this.

[noxlumina]

Originally Posted by Celera

I think it's fairly common to enjoy a first date and think, as the evening is ending, that you might want to see the person again, and then, on reflection, decide that the relationship isn't one you want to pursue after all. And I can certainly imagine thinking that after a first date, "well she was nice but not so nice that I want to get caught up in some drama with stalker ex and his prominent and influential family." Of course, when there is love in a relationship, you go through difficult times together, but he hasn't invested that much yet.

Has this stalking ever gone any further, any direct contact or threats? Does the ex's wife know about it? Is relocation an option for you?

Sorry you are having to deal with this.

^ All of that.

OP: you don't need to be a complete fake on dates, or turn in an Academy Award winning performance. But there is such a thing as too much information.

If I were on a first date with someone and they immediately brought up the drama with an ex - and or I thought they had some crazy person hanging around - I probably would never see them again, tbh. It's too much to drop on someone on the first date. If the drama with the ex is *so bad* that the ex shows up and makes trouble when you go on dates, then you probably have some stuff to sort through in order to even start a relationship.

Rules for doing first dates: show up, look nice, smell nice, shut up, relax, then go home. Seriously.

Don't bring the baggage with you. That can wait. It really can.