*Need help* malevolent aliens in astral/etheric plane

Originally Posted by earthatic

Btw, I just astral projected in record time, 20 minutes, so I could talk to the ghost of that girl. As it turns out, she is my soulmate. At first I saw her as that distorted, pale, transparent form, and again, she turned into a normal form (as she has done before).
She looked the same way with a dark facial expression (her head tilted down looking up at me). I asked "Are you my soulmate?", and she smiled a tiny bit and nodded ^^
I also felt a cool breeze coming from her direction instead of hard vibration.

Congratulations!! If it is, I am very happy for the two of you. I hope it turns out well.

Originally Posted by earthatic

Also last time I checked, the spine does not extend through your skull to the crown of your head, nor are there any muscles there ;) When meditating on the third eye, you can feel this tingling/buzzing inside your skull...there are no nerve cells inside your skull.

LOL! My friend, have a look at the illusory effects that are produced from stimulating certain areas of the brain. From this post I can already see that your knowledge on physiology is limited.

One can expect to come down/feel depressed after feeling such a high , which does not happen.

You don't necessarily get a come down. Read into DMT and other psychedelics. In fact, take it yourself. It can have different effects on different people...positive and negative. On some, the impact of the trip was life-changing and many lingered on its psychological effects. For some the experiences were "spiritual"...nothing but mere interpretation.

Also, this is just one thing that is associated with a certain area. When someone shifts the energy to a different part of the body, they will experience different things. For instance, if you were to shift the vibration to the middle of your head, you would begin to literally see things through your eye lids. This is the area of the third eye, your second sight.

Have you been paying any attention to my last few posts?

When communicating with beings, I have felt them cause a tingling in my throat, and I would speak the words they would want me to speak. This area is associated with communication. But the same reactions can't be triggered by activating a different area. Each one is very specific. While ironically, you can say people only associate love with the heart because of influences in culture and what not...where did those ideas originate from? :)

Oh, come on! You are clearly biased by fanciful interpretations. The heart is a vital organ that pumps blood around the body, blood is equated with life. At some point someone decided to make an association and it's been like that ever since. Look, just admit it, you can't prove what you believe in. Period.

No, I'm pretty it's the other way around. Fear causes the release of adrenaline. And that seems silly for it to be a demon or a shadow person as an explanation...what would seem more logical would be a rock, or a tipped over bookcase?

I wouldn't be too sure about this. A woman's amygdala had been removed in an operation and guess what the side effects were. She experienced no fear...even her aracnophobia was gone...hmmm, still think it's the other way around? Btw, why a rock or a bookcase? You threw me there completely!

Again, you seem to think that in everyones subconscious mind, we all have the same imagination. We are all here on planet Earth, experiencing similar things to each other... would you say that this reality is not real either?

Not the same imagination. More like we hold a personal and a collective unconscious. This would make Carl Jung, someone who studied dreams over a lifetime, absolutely correct. I also think it might bee possible to get two correlated minds and quantum entanglement would suggest this if we are to regard such metaphysical experiences as products of quantum fluctuations but this is a complex arena which would probably go over your astral head.

By the way, this reality is very real...it's actuality and has very distinct rules. It's existence can be proved, it's nature can be documented and investigated using apparatuses. In the non-physical worlds, you cannot do the same thing. A measuring device there would be congruent with the erratic nature of the metaphysical realm and liable to change. An accurate study would be impossible as observation itself can affect its ambience majorly. And, to be fair, the notion that it is nothing but an illusion concocted by the brain is just as valid as the belief that such worlds really do exist independently or that consciousness can survive without a brain.

Same goes for astral projection. Many of us do it and have very similar experiences.

Many of us find dream interpretations accurate.

And it's not like these similar experiences have changed much either! Unless you're saying that our culture has remained exactly the same in all cultures since the beginning of civilization? I think not. I hope you find this interesting!

In evolutionary terms, lately, we haven't changed much either. It's like we have paused or stopped completely. Some scientists are already saying we have reached our entelechy.

A "Shade" in ancient mythology is referred to spirit or ghost of a dead person, residing in the underworld.

Yeah, myths! Myths and erroneous interpretations made by people who didn't know much. Haven't you noticed? We live in a scientific age now and in my opinion a lot of this fanciful **** should have been dispelled by now!

Sleep paralysis/hypnagogia is described in many different cultures through many different time periods:

I know it is! You're telling me that! LOL! And I'm telling you, it's not spirits. They are 'feedback' hallucinations. Nothing more. Today we can understand this. Yesterday people allowed themselves to be swayed by fantasy and superstition.

It still doesn't give you access to information you've never been exposed to. Unless you're talking about the akashic records, of course xD

LOL! The Akashic Records. What a lame explanation. Many people who thought they had never been exposed to things later discovered under hypnosis where and when exactly they came across it. Also, it might be possible to obtain real info that you were not exposed to previously and not have to leave the body...seriously, have a look at quantum entanglement and quantum computing. It's a very real phenomena. You'll be amazed and it's nothing magical!

I'm so glad you mentioned DMT. :P This is a quote from Wikipedia on people who have taken doses of DMT:
"Several subjects also reported contact with 'other beings', alien like, insectoid or reptilian in nature, in highly advanced technological environments[11] where the subjects were 'carried', 'probed', 'tested', 'manipulated', 'dismembered', 'taught', 'loved' and even 'raped' by these 'beings' "

My friend, do you know where wikipedia got this? From Rick Strassman's research and I've come across these experiences in the book I referenced previously. But what wiki doesn't mention is the detail that Strassman includes. Seriously, read the book and discover how what they experience in the "DMT realms" seems to tie in with what goes on in the subjects' waking lives. It will make you think of dream symbolism. Did you know that insects and aliens have their own meaning or are often found to be puns for something else? You are trying to dismiss logical and scientific views by clinging to unfounded interpretations. Why do you dismiss the possibilities that would rule out the notion of spirits, demons and the astral plane so much?

Astral Projection, lucid dreaming, and the idea of ghosts and spirituality has been around way before the New Age movement, my friend.

Sure, I never said they weren't. But they are all hooey in my opinion and we have been biased by these fanciful interpretations (usually for comfort) for too long. For starters, the term "lucid dreaming" is incorrect because it is not the dream that is lucid...it is the dreamer. Secondly, the term "astral projection" is misleading in that it seems to imply a projection to the stars when often one finds what appears to be simulations of the physical world upon a sensation of separation from the body. I praise Monroe for popularising the term "out of body experience" and discarding the belief-centric term "astral projection" in his first book.

The idea of ghosts and spirituality has been around for so long because people want to feel comfortable in the belief that there is an afterlife. Whether there is one or not, I don't know but OOBEs certainly aren't proof. The truth is that we were dead before we were born. Before that we didn't know any better. Being alive means inevitable suffering but, there is a good chance that at death we lose consciousness and go back to not knowing any better. Isn't it funny that people who have been in a coma for years wake up thinking that no time has passed whatsoever? It's as if they didn't know any better! The brain damage caused them to lose consciousness and become oblivious to everything. They only started suffering when they found out how much time they missed and how much things had changed. Even if there is no afterlife, it's not so bad and I wish to god those spiritual and religious people considered this instead of holding on to their fantasy.

Your arguments here seem to be lacking quite a bit. Half of these are your own biased opinions, and you're not actually answering or disproving a lot of things I have said ^^ For example:

LOL! My friend, have a look at the illusory effects that are produced from stimulating certain areas of the brain. From this post I can already see that your knowledge on physiology is limited.

You had originally said that " There's a good chance that vibrations are tactile feedback of the firing of neurons while sleep paralysis is very natural and happens when the pons sends inhibitory signals to nerve cells in the spine in order to cause muscle atonia."

And I explained why that couldn't be possible...Because in fact you'd have to have nerve cells inside your brain. Here's a tiny lesson for you =] : There are no nerve cells in the brain. Nerves are in the rest of our body and run to the brain in order to feel sensations like pain, but we cannot feel these sensations inside our brain because we do not have any nerves there...it seems like your knowledge on physiology is limited.
So, you changed your mind and saying it's just the imagination now? You just have to answer an even harder question XD the same as I had asked before, but regarding a different area. Why would people be experiencing the same "illusionary sensations" as each other? Specifically, vibrations and tingles, and different various frequencies of sound in their ears. Hard to chalk that up to cultural influences.

Also, the areas of the brain that can cause illusionary effects, can produce almost ANY type of sensation apparently. So again, why this specifically?

You don't necessarily get a come down. Read into DMT and other psychedelics. In fact, take it yourself. It can have different effects on different people...positive and negative. On some, the impact of the trip was life-changing and many lingered on its psychological effects. For some the experiences were "spiritual"...nothing but mere interpretation.

You didn't say DMT . You said "oxytocin, dopamine and serotonin", and it is a scientific fact that you would 'come down' after releasing such a great amount of these chemicals.

In fact, take it yourself.

Be careful what you say here. " SF promotes open discussion; however SF does not promote or condone drug and alcohol abuse or the use of any other illegal substance. "

Have you been paying any attention to my last few posts?

I have!

Oh, come on! The heart is a vital organ that pumps blood around the body, blood is equated with life. At some point someone decided to make an association and it's been like that ever since.

Look at bhuddism and hinduism, as well as other belief systems. They all associate it with love and compassion. They are not saying that the heart that pumps blood through your body makes you feel these things They are saying that there is an "energy center" in the area where the heart is located that is associated with these things, and that you can manipulate and feel these centers through meditation ;]

I wouldn't be too sure about this. A woman's amygdala had been removed in an operation and guess what the side effects were. She experienced no fear...even her aracnophobia was gone...hmmm, still think it's the other way around?

Interesting, but I sure do, because waking up in the middle of the night to see a ghost in your room would definitely scare most people...causing the release of adrenaline.

] Btw, why a rock or a bookcase? You threw me there completely!

And why a demon or a ghost? Because if it was our own mind trying to make logic out of what was happening...you think at least one unfortunate victim of sleep paralysis would imagine something more logical like a rock or a bookcase holding them down, stopping them from breathing? Nope, and it's funny because people coincidentally (and almost 100% of the time) look to see a ghost in their room.

By the way, this reality is very real...it's actuality and has very distinct rules. It's existence can be proved, it's nature can be documented and investigated using apparatuses. In the non-physical worlds, you cannot do the same thing.

That's because the astral has very distinct rules as well!

Let's say that if the astral/etheric does exist, it is definitely separate from the physical dimension, and therefore can't be measured or tested using common scientific and mathematical means. In it's common interpretation, it could be said that we have a "second body" that resides there, and that our consciousness and awareness can be transfered over. So, what can you really test and study in the physical world to examine how this dimension would work?

In string theory, which they are close to proving right now, says that everything is made up of tiny vibrating strings that vibrate at different frequencies (notice the fact that people feel various types of tingles and vibrations, and ringing when trying to 'separate' from their body), and that there are dimensions extended beyond our current dimension, and that the other dimensions would have completely different sets of rules from our own. IF we had another body that resided in one of these dimensions, it could be linked to our physical mind at a quantum level. So how could you test that through science? You would have nothing to go on but human experiences on the subject...and we have plenty of it.

There is (very heightened) brain activity and release of DMT when people experiment with such things. Then it would make sense that this activity could be the physical brain taking signals from your separated consciousness from the other dimension at a quantum level, and affecting the physical brain in such a way so you could remember what you were experiencing there. DMT doesn't make you visualize anything specific like ghosts, aliens, or beings of light...it just makes you visualize, among other things. What specifically? Well it's a possibility that the brain could use DMT to make your physical mind perceive the things that are there...and everyone seems to perceive very similar things.

And before you use a ton of smilies and LOLs expressing your possible ridicule for this explanation , it's still a very plausible scientific explanation, and somewhat goes along with yours in a way.

In evolutionary terms, lately, we haven't changed much either. It's like we have paused or stopped completely. Some scientists are already saying we have reached our entelechy.

It would have nothing to do with evolution. As you put it, it would be a cultural influence, but our culture has changed quite a bit. The experiences of the hypnagogic state has not.

LOL! The Akashic Records.

Yes, that was the joke! XD

Seriously, read the book and discover how what they experience in the "DMT realms" seems to tie in with what goes on in the subjects' waking lives.

I've actually read about DMT a long time ago, but not in depth. And in common interpretation, the astral does have a lot to do with memories and manifestation as well as stuff the experiencers have never been exposed to.

Did you know that insects and aliens have their own meaning or are often found to be puns for something else?

No, I have never heard of a pun about people being kidnapped by technologically advanced human-sized reptilians or bugs...have you?

But they are all hooey in my opinion and we have been biased by these fanciful interpretations (usually for comfort) for too long.

You're being very hypocritical. That is merely your opinion, and what you have to back it up (?) is no more than your own biased opinions also. You don't have any right to say who is correct and who is not, because this phenomenon hasn't been truly proven or dis-proven. There's nothing but a handful of sketchy scientific experiments that suggest there is nothing to it as well as a handful of sketchy scientific experiments that suggest that there is actually something to it. There are also a ton of inconsistent scientific explanations that attempt to interpret these things, and a ton of metaphysical explanations. And not for my own comfort in believing so; the metaphysical ones in my opinion explain it much better.

Take your pick.

Also if anyone else has any input, opinions and experiences inclining you to believe certain things about this subject, please share!

This is just off the top of my head, but Earthatic I would encourage you to carry a giant grain of salt with you in the astral. If some entity appears all pretty and nods yes to saying she's your gal, don't take it on face value. I've read that things are not always as they appear. Of course I probably shouldn't try to advise you sense I don't personally do any astral work - I just read a lot!

Originally Posted by SunMist

This is just off the top of my head, but Earthatic I would encourage you to carry a giant grain of salt with you in the astral. If some entity appears all pretty and nods yes to saying she's your gal, don't take it on face value. I've read that things are not always as they appear. Of course I probably shouldn't try to advise you sense I don't personally do any astral work - I just read a lot!

That's definitely true. After being around her, I feel extremely drawn to her, but I never imagined my soulmate as having such a dark personality. Something seems very fishy, and it's confusing the heck out of me. Because today I tried to astral project to find her again, I tried for about an hour. I could sense she was somewhere nearby, but I couldn't see her anywhere. I asked "If you are somewhere close, could you try finding me instead?" When I said this, she appeared right in front of me. A strange black smoke-textured snake came out of her arm, and wrapped around mine, I immediately thought "OH ****..." but she then said "The energy feels good here, and I don't want to ruin it for you."

How is it possible to prove that someone is, in fact, your soulmate?

LOL! Your post addressed to me was amusing, earthatic.

You carry a lot of misconceptions and strive to hold onto to your belief system at all costs. Here's a disclaimer to one of your statements: neurons, which are nerve cells, make up the nervous system...the nervous system includes the brain, which is at its center and contains billions of those electrically excitable cells.

Anyway, I'm not here to change your mind about your beliefs. If you want to interpret the OOBE phenomenon the way you do it's up to you but may my posts serve as a reminder that there are many other interpretations out there and that one should be careful with how they word their statements...especially the ones where affirmations are made with absolutely no substance to back them up.

Originally Posted by Summerlander

LOL! Your post addressed to me was amusing, earthatic.

You carry a lot of misconceptions and strive to hold onto to your belief system at all costs. Here's a disclaimer to one of your statements: neurons, which are nerve cells, make up the nervous system...the nervous system includes the brain, which is at its center and contains billions of those electrically excitable cells.

"There's a good chance that vibrations are tactile feedback of the firing of neurons while sleep paralysis is very natural and happens when the pons sends inhibitory signals to nerve cells in the spine in order to cause muscle atonia"

There are different types of cells, and the ones that are responsible for this do not exist inside the brain. These run from the rest of your body to your brain, so the brain can then interpret the signals given. The spine does not interpret sensation, the brain does. Since the brain feels the same tingling sensation as the rest of the body, it would have nothing to do with inhibitory signals to nerves in the spine. It also doesn't explain why you are able to shift this feeling at will.

Anyway, I'm not here to change your mind about your beliefs. If you want to interpret the OOBE phenomenon the way you do it's up to you but may my posts serve as a reminder that there are many other interpretations out there and that one should be careful with how they word their statements...especially the ones where affirmations are made with absolutely no substance to back them up.

I wasn't trying to change your mind either. I have read many explanations for the phenomenon, and nothing you have posted said anything that was new to me. In my argument I was just saying why the explanations you provided had many holes in them. And when I point out the obvious holes, you say I am delusional. By that logic, it seems to me that you are the one who is in denial.

Originally Posted by earthatic

[i]"There's a good chance that vibrations are tactile The spine does not interpret sensation, the brain does. Since the brain feels the same tingling sensation as the rest of the body, it would have nothing to do with inhibitory signals to nerves in the spine. It also doesn't explain why you are able to shift this feeling at will.

You are like a stubborn five year old revelling in his ignorance. There are neurons in the brain and motor neurons in the spinal cord. No-one ever said anything about the spinal cord interpreting anything, this is a ridiculous notion that you have just come up with. The truth is that the pons DOES send inhibitory signals to motor neurons in the spine which will in turn result in muscle atonia during REM sleep. In other words, it is the mechanism for sleep paralysis in order to prevent us from acting out our dreams. This is not something I made up...this is FACT! LOL

I would personally buy you a book on human anatomy and physiology but you would probably just IGNORE it or deny it...

Do yourself a favour and look into polarisation and hyperpolarisation of cells. Further unusual activity of parts of the brain can also add to the confusion or to convince you that something is happening when it isn't! Have you ever induced an OOBE next to someone who is snoring away? Sometimes the snoring suddenly 'shifts' to the opposite side of where it should be coming in actuality as you progress with your induction...ever thought why this is? No. You'd never consider it! The thalamus, which, like the pineal gland (interesting), is located near the centre of the brain, is responsible for motor signals, spatial awareness, regulating sleep and alertness

Its function includes relaying sensation, spatial sense, and motor signals to the cerebral cortex, along with the regulation of consciousness, sleep, and alertness, and receiving and passing on sensation. It's not surprising then that this area is active as we induce the state. The thalamus plays a major role in receiving and sending sensory signals! Isn't it feasible that, as we alter our state of consciousness, and go through the hypnagogic state, that we go through a phase of unusual activity or mild warping of thalamic processes which contribute to distortions in perception?

Visual "back projections" are also received and relayed by the thalamus from the cerebral cortex! Couldn't this play a major part in the origins of visual hallucinations during sleep paralysis?

It is not "my opinion", as you've stated, earthatic. I don't really hold a belief system as I maintain the agnostic stance until I see concrete proof of something. I am merely getting your attention to other more mundane possibilities. The postulations on how parts of the brain work come from scientific studies that were conducted and they need to be taken into consideration. I only get your attention to such things in order to help you grow because you have shown me an extremely naive side to your personality.

Have you ever stopped to think that you may be the one who holds a strong opinion because you are biased by such unfounded beliefs?

Earthatic, given what you just reported I'd say yes be cautious, be skeptical, test. As far as this soulmate idea goes, I've never been that on board with it though I know many people put a lot of stock by it - there's a whole subboard on this site you've probably found already. If you detect the voice of bitter experience on my part you would be correct. I wasted thirteen years of my life at great cost to me in a number of ways because of a person I believed to be my soulmate. The odd truth is that he was - on a spiritual and past-life level he and I had very strong connections. But ultimately what matters is what happens now, in the present. That is all.

Originally Posted by SunMist

But ultimately what matters is what happens now, in the present. That is all.

Now this I agree with. Well said, SunMist.