Are we responsible of our behaviour?

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by Lisa

Hi James,


Perhaps what you wrote is a filter.


Can I let this knowledge go? Knowledge is knowledge. The hot stove is hot.
I'm not holding on to the knowledge of a hot stove. It's just hot.


The same. I would still be aware that surrender and realization- dying before you die- is the purpose of our little shin-dig.


Life is all there is. Birth and death are realities in the dream.


The death of the dreamer is how one wakes up.
The personal self dissolves.


He surrenders. This most often happens when the dream becomes a nightmare.


Well, it doesn't have to make sense.
But it makes sense to me.


Don't worry. I've just trimmed my claws.

Hi Lisa,
All I am saying is that you said he dies....................All I am asking is how can the dreamer die?
Who is actually dying according to your statement and your knowledge? (no matter what life you thought you led-
you just die. Lisa)


Blessings, James

Originally Posted by WhiteShaman

Hi rsingh,

Thank you but you may have misunderstood the meaning behind my post to Lisa. I fully understand how the phrase is commonly used but what I was referring to is the statement that those who die without dying before they die....just die.

My awakening experiences cannot make sense of that. All I am asking Lisa is how or why can she make sense of that.
And all in the spirit of open communication.

Blessings, James

James, how many posts of yours have I read that touch upon this issue that you bring up?

I sense what is behind it.

Is it a fear, a worry, a concern, a love for these others?

And thus a need to make it not so? To rescue? To protect? To deny?

I've heard the saying that from the highest point all is well.

[BlueSky]

Lisa,
I'm just asking and I'm just asking because I respect your spirituality, if you will.
I just want to know why you think this. I have no "thing" behind it.
I was hoping to maybe even learn something because I have seen otherwise.

I ask a question and between Tzu's passing judgement and now your seeing something other than just a friend asking a question is really kinda hurtful.

Oh well...............I withdraw my question...........I have lost interest.

Blessings, James

WhiteShaman-Hi Lisa,
All I am saying is that you said he dies....................All I am asking is how can the dreamer die?

He's asleep. His body dies. His personal self dies. He dies- asleep, unconscious.
John Doe is no more.

WS-Who is actually dying according to your statement and your knowledge? (no matter what life you thought you led-
you just die. Lisa)

That which thought it was- but wasn't- dies.

WhiteShaman-Lisa,
I'm just asking and I'm just asking because I respect your spirituality, if you will.
I just want to know why you think this. I have no "thing" behind it.
I was hoping to maybe even learn something.

As I said, there is a theme on this subject with you.
You can look at it, or not.
If you did, you might learn something.

WS-I ask a question and between Tzu's passing judgement and now your seeing something other than just a friend asking a question is really kinda hurtful.

We're posting, Tzu is another post. I don't see how you can correlate them.
I am being a friend by bringing this up. What's hurtful may be in what I brought up, not that I am seeing something other than. And I'm not. I'm bringing up the core of the issue that you brought up.

WS- Oh well...............I withdraw my question...........I have lost interest.

Sorry James, but no surprises here.

rsingh-
"Die before you die" phrase has been used very often in spiritual circles. It does not really mean our physical death or mental death or anything like it. It refers to death of the ego. Ego is an assumption that we are separate entity. So we die as a separate entity and unite with the whole or One. Then we realise that we were never born so we do not die. We are immortal. But this realisation can only occur after death of the ego.

There it is.

Originally posted by Maiya.
And death of the ego usually comes when we have either reached a certain level of awareness or we have hit rock bottom and virtually given up the fight. We wait for the sky to fall and when it doesn’t we begin to realise that we are changed in some significant way - like we have some kind of conscious breakthrough. Then and only then does the door open fully to personal and spiritual development - and so the real journey begins.

Hi Maiya

You are right. Ego only dies when true surrender occurs. True surrender occurs when we have tried every strategy and none of them worked. So we get fully exhausted and give up. This giving up completely and truly causes death of the ego.

You seem to speaking from experience. I like it as it is not a philosophy from the head.