Deer Season!!!!

[sentient]

Some statistics:
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fauna_of_Europe
(though perhaps not the most trusted data website)……. claims that:

Eighty to ninety per cent of Europe was once covered by forest. It stretched from the Mediterranean Sea to the Arctic Ocean.

Not much habitat for wild animals is left in Europe except on the fringes, where the last hunter-gatherers of Europe retreated:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...Forest.pdf.jpg

*

The largest brown area on this map belonged to the last Bear Totemic hunting clans of Europe:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-lSCnH7mUb6...bear-in-eu.jpg

Of course I am proud of this heritage.

*

[Altair]

Originally Posted by ImthatIm

Palm oil has been a cause of many acres of rain forest destruction and killed animals.I choose not to purchase palm oil products.

Great, neither do I. But what about biofuel? Do you use that? Most palm oil is actually put in vehicles...

Originally Posted by ImThatIm

I don't really think this is all about what a person can do or chooses to do.
I think many people are apposed to bow hunting and have nothing better to do than spread your fear here.

Not really. I actually had no intention of entering this thread. I've been talking with him about hunting before so to be fair I initially felt no desire to repeat myself. Why I entered this thread you should know... ;)

Originally Posted by ImThatIm

You think you got Lucky pegged as a conservative and want to give him a hard time.

No.. it's just my observation from discussing various topics with him. He's usually making observations, but not questioning reality itself and the human condition.

Anyway...
Sentient brought up an interesting point..

Most of the countryside in my own country, just as is the case in many other countries, is used to grow crops (grains) to feed farm animals. Meanwhile, the overwhelming majority of soy is shipped in from South America to also feed farm animals. I am very much aware of the fact that other crops (grown for human consumption) cause harm too but overall far less and since we do have to eat it is simply the better option. What we need is removal of land used to grow crops for animals and we'll have plenty of land available for rewilding as well as organic veg and fruit produce, depending on soil.

[Lucky 1]

Originally Posted by Altair

..
I always do find it fascinating to what great lengths meat eaters go to defend meat eating..

And I find it outrageous the lengths vegans will go to promote a fad diet that is un-natural for human beings, is well known to cause various health problems and is unsuitable for the majority of the human population......

But we're are getting side tracked with nonsense that has nothing to do with this thread....namely the Spiritual Path of the Hunter.

[Lucky 1]

Originally Posted by Altair

I have been to many farms..

Indeed it does, and eating meat does significantly more so as it requires not just land for the farm animals to live but also land used to grow their crops (not to mention water). It's the leading cause of deforestation and species' extinction around the globe and has been the main force of destruction for many centuries. Now obviously all non-organic food grown is to some extent detrimental to wildlife, but overall it's quite clear and established fact that diets containing meat are far worse to our environment. If you eat plants and meat you do significantly more damage to the environment and to wildlife.

I take exception to your saying that ranching does more environmental damage than land used to grow crops or that the consumption of meat is worse for the environment....that is simply untrue and amounts to nothing more than propaganda.

The clearing of the wild spaces for the creation of farm land is by far the leading reason for deforestation....not ranching

Altair
I thought this was a thread about Lucky's bow hunting this year and the benefits spiritually.
I am really focused on bow hunting,and Lucky's good hunting practices.
Toothpaste has fluoride which I heard was a by product from chemical production. I lived around Union carbide which destroyed many lives and habitat. Just saying Lucky kills, you use products, I use products. I don't think animal farming practices have anything to do with Lucky's hunting practices.
Your against meet eaters.Okay go start your own thread about meat eating. I won't be there. I was hoping to talking bow hunting and stalking. not who's practices are better or worse. We will never know all that.
I was hoping to learn insight from lucky's hunt.
I don't buy meat.Some/most of those practices are bad. But I know practices that are worse. We were talking Lucky's bow hunting adventures.
Your confused by my words I have no Idea what we are even talking about anymore. I thought it was the art of bow hunting stalking becoming one with the land and animals and plants and wind.
,,,,,,,,,,,here is some comas if anybody needs any.

[Altair]

Some animals, like wolves, have made a comeback on the continent, but already face opposition from sheep farmers (they're really hobbyists who keep sheep outside without any protection measures) and hunting lobbies. I'd love to see healthy populations of wolves and of other wildlife, but as long as we dedicate most of our land inefficiently to animal farming it's always going to be a tough subject.

Originally Posted by Lucky 1

I take exception to your saying that ranching does more environmental damage than land used to grow crops or that the consumption of meat is worse for the environment....that is simply untrue and amounts to nothing more than propaganda.

The clearing of the wild spaces for the creation of farm land is by far the leading reason for deforestation....not ranching

Most of the land cleared is used to grow crops for animals.
There is one notable exception, i.e. palm oil in Indonesia and Malaysia. Globally however, crops grown for animals is the leading cause of deforestation.

[Lucky 1]

Originally Posted by ImthatIm

I don't buy meat.

We don't buy meat either.......the fact is...is if you eat meat...you are hunting/killing by proxy.

If you eat anything at all you are involved with killing something...that is simply how life works on this planet.

We are at least honest about it and do the dirty work ourselves.

The meat we take is beyond organic....it is wild and chemical and hormone free and the animals got to grow up and live in the wild places as nature intended.

And again....we only hunt that which we need to live and no more.

Altair asked
"But what about biofuel?" I do not use. Also don't want to learn about Bio-fuel.
Altair stated
" why I entered this thread you should know..." I don't know. If I should know tell me. I love listening.
I also love vegetarians I think there should be more of them. I have no idea what a vegan is.

[Altair]

Originally Posted by ImthatIm

Altair
I thought this was a thread about Lucky's bow hunting this year and the benefits spiritually.
I am really focused on bow hunting,and Lucky's good hunting practices.
Toothpaste has fluoride which I heard was a by product from chemical production. I lived around Union carbide which destroyed many lives and habitat. Just saying Lucky kills, you use products, I use products. I don't think animal farming practices have anything to do with Lucky's hunting practices.
Your against meet eaters.Okay go start your own thread about meat eating. I won't be there. I was hoping to talking bow hunting and stalking. not who's practices are better or worse. We will never know all that.
I was hoping to learn insight from lucky's hunt.
I don't buy meat.Some/most of those practices are bad. But I know practices that are worse. We were talking Lucky's bow hunting adventures.
Your confused by my words I have no Idea what we are even talking about anymore. I thought it was the art of bow hunting stalking becoming one with the land and animals and plants and wind.

If that's what you want.. then talk about bows..!! And don't make crazy comments about [preventing someone's having fun in killing others] is worse than the [actual act of killing]. This is an outlandish claim, that makes no sense materially nor spiritually. It's pretty much the same as saying protesting against a war is worse than starting a war.

And you were already discussing the topic of meat eating and morality before I came in here.. so it was all in your hands to end it before I came in!

[Lucky 1]

Originally Posted by sentient

Some statistics:
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fauna_of_Europe
(though perhaps not the most trusted data website)……. claims that:
Not much habitat for wild animals is left in Europe except on the fringes, where the last hunter-gatherers of Europe retreated:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...Forest.pdf.jpg

*

The largest brown area on this map belonged to the last Bear Totemic hunting clans of Europe:
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-lSCnH7mUb6...bear-in-eu.jpg

Of course I am proud of this heritage.

*

Sentient.....I'd love to hear more of what you have to say about the Totemic hunting clans of Europe! (Lets get this thread back on track!)

About 6 years ago I spent about 6 weeks in Ethiopia's Great Rift Valley living with the Tsemay peoples......

I say lived with because it was more than just sight seeing or a hunting trip....I lived with them....shared chores in the village with them and yes.... hunted with them and shared many nights around the sacred campfire.

They are some of the finest hunters and trackers on the planet....and the single most spiritual group of human beings I've ever met.

They are amazing to be with and there DNA literally goes back to the time when our species crawled from the primordial ooze 250,000 years ago in the Great Rift Valley of East central Africa.

The bow with me in my avatar is the one I took with me......it is a Bob Lee Ultimate Recurve and it has been around the world with me....from Africa to the Darien Gap of Panama when I stayed with an Embera tribe.

While I own quite a number of bows....The Bob Lee is by far my favorite and I've been all over with it!

If you are interested in my bow...here's the website for Bob Lee Bows
https://bobleebows.com/

I have almost no experience with Europe other than a couple of vacations there with the wife....she loves Paris and in Sept we went there to see a Jimmy Buffett concert.....so yes...I'd love to hear more about the European hunting heritage.