Tyrant God

[knightofalbion]

No, I don't understand it either.

But, like the search for the Divine, I'm sure we'll all come to understand it eventually.

[Holly]

Originally Posted by BurningBush

...It's been occurring to me lately that the god that I know as God, the one I've prayed to and asked things of is not like the god that I was taught, which happens to be the one from Christianity. He's not all-loving, but is in fact a tyrant with no interest in my happiness or well-being and this is further evidenced by the suffering that exists around the world at all times.

I'm wondering if anyone else's inquiry has ever taken them down this path.

I don't think the presence of suffering in the world evidences the fact that God is a tyrant and has no interest in your happiness. The presence of suffering only demonstrates that people are very good at being cruel to each other, and also very good at creating suffering for themselves by misusing their minds. There are a lot of different types of suffering. Physical – a bad back for example. Emotional – a bereavement. Mental – depression and anxiety. Spiritual – Dark Night of the Soul. There are silverlinings to all these types of suffering.

It's easy to apply too much mind to the suffering of others and then say 'there's so much suffering in the world.'

We can't magically look inside the heads of others. We can only look AT others, AT their reaction to their own suffering, and sympathise, imagining how WE might feel if we were in their shoes – but we're not in their shoes. We don't have their experiences, their beliefs. We only see the surface experience, what the person is willing to show, an incomplete version of their suffering which isn't enough to say we truly understand.

We only understand our OWN suffering. It's easy to apply too much mind to that, too. Suffering only takes place within the mind. Pain happens all over, but suffering is purely perceived by the mind.

The fact that your mind perceives suffering does not evidence a tyrannical God who doesn't care. It suggests your mind is a bit ill, a bit out of balance, that it thinks too much, that it fears too much, that it has too little faith in God and too little personal spiritual awareness to take advantage of the state of non-suffering that is available to everyone.

The mind can't see the silver lining behind your suffering. That it hasn't learned to appreciate that what comes AFTER suffering is often a gift or that suffering itself is actually a form of compulsive thinking.

My experience of God isn't as an external being that I can look UP towards and go 'YOU aren't helping us.' There isn't enough separation between me and God to say 'us' like we exist separately, and 'you' as though he's higher or outside of us.

The fact is, in my experience, we are all sharing consciousness with God. We are all God – and some of the Gods on Earth have decided that suffering is helpful to them, or that they wish to experience it. Your job (and my job) is to find a way through our own suffering either by faith or brain. I found meditation very useful. Through it I learned that my suffering was a layer of perception, it was a thought process layered over physical feelings that made me feel fearful or shook my belief in God. Once I realised it was in my mind, I found it much easier to just feel the pain of being alive, which is natural.

Suffering is actually a choice. Inasmuch as it decreases in line with rising spiritual awareness. The challenge is building that awareness. It's not really about what God is doing or isn't doing. It's about what WE are or are not doing.

[Thunder Bow]

The Tyrant god is all about control. We are supposed to fear this entity and obey its laws.

Why suffering? Look at the size of every thing. The Earth is just a dot compared to size of the sun. The sun is just a speck of dust compared to the galaxy, and the galaxy is just a speck of dust compared to the universe. That makes us very very small. If a god made the entire universe, that makes us very much unseen and unnoticed, compared to size of such an massive entity. Why would such a tiny planet that is like any other life giving planet, be so important to such a massive singular entity? What makes us such an important species, compared to all the other intelligent species that can be found through out an infinite universe?

[Miss Hepburn]

Originally Posted by Thunder Bow

That makes us very very small.
If a god made the entire universe, that makes us very much unseen and unnoticed,
compared to size of such an massive entity.

I gotta tell ya when a little kitten looks up at me and plays with me
I love that little thing as much
as when I look into the eyes of a big ole horse or elephant.
But, if someone doesn't know about the delicacies, the exquisiteness
of love the above would mean nothing.
They may be looking at size.

God is as much responsible for things here as me making the PERFECT
home ...huge....
for an ant colony...but when they start battling or whatever...oops...'they' did to themselves...bec I
made a paradise for them.
And I'm no tyrant.

Someone calling the Creator anything but Pure Love is speculating from the outside looking in...
have a direct experience and you know
that is the ego-mind talking, knowing near nothing about
the spiritual unseen world, let alone the Divine, The All That Is...sorry.

[knightofalbion]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

I gotta tell ya when a little kitten looks up at me and plays with me
I love that little thing as much
as when I look into the eyes of a big ole horse or elephant.
But, if someone doesn't know about the delicacies, the exquisiteness
of love the above would mean nothing.
They may be looking at size.


Someone calling the Creator anything but Pure Love is speculating from the outside looking in...
have a direct experience and you know
that is the ego-mind talking, knowing near nothing about
the spiritual unseen world, let alone the Divine, The All That Is...

Venturing into the sublime, dear Miss Hepburn.

Originally Posted by BurningBush

I've struggled with whether I believe in God throughout my life, believing at some points and not believing (or telling myself that I didn't believe) at others. After my so-called "awakening" about 4 years ago, I realized that the truth was that I believed. It may be delusional, but I believe so that's how I have to operate.

It's been occurring to me lately that the god that I know as God, the one I've prayed to and asked things of is not like the god that I was taught, which happens to be the one from Christianity. He's not all-loving, but is in fact a tyrant with no interest in my happiness or well-being and this is further evidenced by the suffering that exists around the world at all times.

I'm wondering if anyone else's inquiry has ever taken them down this path.

Blasphemy 101 ... The devil thought exactly the same and he rebelled...

Think about your so called 'awakening' and questions the forces that are behind it; you might be surprised that you will find 'loving and benevolent' entities that are truly working for the devil

[BurningBush]

Originally Posted by Holly

The fact that your mind perceives suffering does not evidence a tyrannical God who doesn't care. It suggests your mind is a bit ill, a bit out of balance, that it thinks too much, that it fears too much, that it has too little faith in God and too little personal spiritual awareness to take advantage of the state of non-suffering that is available to everyone.

The mind can't see the silver lining behind your suffering. That it hasn't learned to appreciate that what comes AFTER suffering is often a gift or that suffering itself is actually a form of compulsive thinking.

I'm sorry but this argument is fairly ridiculous. You might be right about my shortcomings, but the idea that suffering is somehow necessary is indicative of a creator that is either uncaring or inept.

[wolfgaze]

BurningBush, I think some others may have already alluded to this - but there is also the possibility that there is no separate 'higher power / god / deity' overlooking everything and 'managing' it... The notion that there is one Universal Spirit (energy) from which all 'beings' manifest...

pandeism
https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandeism

I think worthy of consideration....

For me the notion of a separate 'god' character that does or doesn't do certain things never made sense (to me)....

[Holly]

Originally Posted by BurningBush

I'm sorry but this argument is fairly ridiculous. You might be right about my shortcomings, but the idea that suffering is somehow necessary is indicative of a creator that is either uncaring or inept.

Nobody said they were shortcomings and I'm certainly not implying they are. It's just a state of mind you're in.

You've missed the point. The point is you're labouring under an understanding in your mind. That's what's causing you to see suffering in the world and to suffer yourself. You tell me...do you walk around all day in bliss, seeing God in all things, seeing the God inside you? If not then the chances are you're not operating from your heart, soul, or even what people term your 'higher self' which is an observation further backed up by your original question. Nobody who isn't in a destructive state of awareness, living only from the POV of the mind would ask that question.

Finding God uncaring and inept is a symptom of that state of mind. It's got nothing to do with ultimate reality - it's a temporary state of awareness which rises from fearful thinking, or put another way, from living life totally from the point of view of your mind.

I used to say exactly the things you're saying, then I changed the way my mind works through developing more self awareness and the universe took on a different tone.

Let me put this another way; this is what I've learned. Suffering isn't real. And yet it is. Either way, regardless of what's happening around you, you don't have to feel it, and you don't have responsibility for other people who feel it. Your experience of suffering is a mindscape based on thoughts and perception, not a truth, which means it can change.

You don't need to perceive suffering as you do. Your own gripe with God and the attendant discomforts in mind and heart that go with feeling the way you clearly do might just be fixable by simply changing your mind and for me, the key was meditation.

*shrugs* personally I was quite relieved when I learned this. Changing the world is almost impossible. Changing oneself is hard but absolutely possible.

[BurningBush]

Originally Posted by wolfgaze

BurningBush, I think some others may have already alluded to this - but there is also the possibility that there is no separate 'higher power / god / deity' overlooking everything and 'managing' it... The notion that there is one Universal Spirit (energy) from which all 'beings' manifest...

pandeism
https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandeism

I think worthy of consideration....

For me the notion of a separate 'god' character that does or doesn't do certain things never made sense (to me)....

I probably didn't make this clear at the beginning of the thread, but I know my idea of God might be wrong. However, I'm going with what I believe. Even if the truth is more like the Pandeist idea, God still made the world and I'd think would be responsible.