Please ask me , I will learn from it

[wstein]

Originally Posted by CSEe

Perhaps your version of being awake is different from me ...in my current view , awake is realization . Realizing own self , realizing own emotion , realizing the reason to act , the reason to re-act , the cause of having intention , the desire of owning such desire etc .......and is never about driving carefully without accident or remembering something or focusing on something .......awake is a condition within our emotion , awake not resulted by desire , or caused by desire to awake or by practicing any method ...awake is that you live in realization not confusion on own self .

Yes, we differ on this.

To me being awake is about realizing our true nature. When one embodies this (as opposed to living in their illusion), one acts not re-acts. This action is direct from that true nature; not from emotion, reason, ego, desire, focus. That action may possibly be expressed as emotion, reason, ego, desire, focus, action.

The way you phrase things sounds like you have self emoting, reasoning, desiring, focusing and then acting. I think self expresses AS emoting, reasoning, desiring, focusing, acting.

This is what the ‘no-mind’ stuff is about. An awaken one does not ‘consider’ before acting, they simply act. Considering may happen before, during, after, or never relative to acting. If one has cleared all that non-self out, any action will be from and in the form of their inner nature (as opposed to conditioning), the same inner nature recognized by those awake.

[wstein]

Originally Posted by Capacity

"I think we agree that the (ultimate) 'ME' is the nothingness." Wstein

Did you reason that? Did you see that?

I experienced it.

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by wstein

I experienced it.

Cse has not. He has an understanding of what he believes nothingness is. So he is looking for something to meet his expectation of it. That's how I see his posts reading. my point is that you don't agree on this really.

[running]

Originally Posted by CSEe

As I have said , learning is tiny part of Buddhism , I never deny knowledge is also a tiny part of Buddhism ...so every one choose joy over sadness , pleasure over pain it is realization not desire .......I guess you would agree if I say if I ask you to choose pain over pleasure , certainly is never be something you need to choose ...you will decide on joy because that is your realization . ..because you already beyond that level of experiencing joy or pleasure , beyond knowledge of joy or pleasure ......you will choose " right" choice , but that right choice is never is a choice because you never had a choice because you will never choose pain over pleasure .....you learned from being painful , your action suffering pain had teaches you ...so that is never be something bad because it has become a factor that change you .......so there is no good or bad , true or false , right or wrong in Buddhism , as you had learn from all ..........so this realization on your path is Buddhism ...you learn , you discover , you realize , you progress into greater understanding , realization of your emotion ..............Buddhism is realization on your emotion , with such realization you never need to choose because you realize what the emotion .......... the path is clear , the journey is "less painful" ........that is awaken to Buddhism ......perhaps all religion talk about beliefs or faith .......perhaps that is the key of a religion , in my current view of Buddhism , faith or beliefs is creation and attachment on emotion and that is travelling into longer journey ...Buddhism is realization of your emotion , your existence , cause of your existence ...realization of yourself.....so how can Buddhism a religion if faith is perhaps opposite path ?..

Your talking in circles and never showed me someone including yourself who wouldn't mind getting your hand smashed.

[running]

For worshiping nothingness there is a simple recipe from what I can tell. Open your crown, shut down your second work on nothing else. If all goes well for what you want you will be feeling and experiencing nothing. Not my cup of tea. Yeah its okay and can be healing at times. But I wouldn't want to feel like that always. Oops I'm sorry. I mean not feel.

All right i admit I'm having fun with this. Kinda serious and joking. Lo!l

[CSEe]

Originally Posted by running

Your talking in circles and never showed me someone including yourself who wouldn't mind getting your hand smashed.

Perhaps I should explain further .........In my current view , Buddhism is beyond knowledge , beyond all understandings , beyond all culture ...so knowledge is just a tiny little part of the process .......

So physical pain like getting hand smashed is just like suicide , people jumping from building , purposely drinking poison and this is very-very common...is happening every day in our culture .......so why do people choose cutting themselves with knife ? Why do people jumping off building ? Do you think they did not know is painful ? .............

So there are millions of people still choose pain / suffer over joy ......and even in our daily life , we said thing to others and regrets later , do thing that we regrets ...is that not painful ? Is regrets not painful , do you not suffering from regrets ?........Do you think smoker does not know smoking is bad ? Why they still smoke ?...perhaps it take more than knowledge for them to change or stop smoking ..perhaps knowledge had caused our confusion .....perhaps awaken to Buddhism , we will get out from this circle of confusion..............

So knowledge is just something we know and is human culture that take knowledge as a guide .....Buddhism is beyond this culture , beyond knowledge so if we never awaken ....we will always in circle of own knowledge , own confusion .............

[CSEe]

Originally Posted by running

For worshiping nothingness there is a simple recipe from what I can tell. Open your crown, shut down your second work on nothing else. If all goes well for what you want you will be feeling and experiencing nothing. Not my cup of tea. Yeah its okay and can be healing at times. But I wouldn't want to feel like that always. Oops I'm sorry. I mean not feel.

All right i admit I'm having fun with this. Kinda serious and joking. Lo!l

I do learned alot and I hope you continue sharing your views .........

[running]

Originally Posted by CSEe

Perhaps I should explain further .........In my current view , Buddhism is beyond knowledge , beyond all understandings , beyond all culture ...so knowledge is just a tiny little part of the process .......

So physical pain like getting hand smashed is just like suicide , people jumping from building , purposely drinking poison and this is very-very common...is happening every day in our culture .......so why do people choose cutting themselves with knife ? Why do people jumping off building ? Do you think they did not know is painful ? .............

So there are millions of people still choose pain / suffer over joy ......and even in our daily life , we said thing to others and regrets later , do thing that we regrets ...is that not painful ? Is regrets not painful , do you not suffering from regrets ?........Do you think smoker does not know smoking is bad ? Why they still smoke ?...perhaps it take more than knowledge for them to change or stop smoking ..perhaps knowledge had caused our confusion .....perhaps awaken to Buddhism , we will get out from this circle of confusion..............

So knowledge is just something we know and is human culture that take knowledge as a guide .....Buddhism is beyond this culture , beyond knowledge so if we never awaken ....we will always in circle of own knowledge , own confusion .............

Do you remember what started this conversation about joy and pain? I was talking about going beyond it into constant intoxication/bliss. That can be felt through all things. Doesn't take away the senses but makes one always feel good.

You explained how pain and joy are the same. Since then you been going on and on about knowledge about it.

Now your going on about beyond knowledge. Its like a philosophy or religion full of hot air. So far you have offered nothing but a lot of talk. Like a battlefield of words. Its really strange.

I can pretty much guarantee you will go on with a bunch of words about nothing again. What I offered has something standing behind it. It can be felt and described. It makes sense to anyone whom isn't in denial about joy. How joy is preferred over pain. How it would be nice to feel joy in all conditions of life. Not removing the senses but blanketing them and ones life with a joy full feeling.

[BlueSky]

A battlefield of words....I like that

[no1wakesup]

Originally Posted by wstein

If one is awake they will take the money that they need when it is offered. There is no need for any reflection, any emotion, any focusing, any regret reduction, any realizing, any awareness. It will just spontaneously happen. It will be just as natural and uneventful as lifting your foot in order to start walking.

I hear that realizing and emotion are happening for you. I’m just saying that they don’t need to happen and that they won’t always happen.

Perhaps a story will help here??
I was walking along the sidewalk in Riverside California talking to a friend who was walking beside me. We were coming to a driveway entrance to a small strip mall. I looked left on to the street to see if any traffic would be coming when we got to the drive. Then I notice that I have bent down and my hand is about to grab a $5 bill laying in the gutter. I smiled and watched my hand up pick the $5 bill. I had no awareness of seeing the $5 before I was about to pick it up. I had no recollection of thinking I should pick that up. I had no emotion about finding such a prize. The aware me was solely focused on walking, traffic, and the conversation. There was a brief interruption as I showed my friend the $5 bill as she was wondering what I was doing suddenly bent over. I put it in my wallet and returned to my activity. It would have been entirely possible to have collected the $5 which I would like to have had and put it in my wallet without even being consciously aware of it. The consciously aware part of us is but a tiny fraction of who we are even as a being. Part of being awake is allowing those other parts to participate in the life experience, they are aware too in their own way; and to allow them to do so without ‘checking in’ first.

Yes...beautiful.