Observer vs Observed

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy

I guess this post was made in one of those momentary lapses where your ego-mind slipped into duality? LOL!

Here's the fundamental difference. My realization is I am not body-mind. I am the pure awareness that has been, is and will be, unqualified, and not the body-mind that wasn't, won't be and between those points has been, will be and is in a constant state of flux.

So what am I, the unchanging with no beginning, end or separation or a different separate "I" literally every single second of every day and only for 70, 80 or 90 years? The prior has no wants, needs, desires or aversions and is perfectly content to simply be (it cannot be otherwise), whereas the latter is subject to all of them. The prior has no need of LoA whereas the latter might find it useful. The prior is non-dual (One) whereas the latter is one of many. The prior is in everything and everything within it whereas the latter, at best, is connected to everything.

The prior doesn't have to switch between duality and non-duality because it is One (non-dual). The latter can experience non-dual awareness when the mind is stilled either in deep meditation or as a result of considerable practice of meditation. The prior has free will whereas the latter has only self-will.

Since body-mind only on occasion perceives non-duality while at other times perceives duality says it all.

So yeah, I'm perplexed by all your posting tying non-dual awareness to body-mind. It simply doesn't make sense nor does it jibe with my experience of non-dual awareness.

So there's no misunderstanding, I understand exactly what you're saying about non-judgment as applicable to peace of body-mind and attained through earnest practice of meditation. I also understand that is not non-duality but simply one of the means to facilitate realization of that end. Oh ye children of immortal bliss! Body-mind can never claim/achieve that, regardless its state of mind or LoA.

My "understanding" is not a product of mind, but direct experience. Go back and find my first couple of posts where I summarized. I had only been exposed to Sadghuru and Vedanta NY for a couple of weeks, at best, though I had been meditating and diving deep into consciousness for a decade. What opened the floodgates was something Sadghuru said about opening up or recognizing the space between awareness and mind.

For the better part of two months I was in bliss 100% of the time with periods of ecstasy. I could 'sense' myself in everything and everything in myself. It's an amazing thing to look at someone and 'sense' yourself looking back. I use 'sense' because there is no word for the experience. To look at my dog and 'sense' the same. To hike through the forest and experience the same with even trees and in fact all living beings. What I 'sensed' is life, not the shell my eyes perceived.

It had absolutely nothing to do with mind or not thinking this way or that way or judging good/bad or presuming or assuming. That is all wholly irrelevant. Didn't even come into play because I was in no way, shape or form body-mind. It held absolutely no sway. It was within me and I within it.

The intensity has since faded but the experiential aspect has not totally dissipated. There's still a reverberation and an unshakable conviction. There's no going back to before September 29th.

Was it a taste of enlightenment? It felt that way at the time. I couldn't have cared less if I lost my job, my house, was hit by a truck, struck by lightening or a meteor fell out of the sky and landed on "me" because none of that could touch "me", only body-mind.

I'll tell ya, even if I never achieve that sustained state of being again that's okay. The briefer periods I now experience are cool enough and even if that eventually fades away that's okay too because now I do understand. I realize.

However it does occur to me the way back to that state is not clutching at the material but an earnest embrace of the spiritual, and obsessing over thinking and LoA is the wrong fork on that path. I do my best to incorporate the spiritual practices in the four yogas, mostly Jnana & Raja with some Karma & Bhakti mixed in. I find that mix best suits this body-mind.

If you have not already done so, read my post #496 to Heart.

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by MikeS80

No correction needed, we are on the same page. You are correct, rewards work both ways-good or positive and bad or negative, The ego converts positive energy-the good into negative energy-the bad by judging the good and positive as bad or negative, this is how the negative (bad) and positive (good) are not seperate from each other and this is how the ego seperates and makes the good and positive and the negative and bad complete opposites (this works the same way towards non-duality, god the infinite too, because it is non-duality, god the infinite's energy that the ego converts ).

A person gets a bad/negative rewards when a person errors by converting god the infinite's good and positive energy into duality energy that opposes god the infinite's good and positive energy, which are of course bad or negative energy by making bad or negative judgments via thoughts (thoughts are energy, thus thoughts are things), this is connected to your comment of the universe/god the infinite sending the person more wanting, needing, and desiring, the imbalanced person is not conscious of what the opposite of his or her request is, so the universe/god the infinite sends the person more and more wanting, needing, and desiring, and he/she receives more and more bad/negative rewards, which eventually leads the person to be in hell by receiving unnecessary suffering, pain, fear, desperation, greed, disappointments and everything else that is bad or negative.

What I mean by posting the above is that the duality of ego-mind-body (form or occupied space) and the formless (empty unoccupied space) in the physical universe is not the problem or issue. The problem or issue is the ego creating the illusion of bad or negative by converting or manipulating the universe's/non-duality/God the infinite's good and positive energy into bad or negative energy.

Edit: the physical universe is non-duality or the infinite in form (occupied space) inside itself, which is the empty unoccupied space that form (occupied space) is surrounded by.

[MikeS80]

It is a challenge to be in deep non-judgmental thought about (non-judgmental) non-duality and then to use the ego's intellect as a tool to communicate the content(s) of those deep non-judgmental thoughts.

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by MikeS80

To be clear to everyone, my intention on this forum is to be 100% positive and to be helpful to people who want to truly listen and who wants to truly learn, learn and listen in a non-judgmental and positive way. And I am on this forum to have positive discussions with people in a non-judgmental and positive way,

I do not even want anyone to perceive me as a teacher or guru. But send me all your money and other negative worldly possessions if you must. #Isaythisbeingsarcastic

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by heart

Thank you for the challenge lol

The crown chakra is communication with your higher self awareness. Communication/Awareness... an all knowing and all understanding part of you yet indifferent to your perception of it, when there 'is a requirement for something to be in your life' then you petition your-self 'FROM' the crown chakra first

The crown chakra is the starting point of manifestation yet your request or petition is not received from the crown chakra it is sent 'out there' for 'all' to receive. your petition is received by the entire universe and all and everything that relates to or is in synchronicity to your request.

You can experience this on a daily basis.... Ever wanted a new vehicle, your request to have one is sent to everyone and every situation you find yourself in, you begin to notice the vehicle you want is everywhere!! before it was not in your life now you cant get rid of them lol,

your crown chakra is the one sending and receiving your request over and over again

Is it possible to manipulate someones crown chakra to manipulate or condition or brainwash their ego-mind?

Yes, but... why?

We are hapless beings at taming our own egos let alone that of others as they are simply reflections of ourselves, in reality you would be asking the universe to find someone or something to manipulate condition brainwash the question raised. you see, energy is not only transferable but will find the least possible resistance... through you, this is why we learn to be humble in the face of adversity when we tread the path of understanding

I asked the question (not in a bad or negative context) you put into bold about manipulation because, I believe people (and maybe even some occult schools of thought and some secret societies ) confuse the astral realm/ethereal plane with the ego converting the universe's/the infinite's good/positive energy into negative/bad energy, this makes them believe that astral realm/ethereal plane is real and/or is the real heaven, when in fact the astral realm/ethereal plane contains all the contents of the ego's spiritual and religious "junk" which are nothing but thoughtforms, Tulsas, these thoughtforms include everything that is ethereal, supernatural, paranormal, etc etc. These people see the paranormal, supernatural etc etc because they believe in it and thier belief in it keeps it alive in the astral plane/ethereal plane. the astral plane/ethereal plane is bound by The LOA/synchronicity.

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by MikeS80

I see. This intuition view of the crown chakra is different and interesting. This means that the crown chakra is connected to or is integrated with the heart chakra.

Adversity, problems, or obstacles in the present moment are illusions because we only perceive them as such, we perceive them with our judgments, biases and by us attaching the illusions of good or bad or positive or negative value to them (because the good and positive gives a reward, the reward usually is mental and physical pleasure, comfort, feeling good, feeling happy etc etc.

Adversity, problems, or obstacles In the present moment are challenges that the univers/the infinite gives to a person to see and to know (via consciousness) how the person reacts to the challenge mentally in a positive or negative way, then the person receives a good or bad reward. This is the cause and effect of karma.

To prevent the cause and effect of karma, just believe without a doubt in your mind that the universe has all your basic needs, needs you need to live covered. After you have mastered this, you can use the LOA/manifestation/synchronicity to get what you want beyond your basic needs.

Edit: The above is in relation to the original topic of this thread of the observed vs observer. The observed vs observer are connected or linked together and to the universe/the infinite/god through consciousness

[davidsun]

Re the Q: "Is it possible to manipulate someones crown chakra to manipulate or condition or brainwash their ego-mind?"

Check out and consider the implications of what's shown in this video:

https://youtu.be/Ua-_wzfu-sc

Though most (I think) would claim otherwise, preferring to think that their beliefs are 'grounded' in 'objective' truth, people generally (IMO) 'manipulate' themselves and sometimes others to 'suit' (as in put on 'airs') their preferred purposes or values via 'belief' selection and affirmation.

Note: such 'purposes' or 'values' may be 'higher' development oriented and open-ended (as in conscious evolution) or 'petty' (as in self-reification - self as presently constituted, that is ). Wanna be a 'chicken' anyone?

From the Gita: :As a man can drink water from any side of a full tank, so the skilled theologian can wrest from any scripture that which will serve his ([or her] purpose."

Such is the Power (and Glory!) of Spirit-guided Mind!

For additional inspiration along these lines, see:

https://founderslosangeles.org/about...e-of-mind-som/

and

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2re...JmB rXTlMWjpV

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by MikeS80

Lo
Adversity, problems, or obstacles In the present moment are challenges that the univers/the infinite gives to a person to see and to know (via consciousness) how the person reacts to the challenge mentally in a positive or negative way, then the person receives a good or bad reward. This is the cause and effect of karma.

To prevent the cause and effect of karma, just believe without a doubt in your mind that the universe has all your basic needs, needs you need to live covered. After you have mastered this, you can use the LOA/manifestation/synchronicity to get what you want beyond your basic needs.

Edit: The above is in relation to the original topic of this thread of the observed vs observer. The observed vs observer are connected or linked together and to the universe/the infinite/god through consciousness

....And enjoy being inside the universe/the infinite as the universe/the infinite gives you your basic needs and what you want/desire. The word joy is in the word enjoy.

[Heart]

Originally Posted by MikeS80

I asked the question (not in a bad or negative context) you put into bold about manipulation because, I believe people (and maybe even some occult schools of thought and some secret societies ) confuse the astral realm/ethereal plane with the ego converting the universe's/the infinite's good/positive energy into negative/bad energy, this makes them believe that astral realm/ethereal plane is real and/or is the real heaven, when in fact the astral realm/ethereal plane contains all the contents of the ego's spiritual and religious "junk" which are nothing but thoughtforms, Tulsas, these thoughtforms include everything that is ethereal, supernatural, paranormal, etc etc. These people see the paranormal, supernatural etc etc because they believe in it and thier belief in it keeps it alive in the astral plane/ethereal plane. the astral plane/ethereal plane is bound by The LOA/synchronicity.

I know you were going to ask a question on this, its why I left it as a question for you to question.

Your choice of word 'belief' or 'believe' is the answer you are looking for here, I will go further into this in a minute but first this;

the answer is ego, its tricks, the smoke and mirrors it plays upon our hearts and minds, it creates belief systems that are binding and restrictive at best. When you begin to 'subdue' the egos attempts to beguile your every efforts to tame it you also begin to see others egos and the exact same issues they are going through, on a grander scale you also notice that there appears to be a global or world ego, what inner wars you have going on inward is a direct reflection of everyone's reflection of physical wars going on in this world today

can you see how important it is to still the mind, to focus on the tranquility between each thought, to see our ego like we were separate from it, listen to our emotions without judgment or concern or indifferent to all the things the ego has had us do/done as if we were witnessing ourselves from outside the box?

As regards the supernatural, we can connect to all and everyone using telepathy (communication or as a form of psychic attack) we can also astral project into another's body, we see ghosts and other spirits or entities just out of our range of sight some of which seem impossible to the untrained mind some of which are scary while others appear when we a distressed to help us in some form or another, ie. NDE, Near Death Experience where the surreal takes on a whole new and often life changing experience


To believe or belief (Devils Dictionary)

Is to lie to oneself to cover our eyes with blinkers and narrow our search for truth for example;

A be-lie-f is asking you to 'be' the 'lie' lie-f or lief literally means; willing, happy too, with pleasure, glad too

we are glad to be-lied too

believe or be-lieve, lieve is the same as lief with a slight change to it, we 'live' the lie

so...
We are glad and willing to live a lie when we believe or have a belief in, something or someone

when im asked if I believe in something my response is... I am, an open book to the all-that-is

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by davidsun

Re the Q: "Is it possible to manipulate someones crown chakra to manipulate or condition or brainwash their ego-mind?"

Check out and consider the implications of what's shown in this video:

https://youtu.be/Ua-_wzfu-sc

Though most (I think) would claim otherwise, preferring to think that their beliefs are 'grounded' in 'objective' truth, people generally (IMO) 'manipulate' themselves and sometimes others to 'suit' (as in put on 'airs') their preferred purposes or values via 'belief' selection and affirmation.

Note: such 'purposes' or 'values' may be 'higher' development oriented and open-ended (as in conscious evolution) or 'petty' (as in self-reification - self as presently constituted, that is ). Wanna be a 'chicken' anyone?

From the Gita: :As a man can drink water from any side of a full tank, so the skilled theologian can wrest from any scripture that which will serve his ([or her] purpose."

Such is the Power (and Glory!) of Spirit-guided Mind!

For additional inspiration along these lines, see:

https://founderslosangeles.org/about...e-of-mind-som/

and

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2re...JmB rXTlMWjpV