Messiah: King, Christ Self, and Word

[Amilius777]

I want to put this up because it may add some dimensions to the Gospels.

After my intense studies Jesus gives many different levels of what the Messiah is and who the Messiah is.

I think this is intriguing.

Let me start with the first level of the Messiah from the ground up:

The King:

The Messiah is sometimes a political-spiritual figure of the Old Testament. David, Solomon, and even Cyrus of Persia can be seen as messiahs. They were anointed as metaphysical kings. Solomon and his father David were very psychic and discerning of God's wisdom. We see that the "promised" Messiah would descend from other kingly messiahs. This savior would be a king in a metaphysical sense. He is given the authority to change the destiny of Israel and the World at large because he will be blessed with the fullness of Spirit.

When Jesus asked his disciples in private- "Who do you same I am?" they said many things but it took Peter to say- 'You are the Messiah!" Jesus says amen to Peter. Peter realized that Jesus this Jewish peasant Cynic was the chosen one to fulfill the prophecies and bring a new covenant.

As the new Davidic King, Jesus would need to become the scapegoat of Israel and the Lamb of the World. As the scapegoat he would suffer the sins of his people so that they could keep peace with Rome, but Jesus as scapegoat suffers the world's sin which is "violence". But as the Lamb of God he takes away the error or "cycle of violence" by exchanging curses for graces. This example and pattern establishes the new Covenant.

So technically the "savior" role that Jesus plays in the Christianity is a more political-metaphysical role. Why? Because Judaism' spirituality and political agenda are one and same. You can not separate the two in tradition. So Jesus was a "world savior" who had responsibility to evolve the planet to a new direction. He did it and it's done if we follow the example.

The Christ Self:

When Jesus says in the Gospel of John such things as "Before Abraham was, I am", and "I and the Father are One", and "God gave his only begotten Son" The author is expressing the God-Self. Or should we say "Christ Self". This Self or Son is the only reflection/begotten of God that says- "I AND THE SOURCE ARE ONE!". This Self is deeply within us. This is why Jesus tells the healed- "It is your faith that has healed you!". Jesus the Man didn't heal directly. Instead the presence of Jesus triggered a faithful response in the sick and they healed themselves! Wow! Amazing! The sick, dead, leper, possessed were cured by faith in their Higher Self- the Only Begotten Son. And this faith was kindled by Jesus and his presence. He was merely the channel, the conduit of Grace. And the healing was self-healing. This God-Christ-True Self was begotten within all of us in the beginning. It is the mediator between our little selves (son of man) and God.

This is why Jesus distinguished "son of man" from "Son of God". We have lost awareness of our Son-of God nature by identifying with the ego and becoming sons of men. Jesus even says- "The Son of Man has the power of forgiveness" You the person who are a channel of the Christ have the power to take away people's sins and thus your sins are forgiven and the cycle of karma ends.

Plain and simple.

The Word/Logos:

John's Gospel adds another dimension to this Messiah and it pretty much sums up the entire Thread. This is the Word or Logos. The Word is the "Universal Christ-consciousness. This is a Universal Redeemer that manifested within the material universe and manifests as all. When John the Divine and Paul say things like- "the body of Christ" and "Christ in all" and "Christ is the Image of God", and "Christ is God" this refers to the "Second Person of the Godhead". This Universal Christ-consciousness was fully realized in Jesus and latent in all souls in the Earth-plane.

When Jesus speaks of himself as the "Son" or as "GOD" in John's Gospel it is the author's intent to show that Jesus realized he was a member of the Trinity. This is the ultimate stage of consciousness.

Jesus became the "Christ or Messiah" in the fullest form when he died and resurrected. All limitation ended, he transcended time and space, and entered complete God-consciousness.

John's Gospel is showing the macrocosm of the Christ as a Cosmic Judge, Creator, and Consciousness. But the other 3 Synoptic Gospels show the microcosmic Jesus as the promised King, as a world savior, and a way-shower.

Combine the two and we see the two sides of Jesus Christ, or should we say the two sides of the human person whether latent or manifest.

One side we have the divine nature which is both your True Self and a universal consciousness called "The Son of God and Logos". And we have the human nature which is an individual human consciousness that is a Son of man, a channel, and a participant of divine life.

[Miss Hepburn]

Thank you for sharing what you have studied ... you don't have to.
I know.
I, for one, appreciate it for sure.

[Seawolf]

How do you interpret John 3:16 as being about a universal Christ self? Jesus is talking about one person ('only begotten').

If Jesus did not heal, how do you explain raising Lazarus from the dead? Lazarus was not around to have faith and use his Christ self to heal himself.

[Amilius777]

Seawolf-

I need to start with this. John's Gospel is the least factual but more based on faith.

Sadly "Only Begotten Son" in John's Gospel isn't even the correct translation.

The oldest translation from Professor Bart Ehrman state- "Unique Son" or "Unique God" and "Firstborn Son".

Jesus also speaks in the third person a lot in John's Gospel. It is because John's Gospel is and I repeat as taught in Seminarian School IS a Confessional Gospel.

It is not a factual, historical, or literal Gospel. The entire History is bogus and so are the characters. John the Baptist, Jesus, and the Evangelist Author are the same voice. This doesn't mean John's Gospel is some hoax. It is just meant to be Metaphysical and Mystical.

Jesus is called "God's begotten" in Mark and Matthew at the Baptism. In Luke's Gospel God says to Jesus in the earliest translation at the Baptism- "You are my Son, today I have begotten you!".

We can see that Son of God in Mark, Matthew, and even Luke is a messianic title establishing Jesus' identity as a human being and prophet for Israel and his mission.

Son of God in John's Gospel refers to the divinity of Jesus WHICH Jesus at times speaks about in the "Third Person". Jesus says- "Whoever has the Son" or "God sent his Unique Son", "The Son and the Father are One". Why does Jesus not refer to himself as this Son?

Because John's audience is very similar to Thomas' audience who wrote his own gospel making Jesus' sonship more of a "consciousness" than a person. Thomas speaks of the Christ as a consciousness. So does John's Gospel, Ephesians, Paul's writings, and Colossians.

When Jesus raises Lazarus from the dead in John's Gospel he says- "I am the Resurrection of the dead!" This is the author's intent to show that the Son has authority over life and death. Jesus probably never said these words. IF Jesus even for once used the word "I am" to address himself as God, his own Disciples would have killed him immediately. It was THEE most awful sin to call yourself the " I AM". He would have been stoned by multitudes or even by his own family.

John's Gospel is speaking about the silent Christ, the Christ who doesn't speak with human lips but who intimates his presence within and without. The presence of Jesus was enough for some Disciples to recognize their God within him. It is to show that Jesus was the first human being to be consciously one with God while in flesh.

The reason why "Only Begotten Son" is not limited to the person of Jesus is BECAUSE of John's Opening: "In the beginning was the Logos". The Logos is a neuter identity that is both some sort of cosmic force and power. Here we see the Greek influence of a "Universal consciousness". This also influenced St. Paul because of his Greek background. Only Begotten Son is sometimes also called the "Nous".

Hermes in Greek tradition called himself the "Nous" or "Word". It meant the divine mind that created the universe. It is not a "Single Person" like we think of Person. It is a Divine Person, Persona, Personification, Personality.

It is NOT an individual.

Lazarus was called forth because Jesus was demonstrating his own power over death. It had nothing to do with Lazarus being aware of the Universal Christ-Self. The story is ONLY told in John's Gospel.

Don't you think if Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead people would have been running around going crazy. A zombie coming out of his grave would have sparked an instantaneous conversion all throughout the land. And what happened to Lazarus afterwards? None of the Apostles say anything about the Man. He is only found in John's Gospel and in no other writing among anybody! And I don't just mean the Gospels I mean even the Acts, Letters, Gnostic Texts, Revelations, etc Nothing. Zip. Nada.

It was a narrative device by the Author John to show that Jesus or the "Christ" in Jesus has the power over death.

Besides Jesus raised a widow's son and Jairus' daughter in the Synoptic Gospels. They were dead for a few hours. Sounds a lot like resuscitation which happens in hospitals nowadays, not resurrection. Jesus is the only person in the Bible to literally resurrect from the dead. I don't think the Lazarus story literally happened.


And I didn't mean that Jesus "didn't heal". Of course he healed. He was a healer. What I mean is that those who were healed were opened to that Christ-Self. If you notice many times in the Gospels Jesus does NOT and can NOT heal everybody. Some Scholars even think Jesus comes off as a jerk at times but so did the Buddha. The reason is because these types of souls resonate on a different plane. Jesus didn't just openly heal everybody. Read it yourself. He only heals those who are opened to his power and their own faith within themselves.

[Seawolf]

Thanks.

If someone can resurrect themselves from the dead he/she must be someone special because 'normal' people can't do that. We can't even resurrect others from the dead, much less ourselves. Given the entire New Testament as its presented I think you would have to take quite a few leaps to not surmise that this Jesus character was at least one of a kind, if not God's one and only son. Everyone and the Brady Bunch has Christ Consciousness these days but I don't see any dead being raised.

What is so wrong with the interpretation that Jesus is the one and only son of God? Religions have had plenty of man-gods in the past. It seems many don't like it because it doesn't fit in with the times. It would be nice if people could just be honest and say they don't 'want' to believe in certain things instead of trying to convince themselves and others that they have the Truth(tm). It's as if people think they have the pinnacle of spirituality. But what people see as Truth today will be old-fogy fundamentalism in the future.

[Amilius777]

Hey Seawolf!

No probably believing Jesus is the only begotten Son. Of course the word in this text that is always forgotten is "begotten". It means to be brought into being. That was what begotten meant.

Luke says Jesus is brought into being as Christ at his conception and baptism
Matthew says at his birth and baptism
Mark says his Baptism
John says in the "Beginning" of creation.

It seems that Jesus is the unique Son of God because he is the only servant or messenger of God that was brought directly into the world by God's will, command, act, and choice.

God sent us Jesus. It is some what different from Moses becoming a deliverer later in life, Mohammed becoming a prophet, Siddhartha coming to a realization, and David anointed as a king.

Jesus was chosen prenatally and postnatal as God's historical Christ.

It's Simple:

In the mind of God we are all one and part of God. God gave us free will and we left Heaven to experience matter and bring down the Christ-consciousness into the earth- to make a Heaven on earth. Of course this may not have been the original intention. Why? Because many souls incarnated and still incarnate for selfish purposes and have causes a lot of damage. The story of Lucifer and Nebuchanezzar in the Bible are intertwined. This is not a coincidence. Lucifer, the soul identity of Nebuchadnezzar prenatally developed a prideful spirit and expelled himself from higher realms and incarnated as Nebuchadnezzar into a royal lineage. Because of the pattern inherent in his spirit and mind, Nebuchadnezzar developed into a tyrant and "Luciferic" type in history.

Opposite works with Jesus. God chose the soul of Jesus to become the Christ. You would think where did Jesus receive this criteria? Some spirits choose to be messengers and guides for the universe. Jesus the messenger was chosen for the Earth to become the Christ. Jesus took the destiny and incarnated and lived his journey on Earth. He didn't give into sin which means "he didn't separate from God's will". He constantly obeyed God. Did Jesus have sexual feelings? Probably. Did Jesus drink too much one night? Probably. Did Jesus not bath sometimes? Yes it says he didn't! Did Jesus have the hots in puberty for some ladies? Well of course. Did Jesus have a temper? Oh boy he did. He trashed that Temple like a beast!

Did Jesus ever harm himself, anyone or anything mentally, physically, or spiritually? No. And that is the Will of the Father. He succeeded, fulfilled the Scriptures, and went back to God/heaven/oneness.

---

That's it.