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17-01-2017, 04:03 PM
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Master
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,847
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Since all is One...
Any duality - whatever the form - is reconciled by higher or transcendent truth.
As such, "higher self" or "Highest Self" is not separate from, or in a battle with lower self - but in fact subsumes it as part and parcel of Itself, by nature.
Identification with, and as higher self surpasses and is inclusive of lower self, including the limited or ignorant perception of and by the objective material senses.
Identification with limited material senses is a conditional exclusion of Higher self and as such creates or sustains dualistic perception.
~ J
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17-01-2017, 04:21 PM
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Master
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Canada
Posts: 7,720
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jyotir
As such, "higher self" or "Highest Self" is not separate from, or in a battle with lower self - but in fact subsumes it as part and parcel of Itself, by nature.
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Hi Jyotir. Yes. Absolutely. Very well put. BUT... getting to that higher-self place in one's understanding, requires seeing, and recognizing, and acknowledging the duality in life, in order to know how to transform it.
Arguing that duality isn't real, without having any understanding of higher-self awareness, karma, reincarnation, the eternal soul, the purpose of existence, etc., is rather like pounding nails into random boards and assuming that activity will eventually metamorphosis into a house. People want to skip having to study the spiritual blueprints, and just wing it instead.
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17-01-2017, 06:40 PM
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Moderator
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southwest, USA
Posts: 25,134
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I thought that was an excellent orig post, William
Very clearly written.
'Something can not exist and not exist at the same time.
If you perceive something, then by definition it exists. You can not perceive something that does not exist." - William
BUT! lol...that 'something' that exists and is perceived by my receptors...
eyes, brain, nerves...still is not what it is!
I'm laughing...this is fun stuff.
It's just is a bunch of atoms looking like 'something'.
Separate those atoms farther apart...then where is it?
I still see 'things' as real as Brad Pitt on a movie screen...where the
screen is 'appearing' temporarily as a 'screen'....but really isn't.
Laughing more now.
Like the steak in The Matrix, for example.
Can anyone say Hologram?
Great topic!
"subsumes'? Jyotir :)
__________________
.*I'll text in Navy Blue when I'm speaking as a Mod. :)
Prepare yourself for the coming astral journey of death by daily riding in the balloon of God-perception.
Through delusion you are perceiving yourself as a bundle of flesh and bones, which at best is a nest of troubles.
Meditate unceasingly, that you may quickly behold yourself as the Infinite Essence, free from every form of misery. ~Paramahansa's Guru's Guru.
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17-01-2017, 07:08 PM
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Master
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,087
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jyotir
Any duality - whatever the form - is reconciled by higher or transcendent truth.
As such, "higher self" or "Highest Self" is not separate from, or in a battle with lower self - but in fact subsumes it as part and parcel of Itself, by nature.
Identification with, and as higher self surpasses and is inclusive of lower self, including the limited or ignorant perception of and by the objective material senses.
Identification with limited material senses is a conditional exclusion of Higher self and as such creates or sustains dualistic perception.
~ J
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Ahh...I love these concise nuggets of truth, though I equally enjoy the detailed ones too
Baile...also agreed...folks need to find their way back home, and it helps to talk about it and discuss.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn
"subsumes'? Jyotir :)
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Hahaha....
Oh yes...subsumes indeed
and thank God for that...give love and forgiveness a chance, right?
Peace & blessings all
7L
__________________
Bound by conventions, people tend to reach for what is easy.
Here we must be unafraid of what is difficult.
For all living beings in nature must unfold in their particular way
and become themselves despite all opposition.
-- Rainer Maria Rilke
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18-01-2017, 07:25 AM
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Master
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H:O:R:A:C:E
i don't enjoy arguments either; not the kind that become bickering over
whose point was made better. there is another kind of 'argument' which
is used to provide evidence for a conclusion -- those can be entertaining.
my explanation for how night and day are "opposites" would use the idea
that they are complementary and not in opposition. just as a sphere would
be incomplete without each of it's hemispheres, or applause would be
impossible without either of the hands participating, so are night and day
conjoined 'opposites' of a single whole.
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Yep sounds more plausible than the simple binary of opposition used in certain ways to describe events and things. For me, there is little comfort in suggesting that the earth spinning on its axis and moving in rotation around the sun is a 'binary' or 'polar' movement ? but the concept of binary oppositions plays a big part in our in terms of creation ie. computers and conduction of energy ? I'm no scientist but i kind get the polarisation thing.
The idea that a perceived fluid movement however is made up of tiny binaries seems to ring a bell ? Although ive never investigated that one.
And also the Zen Koan springs to mind. What is the sound of one hand clapping ?
__________________
Too much intellectual pride and not enough intellectual beauty
To Thine own Self be True
The Frost performs its secret ministry,Unhelped by any wind. Samuel Taylor Coleridge
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18-01-2017, 08:08 AM
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Suspended
Ascender
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 993
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jyotir
[indent][color="Navy"]Since all is One...
....
As such, "higher self" or "Highest Self" is not separate from, or in a battle with lower self - but in fact subsumes it as part and parcel of Itself, by nature.
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If 'all is one' how could there be a higher and a lower self subsumed by the higher?
Obviously it is the lower self who cares for the higher self because the higher self could not even go shopping since for it 'all is one'
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18-01-2017, 08:24 AM
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Master
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H:O:R:A:C:E
i don't enjoy arguments either; not the kind that become bickering over
whose point was made better. there is another kind of 'argument' which
is used to provide evidence for a conclusion -- those can be entertaining.
my explanation for how night and day are "opposites" would use the idea
that they are complementary and not in opposition. just as a sphere would
be incomplete without each of it's hemispheres, or applause would be
impossible without either of the hands participating, so are night and day
conjoined 'opposites' of a single whole.
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Sounds more plausible than a strict binary interpretation of opposites. The idea that the earth is spinning on her axis around an orbit of the sun, that this is somehow a binary phenomenon, in terms of night and day doesn't ring true at all. But of course the binary principle is at work in such things as computers and the conduction of energy. Polarisation in this sense I can understand at least in a general way. However I'm not totally adverse to the idea that a fluid motion is made up of many many binaries ? lol I've just refuted myself, prey call off the Galilean hordes who are crashing through the door even as i speak lol...yep so i think ive come across this concept of binaries appearing as a fluid motion in cinematogarphy ? forgive my ignorance and slow mind lol. Thanks for replying Horace, good points.
Sorry I've replied Twice to that post HORACE unbeknowns to me. A Binary slip up. when i looked earlier today the first reply wasn't there ? So apologies for that sir.
__________________
Too much intellectual pride and not enough intellectual beauty
To Thine own Self be True
The Frost performs its secret ministry,Unhelped by any wind. Samuel Taylor Coleridge
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18-01-2017, 08:35 AM
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Suspended
Ascender
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 993
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baile
...
Arguing that duality isn't real, without having any understanding of higher-self awareness, karma, reincarnation, the eternal soul, the purpose of existence, etc., is rather like pounding nails into random boards and assuming that activity will eventually metamorphosis into a house. People want to skip having to study the spiritual blueprints, and just wing it instead.
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Duality innately conditions human experience which is why many human individuals hold it to be true and real but if rationally investigated duality is neither true nor real.
In contrast to duality phenomena like 'higher-self awareness, karma, reincarnation, the eternal soul, the purpose of existence, etc.' altogether do not innately condition human experience because they are arbitrarily constructed views acquired depending on philosophies and/or religions.
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18-01-2017, 09:45 AM
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Master
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 2,754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baile
Darn Joe, I was just getting around to commenting on your post. Your point was well-taken. I would add people try way too hard to distance themselves from innocuous, simple-to-understand human words and concepts like duality, reality, and truth. But that's the nature of intellectual analysing, which is pretty much the nature of the dehumanizing internet as well. Now if we were together in a salon, we could take a couple of sips or puffs, sit back, and let our thoughts drift and formulate into a kind of collective human wisdom-cohesive. Alas though, 'tis not the reality.
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Hey Baile, Sorry about that got a bit panicked with that post lol. Your right about the terms and language and analyzing, it can be all very misleading at times. I'll have to buy you a pint of Guinness and we'd all be sure to come up some good stuff. Actually that reminds me, we were drinking in this pub one time in Dublin, and i went to the jacks for a leak (marvelous english)lol. meaning we went to the john ...anyway lol. ..and this guy standing at a urinal says out real loud in a very philosophical voice, 'Time is the duration of things that change' lol...everybody in the jacks was like what !!!??? for a split second and then everybody nodded hey true story ! you just remidned me lol. Ok thanks for the comments. enjoyed reading them.
__________________
Too much intellectual pride and not enough intellectual beauty
To Thine own Self be True
The Frost performs its secret ministry,Unhelped by any wind. Samuel Taylor Coleridge
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18-01-2017, 09:56 AM
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Suspended
Ascender
Join Date: Dec 2016
Posts: 993
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Mc
...Your right about the terms and language and analyzing, it can be all very misleading at times.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Mc
I'll have to buy you a pint of Guinness and we'd all be sure to come up some good stuff. Actually that reminds me, we were drinking in this pub one time in Dublin, ...
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Guinness can be very misleading at times.
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