Guru Trap

^ That film rocks!

..."you think too much"....I can't tell you how many times I have had that come into my mind in spiritual groups/boards...

Thanks for the laugh Shepherd!

[Lazarus72]

What if I were to tell myself that these people you suppose, have equal potential to make up their mind, as you yourself do.

Shepherd, although you point to ways people often speak philosophically/conceptually....these are not the people that others choose to follow. On that point you are quite drastically mistaken. And I say that, because by pointing to the people others won't follow...you leave the way wide open for people to fall into real 'guru traps'.

People dont follow when they feel inferior...people follow because they feel good about being part of it. They are led by their psychological needs and desires...by being shown what they imagine is love, or magic, or strength, or heroism...it is the knight in shining armour they jump on the back of the horse for, not the one who insults them.

Shepherd, although you point to ways people often speak philosophically/conceptually....these are not the people that others choose to follow. On that point you are quite drastically mistaken. And I say that, because by pointing to the people others won't follow...you leave the way wide open for people to fall into real 'guru traps'.

People dont follow when they feel inferior...people follow because they feel good about being part of it. They are led by their psychological needs and desires...by being shown what they imagine is love, or magic, or strength, or heroism...it is the knight in shining armour they jump on the back of the horse for, not the one who insults them.

That's not what is happening though is it Heather so drastically mistaken is your opinion but not mine or some others either. People do follow when they feel inferior, check out how cults operate, they dont prey on people who feel good already they prey on people who are stressed and vulnerable. I can get a free stress test outside the offices of the Scientologists for example.

People are lured by guru speak which sounds amazing,

Would you like to be free in your mind?
Unconditional in love?
Unlimited in power?
Dissolve all karma
Be healed

and so on. All abstract but it promises good stuff to people who want to feel good and empowered.

Not only that spiritualists are a marketing mans dream as they are part of the holistic crowd. This means with a bit of abstract phrasing and some strange science we will buy into that amazing stuff which actually does nothing at all. Check out balance bands, quantum pendants, detoxing pads etc.

I'm not saying that its just the weak which fall to great sounding abstract stuff, we all have at various times in our lives but being aware of it with threads like this can create a choice of what someone decides to do next.

shepherd, For about four decades, I have been studying the nature of consciousness, utopian communities, so-called new age spirituality and a lot of other things that some of us label "get well." Yes, gurus, would be gurus and purveyors of "get well" talk about such things as unconditional love, freedom, ego, self and a lot of other things we are familiar with, and there's a very good reason they do that.

Concepts such as unconditional love, higher consciousness, freedom, etc. are very powerful. Going back to the time of the Greek philosophers, Jesus, Buddha, Confucious and others, people have been considering these things. The way that good practitioners of "get well" work is they put together a package of time- honored ideas that many people resonate with. Well constructed "get well" can contain something like 98% time-honored concepts, and 2% of the would-be gurus own schtick, complete with appropriate catch words and phrases so that the "customer/mark" can feel like they are part of an in group.

I have known or been involved with people who were part of Esalen, Scientology, est, osho, John Gray ("Men Are From Mars...), Katie, Tolle, Wilber, Abraham/Hicks and others. At the moment, I know of about 10 individuals or groups operating in the San Francisco Bay Area, and most of these groups offer a mix of spirituality, sensuality, yoga and so on. Some of these people and/or groups are very good at what they do, and, truth be told, they do some people some good at least some of the time.

I've got to tell you, shepherd, after examing your website(s), Facebook page, etc., I'd have to lump you in with the rest of the get wellers. I'd also like to point out that the fact that guru types talk about unconditional love and other things that can elevate our lives doesn't, in any way, diminish the power, importance or availability of love, freedom, joy, happiness, compassion, gratitude or life enhancing qualities.

If you'd like to talk more about any or all of these things, I'm more than willing.

Originally Posted by LaMont Cranston

shepherd, For about four decades, I have been studying the nature of consciousness

So, what is the nature of consciousness?

I've got to tell you, shepherd, after examing your website(s), Facebook page, etc., I'd have to lump you in with the rest of the get wellers.

And that's your opinion Lamont Cranston based on your perspectives. i'm not going to argue as your opinion is also littered with abstract concepts about what you think you know or are doing.

If anyone is unclear about what I do then feel free to go to my website and check it out. You can decide for yourselves where you want to lump me as I have nothing to hide.

(there's always one that wants to get personal.)

-snip-

[psychoslice]

There are many who have found true happiness through Awakening or Enlightenment than any psychology or psychiatry can eve offer.

Originally Posted by psychoslice

There are many who have found true happiness through Awakening or Enlightenment than any psychology or psychiatry can eve offer.

What is true happiness?

There are many who have found true happiness through Awakening or Enlightenment than any psychology or psychiatry can eve offer.

Who? That's the thing is this was happening as promoted then we would be seeing something to encourage us to do the same. The thing is for me, I am not. I see people who claim happiness, unconditional love etc but their behaviours and attitudes don't match their claims at all.

Are we designed to really be this enlightened, happy, unconditional creation?