Befriending the ego

[FrogWarrior]

I was dead set on annihilating my ego, but before I did a sacred plant medicine ceremony, the guy I stayed with (the shaman recommended I stay with him, he was clearly spiritually adept) the night before and after the ceremony, he said "I don't have a problem with my ego, so long as its a proper ego". His perspective was that we incarnate with the ego, seeking to destroy it is seeking to escape what it. So his approach instead is "developing a proper ego". He said a few things which indicated a lack of wisdom (one example is he said he perceives people who commit suicide as traitors, I'm a bit too wise and compassionate to hold a view like that), but he was ahead of me in a whole lot of ways, and he influenced me a lot.

This proper ego thing, it stuck. He also said the only advice he gives people going into the ceremonies is "keep breathing". I didn't understand it, and still don't quite understand it. I lost focus of my breathe throughout most of the ceremony, and afterwards when he asked if I kept breathing and I told him no, he said "you should have, you would have". He was clearly psychic, I noted that. He impacted my "journey" in the ceremony, theres no question about that.

Developing a proper ego, I take it, this means cleaning ones shadow so that the ego comes into the light more and more, and is transformed from a menace into a friend/ally/servant of the heart. I could be completely misinterpreting it, but befriending the ego is replacing my old intent to destroy it.

This appears to be a nice representation of the process (its funny too):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYOXUYahyIU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhauDAMg7Ho
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8wek950vOc

Transforming the mind from adversary to ally.

[HereAndNow]

Hi FrogWarrior,
Great that you found an approach that works for you!

"Ego" can mean many things though ... this can be confusing.
Like (taken quickly from various dictionaries):
1. Your feeling of your self-importance
2. The part of you that separates itself from the outside world and considers itself a separate entity from the rest of nature and the cosmos.
3. Your idea or opinion of yourself
4. The part of a person's mind that tries to match the hidden desires with the demands of the real world
5. The “I” or self of any person; a person as thinking, feeling, and willing, and distinguishing itself from the selves of others.

When someone talks about developing a proper ego he probably means number 3, 4 or 5 ... while if someone talks about destroying the ego he probably means number 1 or number 2.

So there is no contradiction really.

And what regards destroying the ego ... to my opinion destroying something - or any such aggressive attitude - never works in things spiritual ... it only creates more tension.
What is unnecessary needs to be let go of ... gently.

Good luck!

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by FrogWarrior

I was dead set on annihilating my ego, but before I did a sacred plant medicine ceremony, the guy I stayed with (the shaman recommended I stay with him, he was clearly spiritually adept) the night before and after the ceremony, he said "I don't have a problem with my ego, so long as its a proper ego". His perspective was that we incarnate with the ego, seeking to destroy it is seeking to escape what it. So his approach instead is "developing a proper ego". He said a few things which indicated a lack of wisdom (one example is he said he perceives people who commit suicide as traitors, I'm a bit too wise and compassionate to hold a view like that), but he was ahead of me in a whole lot of ways, and he influenced me a lot.

This proper ego thing, it stuck. He also said the only advice he gives people going into the ceremonies is "keep breathing". I didn't understand it, and still don't quite understand it. I lost focus of my breathe throughout most of the ceremony, and afterwards when he asked if I kept breathing and I told him no, he said "you should have, you would have". He was clearly psychic, I noted that. He impacted my "journey" in the ceremony, theres no question about that.

Developing a proper ego, I take it, this means cleaning ones shadow so that the ego comes into the light more and more, and is transformed from a menace into a friend/ally/servant of the heart. I could be completely misinterpreting it, but befriending the ego is replacing my old intent to destroy it.

This appears to be a nice representation of the process (its funny too):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYOXUYahyIU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OhauDAMg7Ho
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8wek950vOc

Transforming the mind from adversary to ally.

The ego is the facade of our character/personality constructed by mind for defensive purposes geared to the perceived threats that it has detected in the context of our experience. It is essential to our survival. It takes energy to maintain and mind will only maintain the aspects of it that it regards as relevant. This may vary as we evolve.

Far from being a barrier to our connection to Oneness, it is already Oneness manifesting as that protection.

[markings]

Originally Posted by Iamit

Far from being a barrier to our connection to Oneness, it is already Oneness manifesting as that protection.

... of something that does not really need protection?
Why would ego, if part of the Oneness need protection? It only needs it to maintain its separation.

With crime we say follow the money, here we can who or what benefits. This kind of ego-self-serving view is what the ego would come up with, isn't it?

A proper ego is one which does not exists.

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by markings

... of something that does not really need protection?
Why would ego, if part of the Oneness need protection? It only needs it to maintain its separation.

With crime we say follow the money, here we can who or what benefits. This kind of ego-self-serving view is what the ego would come up with, isn't it?

A proper ego is one which does not exists.

Ask the question, if All is One, what else, other than Oneness, is available to arise as Ego?

Ego is our character/personality constructed by mind to defend against rejection starting in childhood and retained as necessary throughout our lives. Mental hospitals are full of people whose egos have been crushed by rejection.

In some people mind projects the ultimate defense against rejection, that the separate person no longer exists, which is another way of saying that ego has been eliminated or overcome. That defense is often referred to as enlightenment, liberation, or awakening. Far from being eliminated, Ego contiues to exist, hiding behind that defense.

In other cases a resonance with the idea All is One sees that ego must be Oneness manifest and does not have to be modified in any way for the purpose of connection to that Oneness.

[markings]

Originally Posted by Iamit

Ask the question, if All is One, what else, other than Oneness, is available to arise as Ego?

Ego is our character/personality constructed by mind to defend against rejection starting in childhood and retained as necessary throughout our lives. Mental hospitals are full of people whose egos have been crushed by rejection.

In some people mind projects the ultimate defense against rejection, that the separate person no longer exists, which is another way of saying that ego has been eliminated or overcome. That defense is often referred to as enlightenment, liberation, or awakening. Far from being eliminated, Ego contiues to exist, hiding behind that defense.

In other cases a resonance with the idea All is One sees that ego must be Oneness manifest and does not have to be modified in any way for the purpose of connection to that Oneness.

Oneness giving birth to ego, which then creates separation against which it will have to defend itself because western ego becomes the self-reference point against which everything is judged.
Is it any wonder that world is full of physically and mentally sick people?

What is proposed as a remedy? Enhancing, developing and nurturing the ego. The thing which has caused the whole problem to begin with. A great strategy.

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by markings

Oneness giving birth to ego, which then creates separation against which it will have to defend itself because western ego becomes the self-reference point against which everything is judged.
Is it any wonder that world is full of physically and mentally sick people?

What is proposed as a remedy? Enhancing, developing and nurturing the ego. The thing which has caused the whole problem to begin with. A great strategy.

Working from the assumption that Oneness is the only reality then yes it could be said that Oneness creates/appears as ego. There is a version that tries to describe the mechanisms by which that ceation/appearance arises. One such is that mind is created/appears as the protector of the organism/person and constructs the ego (character/personality) to defend against rejection. In such a scenario ego does not have to be eliminated for the purpose of connection to Oneness because ego must also be Oneness! It only becomes problematic if ego is excluded from being Oneness which of course would be a contradiction in terms as there is nothing else available if Oneness is the only relality!

We are so used to regarding some things as unacceptable that its difficult to break that habit to include those things as Oneness, but until that is done the tension between our views about those things and all inclusive Oneness prevents the end of feeling disconnected. So it is not that ego needs to be developed but simply accepted as Oneness. Mind can and will continue to monitor and maintain the ego it has constructed as it deems necessary depending on how it perceives threats of rejection in our relationships.

It should be emphasised however that disconnection from Oneness is impossible because it must already be Oneness appearang as our feeling of disconnection! Thats how complete and unavoidable connection to Oneness is.

:)

[Miss Hepburn]

Originally Posted by Iamit

Far from being a barrier to our connection to Oneness,
it is already Oneness manifesting as that protection.

Um, that was brilliant.

[Iamit]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

Um, that was brilliant.

One could see why meditation would be a way to eliminate the separate person, so hateful some have come to believe it to be.

Originally Posted by Iamit

The ego is the facade of our character/personality constructed by mind for defensive purposes geared to the perceived threats that it has detected in the context of our experience. It is essential to our survival. It takes energy to maintain and mind will only maintain the aspects of it that it regards as relevant. This may vary as we evolve.

Nice. Short, succinct, and accurate.
From an evolutionary perspective, the ego is created by the mind as a representation of self, to be compared to what the mind believes self should be in order to survive and thrive. Where the mind perceives deficiencies, shame is generated to create emotional pain and suffering to motivate change to remedy those deficiencies. I expect it is often when the mind finds too much to feel deficient about and generates too much shame and anxiety that we start to see eliminating the ego as a worthwhile goal. Which I think is a shame as there is much wisdom to be gained from the ego.
When scientists want to study the history of a landscape, they look within it for clues. Types and arrangements of sediments and rocks, types of pollen in lake bed sediments, tree rings, fossils, and many other things can tell the story of what took place in the past and how it all worked to shape the land as it is today. From a soul’s perspective, the ego could play a similar role. What the mind sees self (ego) to be, as well as what it believes self should be, are both heavily influenced by inputs (of all kinds) from the life experience. The ego is an integrator of all that we have experienced throughout life, and it is a living example of how what we do onto others effects them, just like what others do onto us affects us. The way we react to present day experiences, the feelings they generate in us, the beliefs we hold, our tastes, our fears about ourselves, and our anxieties and neurosis, all bear witness to the life we have experienced, and the consequences of those experiences on our minds belief about what self is and what it believes self should be. If we can get past those fears and that pain and realize the ego is not us, but rather is a “facade of our character/personality constructed by mind for defensive purposes geared to the perceived threats that it has detected in the context of our experience” then we may be able to gain some wisdom from it. If we cannot do so in life, the perhaps after life, when the ego is not taken so personally and can be seen and felt with some level of objectivity and compassion for both the character we just were and the characters other souls were and are experiencing. A pretty direct way to learn what love is, what giving it can do, and also what withholding it can do to others, and all gained from the experience of a separate and separated self.