Self Liberation through Seeing with Naked Awareness

[sentient]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

Such boundaries and rules are all of the local mind.

Reality and ones awareness are one and the same.

All of it can be found within.

"All of it can be found within".
Sure. The Basic Purity of the Body, The Central Channel ……

When the Inner Fire starts at the Central Channel – it feels as if ones whole energy body, energy field is on fire – something I trust these Tibetan paintings express: http://resources.tsemtulku.com/wp-co...hdlss2008A.jpg

The male/female energies united (red & white) and the ‘wind energies’ rushing into the Central Channel (blackness i.e. ‘death’ experience) prior to the dawning of Clear Light from The Void.


I mentioned earlier the hair width space between terror and ecstasy – and the utter importance of ‘being zero’ – balance.

Too much ecstasy and I suppose one becomes like those disassociated from the body ‘drunk on cosmic' saints, dysfunctional – so the disciples need to feed and clothe them and support them as they can just fall about and break their bones, yet they laugh their heads off – because everywhere you fall is the Omnipresent Divine Mother, or ‘God’ or whatever the saints ‘dream’ is.

Too much terror and one falls into the animal fear/paranoia – type psychosis, which I think is called “Vajra Hell”. A type of Adam and Eve situation trying to cover up one’s nakedness in the face of Eternity, or like the outlaw Ned Kelly in the Australian bush needing to wear an iron helmet and a suit of armour:
https://nnimgt-a.akamaihd.net/transf..._h678_fmax.jpg


Because that inner space - hair width balance simultaneously is being utterly exposed/transparent/naked in and to the vastness of Dharmakaya (?) …….. so …… within or without - same difference.

Within the Dharmakaya – the Sambhogakaya, the luminous energy to witness, the dance of synchronicity and the energy to learn to 'ride'.

And Nirmanakaya – being zero, a hollow bone, empty as a holograph finds functionality in the ‘dream of’ being a shaman or a deity, the dancer to that nondual wisdom & synchronicity.

So - getting into energies is said to be very dangerous and once on the vertical path - Tantric or Shamanic - there is no turning back.

Something like that, "a rough sketch".

*

[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by sentient

"All of it can be found within".
Sure. The Basic Purity of the Body, The Central Channel ……

When the Inner Fire starts at the Central Channel – it feels as if ones whole energy body, energy field is on fire – something I trust these Tibetan paintings express: http://resources.tsemtulku.com/wp-co...hdlss2008A.jpg

The male/female energies united (red & white) and the ‘wind energies’ rushing into the Central Channel (blackness i.e. ‘death’ experience) prior to the dawning of Clear Light from The Void.


I mentioned earlier the hair width space between terror and ecstasy – and the utter importance of ‘being zero’ – balance.

Too much ecstasy and I suppose one becomes like those disassociated from the body ‘drunk on cosmic' saints, dysfunctional – so the disciples need to feed and clothe them and support them as they can just fall about and break their bones, yet they laugh their heads off – because everywhere you fall is the Omnipresent Divine Mother, or ‘God’ or whatever the saints ‘dream’ is.

Too much terror and one falls into the animal fear/paranoia – type psychosis, which I think is called “Vajra Hell”. A type of Adam and Eve situation trying to cover up one’s nakedness in the face of Eternity, or like the outlaw Ned Kelly in the Australian bush needing to wear an iron helmet and a suit of armour:
https://nnimgt-a.akamaihd.net/transf..._h678_fmax.jpg


Because that inner space - hair width balance simultaneously is being utterly exposed/transparent/naked in and to the vastness of Dharmakaya (?) …….. so …… within or without - same difference.

Within the Dharmakaya – the Sambhogakaya, the luminous energy to witness, the dance of synchronicity and the energy to learn to 'ride'.

And Nirmanakaya – being zero, a hollow bone, empty as a holograph finds functionality in the ‘dream of’ being a shaman or a deity, the dancer to that nondual wisdom & synchronicity.

So - getting into energies is said to be very dangerous and once on the vertical path - Tantric or Shamanic - there is no turning back.

Something like that, "a rough sketch".

*

Many traditions talk about having to move beyond the bliss. In Shine with object that is one of the main lessons is to not get caught up in the bliss of the practice.

I agree some people can get caught up in it and stop there.

Terror is the local mind fighting the expansion. Everyone is different, I for one have not been scared in any of my experiences.

The central channel and moving kundalini is different than what I am talking about as everything is within you. One has not truly realized it at this point. It is the difference of being able to feel another person and knowing that person is within you. Touching compared to being.

I would agree that once you begin to feel energy things change. Sometimes in very big ways. Yet, it is all you and nothing to be afraid of.

[running]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

Many traditions talk about having to move beyond the bliss. In Shine with object that is one of the main lessons is to not get caught up in the bliss of the practice.

I agree some people can get caught up in it and stop there.

Terror is the local mind fighting the expansion. Everyone is different, I for one have not been scared in any of my experiences.

The central channel and moving kundalini is different than what I am talking about as everything is within you. One has not truly realized it at this point. It is the difference of being able to feel another person and knowing that person is within you. Touching compared to being.

I would agree that once you begin to feel energy things change. Sometimes in very big ways. Yet, it is all you and nothing to be afraid of.

the most powerful gurus in the world i have personally seen when they go further than they typically go experience great bliss. that is the compass to where one wishes to go. unless one wishes to stop growing. the further one goes the subtler the energies get. the subtler the energies get. that is experinced in the body as bliss.

[running]

Originally Posted by sentient

"All of it can be found within".
Sure. The Basic Purity of the Body, The Central Channel ……

When the Inner Fire starts at the Central Channel – it feels as if ones whole energy body, energy field is on fire – something I trust these Tibetan paintings express: http://resources.tsemtulku.com/wp-co...hdlss2008A.jpg

The male/female energies united (red & white) and the ‘wind energies’ rushing into the Central Channel (blackness i.e. ‘death’ experience) prior to the dawning of Clear Light from The Void.


I mentioned earlier the hair width space between terror and ecstasy – and the utter importance of ‘being zero’ – balance.

Too much ecstasy and I suppose one becomes like those disassociated from the body ‘drunk on cosmic' saints, dysfunctional – so the disciples need to feed and clothe them and support them as they can just fall about and break their bones, yet they laugh their heads off – because everywhere you fall is the Omnipresent Divine Mother, or ‘God’ or whatever the saints ‘dream’ is.

Too much terror and one falls into the animal fear/paranoia – type psychosis, which I think is called “Vajra Hell”. A type of Adam and Eve situation trying to cover up one’s nakedness in the face of Eternity, or like the outlaw Ned Kelly in the Australian bush needing to wear an iron helmet and a suit of armour:
https://nnimgt-a.akamaihd.net/transf..._h678_fmax.jpg


Because that inner space - hair width balance simultaneously is being utterly exposed/transparent/naked in and to the vastness of Dharmakaya (?) …….. so …… within or without - same difference.

Within the Dharmakaya – the Sambhogakaya, the luminous energy to witness, the dance of synchronicity and the energy to learn to 'ride'.

And Nirmanakaya – being zero, a hollow bone, empty as a holograph finds functionality in the ‘dream of’ being a shaman or a deity, the dancer to that nondual wisdom & synchronicity.

So - getting into energies is said to be very dangerous and once on the vertical path - Tantric or Shamanic - there is no turning back.

Something like that, "a rough sketch".

*

the body and mind have to become acclimated to the divine. that takes time. so one can be goofy or whatever. but god is bliss. the subtler it gets the more it gets. but the body and mind get used to it and becomes the new normal. so the goofyness of it goes away. it feels normal like.

[Rain95]

Originally Posted by running

the most powerful gurus in the world i have personally seen when they go further than they typically go experience great bliss. that is the compass to where one wishes to go. unless one wishes to stop growing. the further one goes the subtler the energies get. the subtler the energies get. that is experinced in the body as bliss.

Yes this is the "superhero" view of spirituality and religion. Others would say to "go further" would involve giving to others in new unselfish self-centered ways.

So in the "superhero" view it is all about powers and "spiritual greatness". Some guy sits on a mat and feels "god" itself. (Insert any word in you want for God...bliss, beyond bliss, energy emptiness or whatever) This human goes beyond bliss to who knows where, they experience oneness with everything and on and on. They are like superheros, like superman. They go around saying, "Hey you don't know how advanced I am! I can experience this and that!" I am advanced and special. Higher than you!

The other view of a great spiritual person is one who is selfless, full of love and compassion, always putting others before themselves, they devote their lives to helping and caring for others unselfishly and happily. They have no inner voice saying, me me me. No self concern at all.

A person can take LSD to "go beyond a normal experience," but there is no drug you can take to make you nicer, more full of loving kindness, less self-centered, less egotistical. One has to do that work themselves.

It's interesting but to some "spirituality" is about achieving experiences. To others, spirituality is about becoming better kinder, nicer people. Less judgemental less egotistical etc.

Now if the experiences one seeks makes one more humble, more kind, less egotistical, less self centered, more caring, then one has probably discovered how one can seek experience and become more "spiritual" (less egotistical) at the same time.

The experience one seeks should be to be selfless.

Going beyond bliss won't help a person if they continue to be judgemental and arrogant and self-righteous. They are not going beyond the need to incarnate again and deal with their accumulated karma.

[running]

Originally Posted by running

the most powerful gurus in the world i have personally seen when they go further than they typically go experience great bliss. that is the compass to where one wishes to go. unless one wishes to stop growing. the further one goes the subtler the energies get. the subtler the energies get. that is experinced in the body as bliss.

continued response about bliss, silence and depth

the other day i leaned over to silence during meditation. leaning that way i found more of a loss of identity and a loss of time. nothing wrong with leaning that way. but i dont believe one is greater than another. one is more popular at one place. the other more popular in another place. this is where spirituality is left for politics from what i can gather. one as i believe you know is the opposite side of the same coin.

[running]

going deeper into the silence the contrast from where one is to where one is going can be experinced as a loss of identity and time during the meditation. based on my experience.

the above can also be experinced as an increase in blissfullness.

for me it has to do with where the focus is during the exercise.

[sentient]

Originally Posted by running

the body and mind have to become acclimated to the divine.

Yes, this is it - and here the presence of an Elder or ‘Guru’ comes in handy.
Even the most ‘hair raising’ shifts with the Elder present can be smooth as silk and as natural as if nothing is happening – just the normal order of things.

[running]

Originally Posted by Rain95

Yes this is the "superhero" view of spirituality and religion. Others would say to "go further" would involve giving to others in new unselfish self-centered ways.

So in the "superhero" view it is all about powers and "spiritual greatness". Some guy sits on a mat and feels "god" itself. (Insert any word in you want for God...bliss, beyond bliss, energy emptiness or whatever) This human goes beyond bliss to who knows where, they experience oneness with everything and on and on. They are like superheros, like superman. They go around saying, "Hey you don't know how advanced I am! I can experience this and that!" I am advanced and special. Higher than you!

The other view of a great spiritual person is one who is selfless, full of love and compassion, always putting others before themselves, they devote their lives to helping and caring for others unselfishly and happily. They have no inner voice saying, me me me. No self concern at all.

A person can take LSD to "go beyond a normal experience," but there is no drug you can take to make you nicer, more full of loving kindness, less self-centered, less egotistical. One has to do that work themselves.

It's interesting but to some "spirituality" is about achieving experiences. To others, spirituality is about becoming better kinder, nicer people. Less judgemental less egotistical etc.

Now if the experiences one seeks makes one more humble, more kind, less egotistical, less self centered, more caring, then one has probably discovered how one can seek experience and become more "spiritual" (less egotistical) at the same time.

The experience one seeks should be to be selfless.

Going beyond bliss won't help a person if they continue to be judgemental and arrogant and self-righteous. They are not going beyond the need to incarnate again and deal with their accumulated karma.

everything has to do with what ones goal is.

if gurus didnt share and offer what they know tbey can't help anybody. im glad they speak and share their experince.

in all honesty even if it was about becoming mother teresa or what have you. sure is a lot easier once you become your own source of joy and contentment.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by running

everything has to do with what ones goal is.

if gurus didnt share and offer what they know tbey can't help anybody. im glad they speak and share their experince.

in all honesty even if it was about becoming mother teresa or what have you. sure is a lot easier once you become your own source of joy and contentment.

I think the spiritual teachers mostly talk about 'dhamma', or 'the way nature is', and knowing nature through direct realisation. The Buddhist approach is fundamentally to understand how things are, not as knowledge, but as wisdom, and 'the truth will set you free', as John puts it.