The concept of "trust"

What is the nature of

I didn't see this thread before today - I think you posted it the day before our computer went on strike! :roll: It's an interesting topic!

[quote=Space_Man]So, what does it mean to

Kind-of a neat little essay about the subject: http://dorissimo.net/stgermain/trust.html

Also

Complete trust cannot be achieved on it's own. Complete trust will not stand alone without other feelings being involved. Trust is only a word with no meaning until it is supported by truth.

I am going to call this the TRUST/TRUTH/CHAIN.

Trust cannot become an entity unto it's own without truth being part of trust. For any relationship to be trustful, truth must be part of it. Part truth will only create part trust.

That struck me from the first link!

I have no intention of hijacking this thread, and turning it into "Poppies' chance to moan about trust issues"... but I would like to be honest and upfront about my issues with trust, as I suspect that any responses I make here, will be influenced by the issues that I'm confronting/dealing with....

My husband has had 2 affairs in the last 10 years or so. He knew I was suspicious in the first one, but he denied that he was having an affair - I didn't 'push' it... The second one, I allowed to continue for over a year before I finally confronted him (about 2 months ago). He insisted the 'affairs' (both with the same woman) were 'inappropriately handled' 'friendships'.... he knew I didn't believe him, but agreed not to see the woman anymore.... Building up trust on such a shaky foundation didn't even get off 'first-base'.... and after a long conversation last week, he finally admitted what had been going on.

So... we are now 'back at square one'... Having said that, whilst getting to grips with the truth is very painful, and much harder than I'd expected, having been so suspicious for so long... I feel that we are finally standing on a 'firm foundation'... the truth...

Whilst the truth hurts, I know that I am now free from the doubts, fears, lies, suspicions of the past...

I don't mean that I now believe and trust him implicitly.... and I do not mean that I have been given every ounce of truth about the past.... what I mean is that, having been given the truth (at least a large part of it), I am now free from the ongoing damage and hurt that those unconfirmed suspicions/fears etc were causing....

I know I was right... I no longer need to doubt my memory/mind/sanity/character... And whilst I feel like I've just crawled, battered, out of a battlefield... I know I've come out 'free' and that matters a great deal!

And we can now get on with the task of re-building (or attempting to...) TRUST!

I hope it was okay to post this here... it feels good to have written it down anyway... but it also means I don't have to tiptoe round the subject in future posts....

For me, one of the most frustrating things in the recent hacking problem was the loss of the excellent discussion between Aly and Space_Man on this thread. I had a very small amount of it saved, because I had copied it as I was formulating a response. I am using it in this post... Aly... if you have any of the rest of it stored away somewhere, I'll edit this post to accommodate it!!!

[quote="Space_Man"]

Originally Posted by DirtyMagicalAly

I think that you can never be free without the truth, for sure. But Im not sure that I agree that the truth sets you free. I think, when you know the truth thats when you become able to be free. And yet, you still have to make that choice....

Aly, I love this; what thoughtful insight you possess. What you are saying here makes perfect sense: in the end, it is still dependant on the choice to set oneself free

You may be deceived if you trust too much,...but you will live in torment if you don't trust enough.

-Frank Crane-

Spacey gave me this quote... it exactly sums up my dilemma at the moment... I wanted to add it to the thread here, and include it in the discussion.

Originally Posted by Poppies

I think that the truth does "set you free", in that it's like someone coming along and unlocking your prison door and leaving the door open for you.... but you have to believe that you're free to take advantage of that freedom.

I think that it's perfectly possible to sit in an open, unlocked, unguarded prison cell, whilst believing that you're still a prisoner..... Until you believe you're free, and until you choose to accept that freedom.... that freedom is nothing short of useless!

Indeed, you have to believe you're free before you can use that freedom. However, you also have to make the choice to use it. The truth allows you to make that choice, but some people prefer to remain "prisoner", remain in that room, although the door is unlocked and unguarded, because how safe a prison can be...and truth, as wonderful and amazing as it is....is downright scary at times....
As Im sure you're aware, it forces you to face unpleasant things that you may not want to, sometimes force you to make choices which you're unsure about. And so, even when you know the truth, and when you believe you're free, you can still choose not to use that freedom, no?

[Yes, the lack of the discussion Spacey and I were having has frustrated me too, seen as I made my points when I was very tired and wanted to go back and embellish upon them, but, oh well, thats life =)]

To quote Saint & Greavsie:

"It's a funny old game, and it's one of two halves."

I think they were actually talking about football, but the same could apply to trust as well. Those who are closest to us, who we trust the most, have the greatest capacity to cause us harm, but they also have the greatest capacity to enrich our lives through loving relationships as well - and we have the greatest capacity to do similar for them.

Ultimately if we have full trust in the Creator and Controller behind this existence, then no-matter what happens we will always have shelter. I think it's important to trust people without expecting 'too much' of them, but with Krishna (God) it's different, because He is always beyond our expectations and it's more down to our level of openess and surrender to Him as to how much we will be able to perceive it.

Just some thoughts ....

Om Tat Sat,

Das

I spent a long time disputing the nature and existence of God. I still believed in something but i did not submit myself to it, i didn't trust it and a lot of the time i fought against it due to feelings of shame and guilt that a normal Catholic upbringing gives you.

I have just realised that to surrender takes no effort except the effort it takes to make no effort (to concentrate on surrendering) if that makes sense. I have found that by saying what i really think in a calm and friendly way rather than fudging my words in an attempt to save someone from embarrassment, or by just accepting that I am what i am without making any bones about it people respond much better to me. I have found that if I concentrate on placing my full trust in God and just accept whatever happens - nothing bad happens, i have noticed that if i stop concentrating on placing my full trust in God things start to get a bit more difficult, but by concentrating on trusting God again things start to get better very quickly.

If i just open myself up to it and trust it, it reveals itself to me more and more and I feel more and more confident in it. I have tried trusting myself before but I could not get past my self doubt. What i am experiencing now is on a totally different level, it is only working because i am putting total trust in God, the less i struggle the easier it is for the universe to help me.

Ask with a pure heart and you shall be given, knock and the door will be opened. There is nothing to be afraid of except God's rejection and God never rejects Love and he loves to be trusted and surrendered to - trust.