State of being

[anthony c]

Hi all

I read allot lately about people saying about the state of being, that the outer world, outside of you is a reflection of the inside state of yourself. Also that this physical life is actually a hologram and we should try to look past the smoke and mirrors, so to speak. Well it makes allot of sense but the hologram thing, i don't get. Is the hologram meaning it's our beliefs we have to look past.

Could someone explain how this concept works?

Read that time and memory is an illusion, could someone explain how time and memory is an illusion?

Thank you

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by anthony c

Hi all

I read allot lately about people saying about the state of being, that the outer world, outside of you is a reflection of the inside state of yourself. Also that this physical life is actually a hologram and we should try to look past the smoke and mirrors, so to speak. Well it makes allot of sense but the hologram thing, i don't get. Is the hologram meaning it's our beliefs we have to look past.

Could someone explain how this concept works?

Read that time and memory is an illusion, could someone explain how time and memory is an illusion?

Thank you

Hi there. Have you ever watched The Matrix and managed to understand it? It's sort of like that.

Would steak have a taste if it weren't for us being able to taste it? Would red still be a colour if we all were not able to see it?

What the outer world is, is over 7.5 billion 'little worlds' because even though the human race are 'social creatures', each man is an island unto himself when it comes down to life experiences, personal truths and beliefs.

So, everybody creates their own 'realities' because what's good for the goose isn't always going to be good for the gander.

Thoughts and opinions are just like a-holes, everybody has one and they're usually full of....well, the swear filter won't let me complete that one...but for every opinion out there, there's always going to be a contrary one.

"So, you think I am crazy, do you? thanks for that but...next please!"
One becomes totally desensitised to criticism...especially when this criticism lacks sound logic.

"So you think I am a fake/fraud do you? Yes...you go ahead and think that. I cannot stop you...be my guest...." Totally desensitised so that nothing phases me anymore.

This is why it is said the whole world is Maya/Illusion because when we are speaking in the language of experience which has no words....which is totally beyond words....everything else basically is. Everything else pales and fades into oblivion and non-existence.

I hope this explains the whole concept.

[vespa68]

Originally Posted by anthony c

Hi all

I read allot lately about people saying about the state of being, that the outer world, outside of you is a reflection of the inside state of yourself. Also that this physical life is actually a hologram and we should try to look past the smoke and mirrors, so to speak. Well it makes allot of sense but the hologram thing, i don't get. Is the hologram meaning it's our beliefs we have to look past.

Could someone explain how this concept works?

Read that time and memory is an illusion, could someone explain how time and memory is an illusion?

Thank you

You do look at your 3d world according to who you think you are (more or less of programming). Some people are more affected by their conditioning than others. So this means you see people and how the world works accordingly. There is however a higher truth of how things work and when you have spiritual growth and get closer to your true self with less programming (ego), you start to see your views of the world change which is more enlightening.

I did read a great book called the "holographic universe" that I can't find but it explains a lot. This is would be related to what I said above. A different view of the same thing of how things in the universe interrelate.

[vespa68]

Furthermore, time is expandable when you leave the 3d illusion . Whereas here it is more condensed because of density. In terms of memory it stays but you focus on what you want to remember. So both in fact stay but you turn them around past 3d.

Originally Posted by anthony c

Hi all

I read allot lately about people saying about the state of being, that the outer world, outside of you is a reflection of the inside state of yourself. Also that this physical life is actually a hologram and we should try to look past the smoke and mirrors, so to speak. Well it makes allot of sense but the hologram thing, i don't get. Is the hologram meaning it's our beliefs we have to look past.

Could someone explain how this concept works?

Read that time and memory is an illusion, could someone explain how time and memory is an illusion?

Thank you

Paul Foster Case (Kabbalist) claimed:

"Most people never really see. They look at things but what they think they
see is modified by by what they think they know."
What's there is filtered through our perceptive processes added to what we
hear, smell etc at the same time, all nicely integrated.

I don't think the hologram is necessarily a good analogy.
A hologram is a photograph of a light field rather than an actual image. It's done by
interfering with light patterns reflected from an image rather than
photographing the image itself (usually with a second, synchronised light
source). Under the right conditions, what you see is a re-creation of that light field.
Not the image itself.
It looks very 3D because the depth pattern is preserved - but the
ability to see "behind" foreground representations is limited by viewing angle.

An ordinary photo, even in 3D can only take in what the lenses see of the
light reflected by the "scene". Likewise, the eyes.

In imaging, a hologram is more illusory if you're speaking of perceiving the
scene in front of you.

No matter what, what you see is filtered through our perceptive processes
turning it into unique experiences. If you stay looking at it for a day it
endures - the lighting might change, time of day; if an outdoor scene, people
may move in or out etc but the basic scene remains. A street you look down
today will probably look very nearly the same tomorrow. Might not - an
earthquake might wreck it. never mind. We call it reality because it endures
- unlikes dreams which are ephemeral.

= =
As for memory, what the term signifies is no illusion. We remember things.
That's as real as we are. Memories may get distorted over time; we may
never remember every microscopic detail - we may not even see every
microscopic detail but the essence stays for a time varying according to many
factors.

Psychobiology recognises various levels – short-term, long-term etc.

It allows us to construct a past. Call that an illusion if you like but again, it's there.
It's as there as we are here.
We're the product of experiential events through time. Some linger in our
surface "memory" some get consolidated into our archival memory - what
some people here call the subconscious.

As for "time" - well you can call anything an illusion. You might as well call music or food or dance
an illusion if you want to but the simple fact we measure our lives by these things so unless
you call "living" an illusion, they're there and we rely on them.

Sorry I've waffled on but it is a big question. It's been raised
in evening gatherings (usually in the pub or cafe)
and lasts a few rounds at least!

,,,

Originally Posted by The Necromancer

Hi there. Have you ever watched The Matrix and managed to understand it? It's sort of like that.

Another good one is eXistenZ, if you get a chance to watch it.

You know, that got me thinking that movies are a fine illustration of actual illusion - not just the content but that they rely on persistence of vision to give us the feel of a smooth scene unrolling before us. Some very old films projected at 16 frames per second flicker and remind us the thing is illusory.

This is why it is said the whole world is Maya/Illusion because when we are speaking in the language of experience which has no words....which is totally beyond words....everything else basically is. Everything else pales and fades into oblivion and non-existence.

The problem there is that hordes of people recognise phenomena regardless of how they experience them. I'm sitting on a chair. You'd recognise it as a chair even though your experiences of chairs is different. It's chairness would depend on how we've experienced the essence of chairs. But it is a chair. If we broke it down into its component atoms the count would probably be the same, the number of electrical charges in their various positions would be the same if we took a snapshot at the same instant - discrepancies might be down to the meters we measure with, so unless we regard the whole of life as illusion then a phenomenon is there for many to experience.

We have words to signify phenomena so we collectively know what each other are talking about - they convey information - assuming we understand the language setting. Noumena / experiences are a different matter. As you say you can describe the phenomena you experience all you like but you can't describe your experience of them except in the grossest of terms.
So it does start to look as if the word "illusion" is dodgy - very dodgy, an illusion in itself. If everything is an illusion either we're all solopsists after all (a perfectly valid viewpoint - we have no proof we aren't) or we just get on with managing this illusory life.

...

[BlueSky]

It's not that time and space or the past are an illusion, it's that they are relative to the observer. Everything is relative and interrelated and interdependent so although we are islands or centers of if own relative universe, we are relative to everything else.
Your perspective, your memories are unique as is your path in life.

[shivatar]

Originally Posted by The Necromancer

Hi there. Have you ever watched The Matrix and managed to understand it? It's sort of like that.

Would steak have a taste if it weren't for us being able to taste it? Would red still be a colour if we all were not able to see it?

What the outer world is, is over 7.5 billion 'little worlds' because even though the human race are 'social creatures', each man is an island unto himself when it comes down to life experiences, personal truths and beliefs.

So, everybody creates their own 'realities' because what's good for the goose isn't always going to be good for the gander.

Thoughts and opinions are just like a-holes, everybody has one and they're usually full of....well, the swear filter won't let me complete that one...but for every opinion out there, there's always going to be a contrary one.

"So, you think I am crazy, do you? thanks for that but...next please!"
One becomes totally desensitised to criticism...especially when this criticism lacks sound logic.

"So you think I am a fake/fraud do you? Yes...you go ahead and think that. I cannot stop you...be my guest...." Totally desensitised so that nothing phases me anymore.

This is why it is said the whole world is Maya/Illusion because when we are speaking in the language of experience which has no words....which is totally beyond words....everything else basically is. Everything else pales and fades into oblivion and non-existence.

I hope this explains the whole concept.

Being emotionally numb and de-sesetzed is not something to be proud of my friend. You have given up on letting others shape you, and that is something that simply doesn't make sense unless a person has decided to live in isolation apart from society.

Even if you have chosen isolation, you are constantly reaching out for friendship on this forum (from what Ive seen of you), therefore even if you consciously reject it, your actions still say you want company.

Basically, you don't like the feeling of criticism or shame or guilt, so you have fooled yourself into thinking other peoples opinions dont matter. But look at your actions, your actions speak louder than your words.



Maybe humans are like words.

Words are short summaries of things, used to categorize an otherwise un-knowable world.

if God is un-knowable as a whole, then the best thing to do is categorize and seek to understand how the categories become the whole.

I know who I am. I know my word.
I'm coming to understand that I cannot truly know the "word" of another, since it's constantly changing.

However I can still observe it, be in awe of it. In fact observing it is all I can do, as it's knowing is beyond the minds capability.
I must simply say "thats who that person is. how do i know? because look at what they've done, look at what they do, look at what they want to do."
A person constantly defines their part in the cosmos, their "word", by their thoughts and actions as a whole, not just the ones they are conscious of.

not being able to know it is no longer important to me, my goal is no longer to understand the universe. Simply to be a happy part of it.

So my word has changed, from hurt, to happy. If you look at my old pictures, there are no smiles. Now I am almost always trying to smile.

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by shivatar

Being emotionally numb and de-sesetzed is not something to be proud of my friend. You have given up on letting others shape you, and that is something that simply doesn't make sense unless a person has decided to live in isolation apart from society.

Even if you have chosen isolation, you are constantly reaching out for friendship on this forum (from what Ive seen of you), therefore even if you consciously reject it, your actions still say you want company.

Basically, you don't like the feeling of criticism or shame or guilt, so you have fooled yourself into thinking other peoples opinions dont matter. But look at your actions, your actions speak louder than your words.



Maybe humans are like words.

Words are short summaries of things, used to categorize an otherwise un-knowable world.

if God is un-knowable as a whole, then the best thing to do is categorize and seek to understand how the categories become the whole.

I know who I am. I know my word.
I'm coming to understand that I cannot truly know the "word" of another, since it's constantly changing.

However I can still observe it, be in awe of it. In fact observing it is all I can do, as it's knowing is beyond the minds capability.
I must simply say "thats who that person is. how do i know? because look at what they've done, look at what they do, look at what they want to do."
A person constantly defines their part in the cosmos, their "word", by their thoughts and actions as a whole, not just the ones they are conscious of.

not being able to know it is no longer important to me, my goal is no longer to understand the universe. Simply to be a happy part of it.

So my word has changed, from hurt, to happy. If you look at my old pictures, there are no smiles. Now I am almost always trying to smile.

How's it all working out for me though? it's working out fine thank you.

This is a perfect example of what I am talking about.

Your experience of reality is very different and so, my concepts seem alien to you, but one can still live in the 'real world' and not be a part of the 'real world' which is all an illusion anyway.

Many people won't see it as an illusion either and that only goes to prove that it is.

Buddha said 'with our thoughts, we make the world' and everybody thinks differently and therefore, everybody's own little 'version of reality' is different.

According to some other people, I 'live in my own private universe' but then again, everybody else does too....only there's a stigma involved when it comes to admitting it because it is seen as being 'selfish' or 'self-serving' or something like that.

I have stopped letting people shape me, yes and that is something I am very proud of...and that's all that matters to me!

My life and the way I live it is all that matters to me!

What people do/say has no bearing on the way I choose to live my life because I figured out ages ago that if I listened to every piece of 'good advice' out there, I'd go insane.

It's more than being 'emotionally numb' and desensitisd. It just doesn't affect me or has no bearing/relevance to my life anymore....none whatsoever.

[Shivani Devi]

You see, the whole problem stems from a society which tells you to 'be yourself' and 'express yourself' and 'be creative' and 'don't hide yourself' and 'be unique'.

Now what happens when other people, many other people do not like the 'you' who you are? You don't change for them, you change for yourself....IF you aren't happy being who you are.

If you changed it to suit everybody else, you wouldn't be you anymore would you? you would either become them or turn yourself into a 'stylised version' of 'you' to suit 'everybody else' and that's being totally dishonest with yourself.

I could not live with the whole hypocrisy of it - being 'me' but ONLY the way society wants me to be, which wasn't me...wasn't me whatsoever.

So, I stayed true to myself....100% totally true to myself, not true to anybody or anything else out there.

....and that's how I wound up being like this.