Is suffering real ? Is love, joy real?

[Ewwerrin]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

I have heard for a long time ''desire is the root of all suffering''....

It's a quote from Tao Te Ching. Desire is the root of all suffering or something.

I remember an old friend, who's been living under that assumption as a Daoist, for most of his late life. He was completely dumbfounded when I explained to him that it is originally suppose to be the word "Yearning" is the root of all suffering. Not "desire".
Focusing on the lack of ones desire = yearning.

And some other things happened after that, that was pretty extreme, as a result of him realizing this.

Many people live such distorted realities, because they would like to hold on to translations of translations of translations, and base their entire life upon them.

Ah well, atleast the truth is simple enough to understand/experience for most people.

[J_A_S_G]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

Unfulfilled desire can cause suffering - with disappointment, frustration, discouragement, sadness...whatever.

If there is no desire there can be no unfulfilled desire and if there is desire it's unfulfilled until it is, if ever, fulfilled.

Let's substitute unsatisfactory for suffering. Suffering is too loaded and specific. From The Four Noble Truths:

1. All existence is dukkha. The word dukkha has been variously translated as ‘suffering’, ‘anguish’, ‘pain’, or ‘unsatisfactoriness’. The Buddha’s insight was that our lives are a struggle, and we do not find ultimate happiness or satisfaction in anything we experience. This is the problem of existence.

2. The cause of dukkha is craving. The natural human tendency is to blame our difficulties on things outside ourselves. But the Buddha says that their actual root is to be found in the mind itself. In particular our tendency to grasp at things (or alternatively to push them away) places us fundamentally at odds with the way life really is.

3. The cessation of dukkha comes with the cessation of craving. As we are the ultimate cause of our difficulties, we are also the solution. We cannot change the things that happen to us, but we can change our responses.

[J_A_S_G]

Originally Posted by Ewwerrin

He was completely dumbfounded when I explained to him that it is originally suppose to be the word "Yearning" is the root of all suffering. Not "desire".

Desire and yearning are synonyms. It's stated as craving in the Four Noble Truths which is also a synonym of desire albeit perhaps an intense desire but desire nonetheless.

[Goldcup7]

I'd go further and say that the mistaken identity is the root of suffering. The sense and belief of being a separate self leads to all sorts of problems, including desire, hate, loneliness, fear etc. Imo it is when our true nature of unbounded completeness is overlooked that suffering is inevitable.

From there we can go even further and say that there isn't a separate self, so suffering isn't real.

[J_A_S_G]

Originally Posted by Goldcup7

I'd go further and say that the mistaken identity is the root of suffering. The sense and belief of being a separate self leads to all sorts of problems, including desire, hate, loneliness, fear etc.

From the Vedantic perspective, yes and yes.

When we identify with the mind-body complex then there are things that aren't ours and some of them we would like to posses and some we would like to avoid. If on the other hand we identify with Consciousness there is no second thing apart from Consciousness, therefore there is nothing apart from us to grasp for or push away.

[Miss Hepburn]

Originally Posted by J_A_S_G

If there is no desire there can be no unfulfilled desire and if there is desire it's unfulfilled until it is, if ever, fulfilled.

Since it is hard to not have desire here on earth, I believe
one should learn how this place works so they CAN manifest their desires.
Then no suffering ...or very little.
So far, that has been working well for me.

[Ewwerrin]

Originally Posted by J_A_S_G

Desire and yearning ...
... desire nonetheless.

Ahahaha I didn't even know you are JustASimpleGuy! AhahahHa!
I'm a bit slow, but welcome back.

I was even almost gonna say, I knew a guy who said what you said. I think it was justasimpleguy. It's a great way to know the self. hehehehehe.

To reply tho, wanting something that one doesnt have... That's yearning. Yeah.
To want something that one does have... That can be called appreciation, right?

For example, I don't want attachments.
Attachments are the absence of my desire. I don't feel good giving attachments my awareness, and thereby creating the reality of it.
Non-attachment is the presence of my desire. I feel good giving non-attachment my awareness and thereby create the reality of it.

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

Since it is hard to not have desire here on earth, I believe
one should learn how this place works so they CAN manifest their desires.
Then no suffering ...or very little.
So far, that has been working well for me.

Everyone should be manifesting their desires, but there is a lack of education or knowledge for everyone to do so. This is the real problem, not desire or lack. Solve this problem, and there will be no unfullfilled desires.

Besides, what the self desires, god or souce desires.

[Miss Hepburn]

Originally Posted by MikeS80

Everyone should be manifesting their desires, but there is a lack of education or
knowledge for everyone to do so. This is the real problem, not desire or lack.
Solve this problem, and there will be no unfullfilled desires. ..

That's what I'm saying, yes!

[J_A_S_G]

Originally Posted by Ewwerrin

I was even almost gonna say, I knew a guy who said what you said. I think it was justasimpleguy.

If nothing else I'm consistent. LOL!