What IS Love?

[Silver]

Thank ya, darlin. These folks are what I call backwoods baboons...if they know you're bothered by their noise, they'll make even more, y'know. From now on, I keep it to myself...I told my neighbor Eddie about it recently, so I can't even open my mouth about it, jeesh. (I try to think good thoughts about them, though. )

[Gem]

Originally Posted by Humm

Is your mind dissolved in your heart?

Ummm, it's a good question. It's more like a disolving process... but I should elaborate because it isn't necessary to be entirely disolved to know self. The state of conscious is as it is now, including the conditioning reactivity beliefs falsity the body and all human issues. 'You' are not other than that state of consciousness right now... 'you' are not way off in the future waiting for yourself to arive. Now 'you' are here.

The disolving is independant of self realisation, and spiritual developement is secondary, not primary.

So the process of disolving is the 'healing process', meaning the removal of falsity reactivity emotional blocks etc, but contentment is here as I am, and not in being entirely disolved. Disolving is the journey and 'you' are on it.

(this being subject to peer review)

Originally Posted by Silvergirl

Thank ya, darlin. These folks are what I call backwoods baboons...if they know you're bothered by their noise, they'll make even more, y'know. From now on, I keep it to myself...I told my neighbor Eddie about it recently, so I can't even open my mouth about it, jeesh. (I try to think good thoughts about them, though. )

Thinking good thoughts is a trial for us all.

Hopefully you'll soon be back to your usual on-top-of-it-all form!

Originally Posted by Gem

Ummm, it's a good question. It's more like a disolving process... but I should elaborate because it isn't necessary to be entirely disolved to know self. The state of conscious is as it is now, including the conditioning reactivity beliefs falsity the body and all human issues. 'You' are not other than that state of consciousness right now... 'you' are not way off in the future waiting for yourself to arive. Now 'you' are here.

That, my friend, is a respectable POV, IMO.

I wonder, though, if perhaps Ramana's quote isn't saying, rather than 'know thyself' through the mind - implied in 'dissolving mind' - to 'know thyself through the heart', as implied by dissolving mind in the heart.

One is still "not other than that state of consciousness right now" - but becomes the consciousness of the heart, having dissolved mind in it.

Greetings..

What I can see, is that some people will rationalize their attachment to a word, rather than suspend (temporarily set aside) the attachment, and then they demonize the intentions, and even the character, of the person asking for a discussion free of the preferences and prejudices inherent to the ‘word’. I have asked repeatedly, for a measure of cooperation in finding the hows, and whys of the use the word ‘Love’, and even ‘if’ the word IS fundamental, the hows and whys of its application are not.. as it can be seen, there is intense resistance to suspending preferences for a certain word, and yet.. most of the same that resist and insist will readily agree that ‘the menu is not the meal’, but.. in this special instance, about this special ‘word’ on the menu, there is no option to for discussing experiences without relying on the special word.

What can be observed, is that when the mind is still it forms no words or descriptions, it doesn’t compare what is happening with what it thinks it believes.. the mind is still and silent, and Life is happening without the mind’s manipulations, Life and experience are being felt and sensed, not thought and described. Words are abstractions, degrees of separation from the truth of the experience, and attachments to words are greater degrees of separation. Allowing for the scope and depth of many words to reveal the nuances of experience, are degrees of freedom for expansion and feeling, where insistence that one word or few words are all that are approved for the consensus to agree, that is confining, stagnant. Rather than confining the descriptions of deeply resonant experiences to a very limited word-set, why the resistance to openly exploring all of language as a way of expanding the understanding of the experience?

When all else falls away, what remains is the stillness and silence, even in the midst of chaos and frenzy.. return to the stillness, and clarity reveals what is.. resist or insist that this is this or that is that, and you are already apart from what is happening.. attached to the structure of words and meanings, of expectations and disappointments.. yes, you will huddle together, protecting your illusions of safety.. yes, it would easy, even simple to agree and be invited in and blessed for my wisdom and the great fortune of my enlightenment, but.. there is great comfort and contentment in the silence and stillness of watching with unconditioned curiosity.. because sooner or later, someone will need to be more right than another.. but, for now, most of you are content being more right than me and a couple of others..

There is no right or wrong in stillness, just the invitation to join, to see for yourself.. do I think that those that believe that ‘Love is all there is’ are wrong, absolutely not.. I don’t know if they are or not, but I am cautious of those that seem to know that they are right.. they are closed to new information and experiences, secure in their knowing.. sure, I hold some understandings to be true and self-evident, until the contrary be revealed more consistent with what ‘is’.. I am always willing to revise my understandings based on more competent or more consistently applicable evidence.. and, it’s not a matter of right or wrong, better or worse.. it is the willingness to look and see.

Be well..

[Gem]

Originally Posted by Humm

That, my friend, is a respectable POV, IMO.

I wonder, though, if perhaps Ramana's quote isn't saying, rather than 'know thyself' through the mind - implied in 'dissolving mind' - to 'know thyself through the heart', as implied by dissolving mind in the heart.

One is still "not other than that state of consciousness right now" - but becomes the consciousness of the heart, having dissolved mind in it.

'It's quite interesting to note that ancient cultures considered the individual to reside in the heart, and it is rather recently that humans placed the individual in the head, for thancients considered the individual a 'feeler', while more recently the individual was considered a 'thinker'.

Ramanas primary teaching was rest your attention on the I and go straight to the source. Other techniques will take you to the long way round and lead you back to this, so why your waste time?

On the last one about through the mind to become consciousness of the heart... it is 'through'. One intends to bring the purity and holiness of his being through every nuance of the mind and express it as phyisical activity, however it is not nicity of sentiment, for it also means a lion tears out the throat of a deer.

[sound]

Originally Posted by Humm

Have you spoken to Tzu about the way he has followed Xan around for years?

Why not, I wonder...

Xan and Tzu have had some incredibly interesting tug-o-wars, which have been, and could continue to be incredibly 'revealing' and indeed 'enlightening' for both themselves, and those in the front row seats ... both have an amazing depth of experience, understanding and insight ... and yes, Xan holds her own beautifully, and in a sense, what SerpentQueen says has lots of merit, it is almost like a dance ... so, for 'loves' sake, give Xan a little more credit Humm ... in your attempts to insult Tzu you are also insulting Xan ... can you not see that?

Originally Posted by sound

Xan and Tzu have had some incredibly interesting tug-o-wars, which have been, and could continue to be incredibly 'revealing' and indeed 'enlightening' for both themselves, and those in the front row seats ... both have an amazing depth of experience, understanding and insight ... and yes, Xan holds her own beautifully, and in a sense, what SerpentQueen says has lots of merit, it is almost like a dance ... so, for 'loves' sake, give Xan a little more credit Humm ... in your attempts to insult Tzu you are also insulting Xan ... can you not see that?

As Xan says "He shoots and I duck".

I'll let her speak for herself.

[sound]

Originally Posted by Humm

I'll let her speak for herself.

What a wonderful resolution :)

Originally Posted by Gem

'It's quite interesting to note that ancient cultures considered the individual to reside in the heart, and it is rather recently that humans placed the individual in the head, for thancients considered the individual a 'feeler', while more recently the individual was considered a 'thinker'.

Ramanas primary teaching was rest your attention on the I and go straight to the source. Other techniques will take you to the long way round and lead you back to this, so why your waste time?

On the last one about through the mind to become consciousness of the heart... it is 'through'. One intends to bring the purity and holiness of his being through every nuance of the mind and express it as phyisical activity, however it is not nicity of sentiment, for it also means a lion tears out the throat of a deer.

Originally Posted by Gem

Ramana continually said 'allow the mind to disolve in the heart' because he did not want to Distract people into craving yet another invoked object.

You mean like sentiment, mind, source, or a conceptualization of 'being'?