Bad mediums & spiritualist churches

Originally Posted by Light Earth

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My main issue is that they seem to be very sad places and that people in the congregation are in danger of going to the church far too often desperate to hear from their loved ones. This promise of contact really stops people from moving on and can extend grief far beyond what is helpful to both the person left on earth and the spirit, who is trying to move on and best not bound by their relatives' grief.
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I can see that happening also, but mostly I've seen it develop community in exactly the same way that other churches do. My main gripes are that I think it's an artificial place to develop as a medium. Also, like all churches, it easily degenerates into a "cult of the personality" whereby the currently favoured medium/s become the centre of the conversation, and those who want to share spirituality are lost in the crowd attaching itself to the mediums.

Originally Posted by Light Earth

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I have also seen some great mediums and had a good laugh, cry and heart warm, from a church is Australia specifically. So, I guess there's nothing wrong with the church as a concept, it's really down to the people who run them now... ....

Which church? I'm in Australia but may be in a different state.

Originally Posted by Light Earth

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If I could change spiritualist churches for the better I'd:

[1] - Get rid of the hymns and replace with uplifting meditation music
[2] - Remove all open mediumship circles - these should be invitation only
[3] - Encourage psychic development but not mediumship to the extent it is currently (and remove the competition that seems to exist)
[4] - Have an uplifting talk / workshop / lecture each week to actually teach the way of spirit, from someone who truly works with spirit
[5] - Ensure the energy is uplifting, positive and motivating at all times
[6] - Insist that all mediums on stdetailed evidential, detailed and precise with their readings, or they don't appear

Just a few of my thoughts, really I guess I'm just looking for the positive, celebratory, uplifting, straight talking, no nonsense approach that I know our spirit friends appreciate.

I've added numbers in parentheses to better reply as I'd like:

[1] I actually find hymns to be uplifting, not because I am religious, but because I find that hymns in general resonate with centuries of hearts looking to God (or the equivalent). For example, Ave Maria is to me one of the most inspiring of songs and it's really a hymn. The chants of the monks, the invocations of tribal indians and Buddhists all resonate beatifully to me. When I hear at a simple church service, usually Christian, "Abide With Me" I always sing along with my heart in the singing. As well, what is inspiriing music otherwise might be so for one or another, but not necessarily for everyone. Hymns have history that resonates with looking upward.

[2] Absolutely! All open circles should be closed down. Then again there should be, as said earlier, a charter of sorts to better help those who would attend a circle, to know what to look for in a circle.

[3] For me, what is most important before development of any kind of psychicism or mediumship is the helping of sitters to raise their level of vibration, how to give way to Love. If they aren't in the circle for that reason, then they shouldn't be there.

[4] Totally agree.

[5] Uplifting yes, but I'd rather see that come from real empathy that comes from a true connection with the sitter's loved ones/helping spirits. I've seen hollow mediumship giving short shrift to to the sitter by simply saying what the medium thinks will make the sitter feel better (I know that's not what you are referring to, but I add it as an aside because I think that it also happens)

[6] Also agree, with an emphasis on NOT using feedback from the sitter to fill in the dots, but to ask for more needed explanation from spirit. And to say, as Laura has said, "Sorry, but it's not coming"

emalie

Originally Posted by Donna Mai

I don't know if this has been discussed before, but I'm just going to come right out and say it: I really loathe these cold-reading mediums (or “mediums”) who aren't channelling anything but their own egos – or at best, w$nking a weak link that they take a hint from and make up the rest.

(I apologise in advance for the length of this post. I'll give it a few headlines to break it up)

Spiritualist church
My partner and I went to a a number of spiritualist churches earlier this year, out of interest and curiousity. I was open-minded, ready to be wowed, etc. The first one we went to there were maybe a dozen people present, so the chance of actually getting a reading was pretty good. She did the rounds and came to pretty much everyone. It was all grandparents for an hour. Parents to one lady who was clearly in her 80s, so it was fairly safe to presume her parents were in spirit. The medium said, "I love grandparents, they're so cosy."

Indeed. Also, fairly unimpressive. To me it just seemed like she got something of a link, but didn’t work it. She managed to get maybe one or two things for each person, although she was hovering over them for about 5 minutes or more. And it was things that was so general that everything that was said could have easily meant something to both me and my partner. I call that cold reading. A cosy, nice, warm, chatty grandmother and a quiet, nodding grandfather who let her do the talking. Who can't relate to that, generally?

So, then she came to me. I tried to be as forthcoming and open as I could, although I was the 2nd to last reading of the night.
"There's a lady here, who you were very close to on the earth plane."
Oh yes, this was clearly the indication of another grandmother figure.
I said "OK".
"You used to be very close to her, and sit next to her on a stool as she was knitting, and you would have good conversations."
Again, I said "OK…" probably sounding a little less convinced.
"She's a lovely, warm character."
Again: "OK…"
She stopped and went, "Can you take any of this?"
I thought of being polite, but ended up saying, "Not really sure…"
She rounded off by saying I was overdue for a dental appointment, that the lady was sending her love and off she went to the last reading of the day, on the other side of the room, as far away from me as possible.

The crowd broke up pretty quickly after the last reading. The medium was out the door even quicker. I don’t think anyone was particularly convinced.

(Nevermind the circle at another spiritualist church that we attempted. Oh my God, it was like a scene out of a comedy book! But that's for another post...!)

Anyway, this wasn't the first time I've encountered a cr$p medium...

"Forget about him and move on"
Another example is a medium visited on a tour, and it was pretty much the same scenario as the one above. Few people, everyone got something. Me too. It went something like this:

- Is your mother still with us?
- Yes.
- Is your father still with us?
- No.
- Your father is with you, and he’s around your mother a lot. They were very close and she misses him a lot.
- OK…
- Your grandmother is in spirit?
- Yes.
- She’s a lovely woman, so warm and caring, she and your mother were very close, and they still are.
- OK…
- You yourself have always been one in the crowd, didn't stick out really, until recently when you've come out of your shell.
- Uhm…

I've never been a "sheep". Anyone who knows me will tell you that much. But even after this, which was a complete dud (will explain later why), I had already booked a reading with her. A one to one. Maybe she'd had a bad link that day, right?

The first thing she said when I walked into the private reading was, "Forget about him and move on!" I was a bit startled, and asked, "Forget about who, exactly?" She brushed me off and said I should know that. OK, fairly cryptic, then. She said I had "a lovely sister of mercy", "an Indian" and "an Asian" with me as guides. Great, I thought, all that's missing in that line-up is someone from Atlantis... I asked if I could ask questions, she said yes. So I did. She asked me questions back, fishing for information. When I wasn't satisfied with that, saying something like, "shouldn't you tell me?" she said, "You ask a lot about the past. Forget about that." A lot of forgetting to be done, clearly. Sometimes you want answers before moving on, but she was more interested in giving me future dates that would be "important" and to forget about people.

Afterwards, I was meeting with a friend who had had a reading with this medium the previous year. When I said what her intro had been, her jaw dropped. "WHAT!? That's what she told me too!!! I'd had a fight with my husband but didn't think it had been that bad!" When I asked which guides she had been getting, take a wild guess which three she'd got listed up as well. Another example of cr$p mediumship. Or rather, cold reading.

Why the readings were wrong
Both these medium clearly looked at my age and sussed out that a dead grandmother would be a good bet.

Most grandmothers might be these cuddly things with a great relationship with their grandchildren, but I can honestly say that the relationship between myself and my grandmother was - at best - strained. She didn't want anything to do with me, really. She didn't want to be alone with me because I was a kid, which made her uncomfortable. When I came to visit she would make sure I went out in the back yard and played there. Overlooked by her from the 4th floor. She and my mother had had the same relationship but worse. My mother felt she was living with a tyrant, a control freak and when she went there was no huge grief. They sure as hell wouldn't be hanging out now chatting away, as one of them suggested.

Besides, my mother and my father had been divorced for years when he died, they hadn't spoken for years because the last six years of his life had been rather… well, let's just say it turned him into someone else we didn't recognise. Sure, it was a feeling of loss for her then, but she was well over him – for reasons I won't get into here.

To round off - finally ;)
There are many good, honest mediums out there. Even bad mediums with good intentions. I have to admit, very few make my jaw drop. I've met a few that have blown me away, but being a working medium should have some sort of minimum requirements, really. I've seen mediums encouraging people to commit suicide because they can't cope with the world, and then blame spirit for making them say it. Honestly, some things just aren't on.

Would like to hear other people's experiences with this stuff...?

You don't attend the same church I do,do you?
Chuckled my head off when I read your post.
I happened to visit our local church a while ago and it was all 'Grannies'.

Grannies with silver hair,grannies who baked apple pies.
Grannies who wore the old type 'pinnies.
I came out with my head whirling full of Grannies!

I haven't visited since then.
What a fiasco.

Deepsea

We might have encountered the same mediums, as they tend to run around doing their thing all over the country. It was in the UK, so who knows

Something I also find extraordinary is that in the many months I tried this, I never once heard the word "suicide". Not once. And *surely* there were people present who were there, hoping to connect to a person who'd done just that. Is tha a church thing, do you think? Suicide equals sin equals hell equals we don't talk about that here?

*bangs head on keyboard*

Originally Posted by deepsea

You don't attend the same church I do,do you?
Chuckled my head off when I read your post.
I happened to visit our local church a while ago and it was all 'Grannies'.

Grannies with silver hair,grannies who baked apple pies.
Grannies who wore the old type 'pinnies.
I came out with my head whirling full of Grannies!

I haven't visited since then.
What a fiasco.

Deepsea

Now I did once receive a message from my step daughter through a medium at the spiritualist church.
Going back some time here.

My step daughter took her own life some time ago and I was given the lovely message that she was taking care of young children who had passed into spirit.
That was correct as she loved children in her life.

The word 'suicide' was not mentioned but given in a way to suggest she had taken her own life.

Beautiful.

But Grannies! I'm one myself and certainly don't want to be described as some mediums do.
I hate baking apple pies!

This thread sure has been an interesting read. While I haven't attended any spiritual churches, I have seen my fair share of unbelievable mediums, both working on their own and in development circles I think that's one of my biggest hesitations for wanting to dive right in and just start taking on clients. I really don't think I'm ready for that, even though I've been told a couple of times by other beginning psychics, or channelled messages from spirit guides, to do so.

But to be fair, I've also seen a few really good ones too. That's what I want to be like before I start trying to help people. I completely agree with all the things stated in this thread, about what a good medium/psychic should and shouldn't be like. Though, sometimes I wonder just how much of it really is a runaway ego, or just someone else's perception of that person.

I'm fairly certain that there are times when some people think I've got some kind of big headed ego, because of the different kinds of encounters I have. But to me, I've just been sharing what I've experienced, thinking someone might find it interesting or helpful, and no different then anyone else talking about their experiences. I don't know, maybe I've just been so reclusive, unable to fully find enough compatibility with others, that even the majority of my spiritual experiences are incompatible and too unbelievable, making me seem like some kind of ego maniac when I talk about stuff. Don't know. But since it does happen to me, I just have to wonder how many other people it happens to as well, or if it really is a label that's been earned. I suppose it's all up to each individual case. Heh, there's my indecisive dual Gemini nature for ya Can't ever make up my mind what to believe, LOL.

I just wish I could find a group around here, where I could continue developing, without feeling like I'm in the wrong place. I haven't been to my psychic development classes in so long, that I feel like I've been losing my connection. And yet, sometimes I cringe at the things being taught there and how so many of the other people just eat it up like it was Gospel.

Originally Posted by Light Earth

This thread caught my eye and I agree with loads of the comments. I think Spiritualist churches can be as variable as any other venue but I have had some good and bad experiences depending on the church.

My main issue is that they seem to be very sad places and that people in the congregation are in danger of going to the church far too often desperate to hear from their loved ones. This promise of contact really stops people from moving on and can extend grief far beyond what is helpful to both the person left on earth and the spirit, who is trying to move on and best not bound by their relatives' grief.

As a novice medium, I have no intention whatsoever to work in spiritualist churches, I think it is unnecessary for a start but also it's not the environment I will work best in. There is nothing more frustrating than sitting in the congregation looking at spirit in the aisles who are being either ignored or totally misrepresented. They just want us to tell their loved ones exactly what they're saying, they don't want all the histrionics and nonsense.

I have had to endure numerous occasions of fake channelling whilst in development circles, including that of aliens, when I truly didn't know whether to laugh or cry. The worst thing was that it was encouraged by the church, when truly the lady just needed some help.

But, I have also seen some great mediums and had a good laugh, cry and heart warm, from a church is Australia specifically. So, I guess there's nothing wrong with the church as a concept, it's really down to the people who run them now...

If I could change spiritualist churches for the better I'd:

- Get rid of the hymns and replace with uplifting meditation music
- Remove all open mediumship circles - these should be invitation only
- Encourage psychic development but not mediumship to the extent it is currently (and remove the competition that seems to exist)
- Have an uplifting talk / workshop / lecture each week to actually teach the way of spirit, from someone who truly works with spirit
- Ensure the energy is uplifting, positive and motivating at all times
- Insist that all mediums on stdetailed evidential, detailed and precise with their readings, or they don't appear

Just a few of my thoughts, really I guess I'm just looking for the positive, celebratory, uplifting, straight talking, no nonsense approach that I know our spirit friends appreciate.

Thoroughly agree with all you say.
Open mediumship circles? Didn't know they existed. Always thought it was private closed circles.
Good post,thank you.
Deepsea

[Papa Bear]

Who I wonder would be the Spiritual pioneer, who would commit themselves to a long term challenge, of setting up a spiritualist church. Open and close it, first in last out, set up the type of services, meetings and circles they believed to be best suited to aid anyone who came. How long it would take to, develop mediums to stand on the platform, find the experience to run, healing or development circles. Find the balance of assertiveness to overcome strong characters that would turn up, and stay. Find the honesty to confront those misguided in their impatience, and the patience to continue, when attendance was low.

The challenges that would be faced, may last years, patience would be required, to await the arrival of key new members who would commit themselves to the cause, for selfless reasons. When the first to develop mediumship qualities surfaced, a whole new set of challenges would surface just regarding their support and guidance. Another challenge would become recognized, in that, in the majority, the older generations would be more common amongst those who stayed longest, so a solution to the problem of finding and holding on to `youthful` new members, would have to be found.

But the greatest challenge would be, waiting, because everyone who would enter through the door would do so voluntarily, and return the same way. So adapting to losing your best, most promising mediums, may become part of the process, added to the ones who stayed, who developed the predictable ego, which accompanies the recognition and `fame` which comes with public recognition. What qualities such a pioneer would require, to stay the course, while the passers-by; would find criticism in most areas of their place of open development. Who would be that Spiritual pioneer?

Until we have walked in another’s shoes, can we know the reasons for their failings? If we had taken the same course, would we have those same failings for the same reasons? In most cases, developing spiritualist mediums, their churches and their leaders are people who have dedicated many years of their lives to their own and their churches development. And maybe when we have walked that path for as long as they, we may understand why they have any failings they may have. I have, and do, which is why with respect I look to the leaders for those failings, but you can only do what you can, with what or who you have to work with. We are all fallible, no less so, when your form of mediumship is demonstrated to the general public, for who can match their varied demands completely. Just a reflection.

Peace be with you

[Papa Bear]

Thank you Miscideas for your reflection, “I think your comments are very helpful and perhaps can lead to further discussion at some point regarding the practical issues of how to bring together the disparate and separate groups of spiritually active people where they can actually be of practical use to each other. The world really needs activity now.”

I could not agree more, though the same was thought 20 years ago, I do recognize that the power of forums such as this one, are a modern tool which many are using to find each other. It cannot be underestimated, the positive and creative influences of open forums, where people find the opportunity to share and discover, from each other’s experiences. And though opinion and judgement can remain a simple conversation piece, in action many of those creative thoughts, put to practice, may surprise the individual who stepped forward with their creative suggestions; where-ever they may be active.

Though the topic of discussion is the quality of mediumship, recognizing that at public meetings it is the conditions created by the whole, rather than the individual medium, that is of key relevance. So addressing the conditions, in which individuals may find common links, is not only pertinent to the topic at hand, but more generally, since connectivity is the essence of any shared reflection, including mediumship.

It really depends on which area the focus is placed upon, an online contact point, attending the same places of development, a shared coffee after a meeting ends, or sharing your home by invitation. And since I previously referred to my experience relating to a place of development, and that coffee afterwards, and what can be done at home, let me give an online example.
When I was a member of the only other forum I have joined, in time, I forwarded some suggestions when members were looking for group activity. I suggested a controlled telepathy exercise, which required a commitment on my part, to organize, times, the receiver of everyone’s posts in PMs, the choice of individual who`s turn it would be, to be the main focus of the group, and of course the purpose of focus.

In essence, one person would meditate on one item, at a particular time, for 30 minutes, the same day and time, each week, till everyone had the opportunity to be that main one. Obviously time lines had to be organized, so everyone had a reasonable time to participate. At the end of the 30 minutes, all participants PMed what they reflected from their short meditation, to a selected moderator, when all were received, they were posted together, at the same time, in the relevant thread. The central participant also PMed the item they held, and that was posted last. Then an open discussion opened up, within that thread.

The four months it ran, participation grew from 4 to 20 members, each committed to the key time and day of each week. The item of focus was identified on four occasions, but many times, the surroundings, clothing, pictures on the walls in which the individual meditated, even that persons own conditions, were often recognized and confirmed, within the reflections that did not identify the item of focus. Following the completion of the exercises, much discussion was had relating to individual views of personal method, and reason for any results.

Now I must stress that this is an example, from my own experience, of how individuals who seek to participate with each other, may do so, even online. I do not refer in any way to this site or its practices. It is just an example of how one person, who is prepared to give of their time to aid others, can create new shared experiences. And the individual lady, who identified the item on three occasions, definitely grew because of that exercise. The creative discussions enlightened others on many factors, relating to meditation, focus and group commitment, including a wide variation of interpretation regarding what telepathy is, in connection to psychic or mediumship abilities.

Hope it helps “regarding the practical issues of how to bring together the disparate and separate groups of spiritually active people where they can actually be of practical use to each other.”
Peace be with you

Interesting and thought provoking stuff. Thanks Papa Bear.

Originally Posted by Papa Bear

Who I wonder would be the Spiritual pioneer, who would commit themselves to a long term challenge, of setting up a spiritualist church. Open and close it, first in last out, set up the type of services, meetings and circles they believed to be best suited to aid anyone who came. How long it would take to, develop...
Peace be with you

Beautifully put, Papa Bear.