Psychedelics

SOME DRUGS CAN CAUSE MADNESS. I KNOW SOME FOLKS THAT HAD RESPECTABLE PROBOBILITY OF BECOMING AWARE AND ENLIGHTENED, BUT BECAME A BIT OBSESSED WITH THE EXPERIENCE THEY ACHIEVED THRU DRUG USE. AND NOW SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE ARE A BIT MAD (SCITZAPHRENIC TYPE BEHAVIOURS, RECALLING PHYSICAL EVENTS OTHERS KNOW TO BE COMPLETLY INACURATE OR FALSE, ETC.).
ESPECIALLY IN THE TIMES WE'RE LIVING, MANY STREET DRUGS ARE NOT IN ANYWAY "PURE". DRUG MANUFACTURERS ARE FINDING NEW AND DANGEROUS WAYS TO MAKE THE PRODUCT MORE "POTENT".

NOTE* SOME DRUGS CAN OPEN "DOORS" FOR SOME PEOPLE (OR CATCH A GLIPSE OF WHAT ONE IS SEEKING). BUT IM THOROUGHLY CONVINCED THAT DRUG USE SHOULD NEVER BE A PATH. A DRUG SHOULD NEVER BE RELIED UPON TO "GET YOU THERE". ONES OWN PERSONAL ENERGY IS THE ONLY WAY TO ASCEND. IT IS FOOLISH TO BELIEVE A DRUG CAN GIVE ANYONE THE PERSONAL, SPIRITUAL POWER AND FREEDOM THAT WE SEEK. THERE IS THE POSSIBILTY THAT DRUGS CAN AID PEOPLE IN DIFFERENT ASPECTS. BUT AGAIN; IT IS SOME DRUGS AND SOME PEOPLE THAT MAY BENEFIT FROM LIMITED USE. I MYSELF, HAVE EXTENSIVE FIRST HAND EXPERIENCE, AS PART OF THE PSYCADELIC SUBCULTURE. THERE ARE ALWAYS PROS AND CONS. SOME BRAINS AND EMOTIONS SHOULDNT BE FILLED WITH *enter drug name here*. THIS TOPIC IS A BIT STICKY. THERE ARE ETHICS INVOLVED. MANY IFS. AND A BIT OF RESPONSIBILTY FOR THE EXPERIENCED TO EDUCATE THE NON EXPERIENCED IN A WAY WHERE ONE CAN MAKE THERE OWN EDUCATED AND INFORMED DESICIONS.

^ Well put.

Originally Posted by kundalini

No dreamer, I have made no assumptions. You and other members have clearly recommended the use of drugs. You cannot deny that you have not. Listen dreamer because I know you know what I am talking about. Drugs are a MATERIAL substance and many lives are ruined, destroyed, utterly obliterated due to the use of them. Now, would you not say that something so obviously dangerous and MATERIAL, whilst also bearing in mind that drugs are nothing more than a substance designed for a person to escape REALITY, can you honestly not say that they are a negative diversion? Please bear in mind the very REAL facts about all the crime and madness associated with them too.

Thanks for reading, Kundalini.

Kundalini, this is indeed a sticky topic and I can see your point of view and it has its merits, there is a danger however that you can become a bit carried away in pushing your point which leads to you delivering an opinion that is blatantly unbalanced and badly thought out.

Are you saying that you never had a positive experience with drugs? Are you saying that you are not more open minded having taken drugs than you would have been otherwise. Maybe drugs have there place for a reason, maybe without recreational drugs we would still be living in a repressed society where bigotry, small mindedness and intollerance would be the norm.

It always amuses me when ex drug takers who have had bad experiences start moralising, claiming that they have only a negative legacy from there experiences. Maybe there are massive positives that have come from your experiences that you are not yet willing to accept, or maybe when you overcome your fears these will become evident.

I am not suggesting that drugs are a path in any way but I cannot condemn the use of weed, hallucinogens or ecstacy although i would recommend to anyone wanting advice that they should be used with respect especially halucinogens- personally i never got anything of worth from coke and i wouldn't ever touch crack or heroin (or PCP ha,ha).

You assume that I am looking at this issue from a "lower" viewpoint, that is the assumption you make. My viewpoint is in fact that everyone is responsible for their own actions and that all I can do is inform the debate with my honest personal experiences. p.s. I stopped taking drugs a while ago although if they were offered i would not refuse. I now recreate altered states through meditation - if I had never touched drugs I would never have been where I am today though, hence i can't condemn them.

Hi dreamer,

I have thought out my views on many occassions and find that they are balanced and well-thought out, especially as I have already acknowledged that drugs do good things for some people and I am also open-minded enough to acknowledge that maybe some people have to take drugs, you know had to go through that experience for some higher purpose.

However, I don't believe I put my views to you for your amusement, especially as I never said that I hadn't had one positive experience whilst on drugs. You have assumed that assumption all by yourself. However, what I find most strange dreamer is that you state 'Maybe there are massive positives that have come from your experiences that you are not yet willing to accept, or maybe when you overcome your fears these will become evident.'

What fears? I never said I was scared whilst on drugs or scared of drugs. I ACCEPT and UNDERSTAND drugs. Therefore, I am not scared of them. As for positives for me to accept, I have already done so, acknowledging that I had to take drugs to be on the path that I am now and I certainly don't regret it for every single experience I have ever had as they have made me who I am today.

I have condemned no use of drugs BUT I have said I do not recommend drugs to anybody as you never know how that person may react to them. Should they die from popping 'that' one pill or develop a serious addiction which destroys their life, then you'd still recommend that they take that chance dreamer? THAT'S small-mindedness!

Fair enough kundalini.

Originally Posted by kundalini

acknowledging that I had to take drugs to be on the path that I am now and I certainly don't regret it for every single experience I have ever had as they have made me who I am today.

I have condemned no use of drugs BUT I have said I do not recommend drugs to anybody as you never know how that person may react to them. Should they die from popping 'that' one pill or develop a serious addiction which destroys their life, then you'd still recommend that they take that chance dreamer? THAT'S small-mindedness!

I would. There are many paths on the road to enlightenment and many streets in the city of evolution. You can go any waY you like and you will still reach your/our destination.

Ultimately and eternally, it is up to you, the individual inhabiting your physical body. Therefore any action you undertake may influence them, though it will not control them.

You/We/I are/am the creators of our reality and as we are all individuations of the whole we will affect each others creation. It is all intertwined and peices together like a puzzle. We are all putting down the peices. And although it never seems to end we will one day create an ultimate outpicturing and inpicturing of ourselves, the perfect image.

Shakatan

About recommending drugs to people. I would act without the thought of consequence. It is suffice that you think only of youself (as one).Maybe i'm just impersonal...


Enlightener

Wise words, one step on - act in the knowledge that if your intention is pure the consequences will bear fruit of great sweetness.

Originally Posted by dreamer

Wise words, one step on - act in the knowledge that if your intention is pure the consequences will bear fruit of great sweetness.

What Enlightener has actually said is I would recommend drugs without the thought of consequence so basically what you are actually saying is I would recommend them without thinking. Very unwise. The intention is not pure. I would call what has been said by Enlightener 'spiritual bunkum' as it bears no relation whatsoever to the issue of drugs.

By the way, I am not trying to convince you or Enlightener anymore of my point of view simply because you and Enlightener are so very set on recommending drugs to anyone, despite the consequences and now that I have insulted your views, you will not want to listen anyway.

You are of the opinion that well, one day we will all be whole anyway and keep referring to this 'one' business as though a person should not really care about anybody but themselves. That is just inconsiderate self-centredness and thoughtless too at that.

lol,

I do beleive that you should have care and love for your fellow man because, and get ready for the 'spiritual bunkum', we ARE all one and what you do for another you do for yourself. And what you do to another you do to yourself. It may not be so literal in reality but it still rings true if the paradigm of the universe is that we are all One.


I don't care if you insult me and I am always open to suggestion. Though I would recommend drugs to just about anyone because of the incredible joy and mind altering states that it brings me. Why wouldn't I want anyone to experience that? Ultimately it is up to you though.

Enlightener

Originally Posted by kundalini

What Enlightener has actually said is I would recommend drugs without the thought of consequence so basically what you are actually saying is I would recommend them without thinking. Very unwise. The intention is not pure. I would call what has been said by Enlightener 'spiritual bunkum' as it bears no relation whatsoever to the issue of drugs.

By the way, I am not trying to convince you or Enlightener anymore of my point of view simply because you and Enlightener are so very set on recommending drugs to anyone, despite the consequences and now that I have insulted your views, you will not want to listen anyway.

You are of the opinion that well, one day we will all be whole anyway and keep referring to this 'one' business as though a person should not really care about anybody but themselves. That is just inconsiderate self-centredness and thoughtless too at that.

Kundalini,

Take a deep breath and ask yourself who is it you are getting angry at? Who is it you are (or were) trying to convince? What was it you were trying to convince "us" of?

"My" opinion seems to matter a lot to "you", deep down a voice is calling with this exact same opinion that is being manifested here under the guise of this "seperate" entity dreamer. I am only saying what you are asking for and that seems to be a fight, does this make sense now?

The outside is just a manifestation of the inside, it is all one and the same, you are fighting with your reflection and i with mine - got to see the comedy in that huh?

No hard feelings from "my" side.