Self - open discussion

But I exist in a feeling...not in the thought of it.

[andrew g]

Originally Posted by xxheatherxx

But I exist in a feeling...not in the thought of it.

You dont experience pure feeling because you still believe that you exist. In talking to me right now you are not experiencing pure feeling. Its not possible because conceptual thought separates us from feeling at least a tiny tiny wee bit.

If we both drop all thought, drop all concepts right now, become still....then we will experience pure feeling. Ready......Go


****


Okay, done that. Now, what shall we talk about hehe? Thats the thing, the being still is cool, but I like to play.

[sound]

Originally Posted by andrew g

We experience a sense of existence for as long as we believe that we exist. When we release that belief we trade in the experience of existence and the experience of self for a direct experience of love, light, ease and joy.

The thing is that we like the sense of existence and the sense of self so we only trade in that experience for a different one when we are ready.

Essentially we ARE existence, so when we have released the belief that we HAVE an existence, we dont experience existence as such because its that very belief that we have an existence that creates the artificial sense of being separate.

Isn't love light ease and joy a part of this experience of existence though ... how does it transcend existence and if so then who is doing the transcending?

[Gem]

The thought is the thing that occurs, like each finger typing, but there is no rule that there must be a thing expressing in order for expression to occur, only that expression be unique so as to be at all, for it is no other than this which it is, which never before and will never again be expressed.

[andrew g]

Originally Posted by sound

Isn't love light ease and joy a part of this experience of existence though ... how does it transcend existence and if so then who is doing the transcending?

If we are experiencing a SENSE of existence and a SENSE of self it means that we are also experiencing an artificial sense of separation. When we no longer experience this artificial sense of separation there is only a purity of feeling (we could call it love or joy or whatever). If you prefer, we could say that without the sense of separation there is only a purity of existence and a purity of self but it doesnt make much sense to say this given the way we think. It is more helpful to talk about a purity of 'feeling'.

The one who does the transcending is actually the one that falls away. Thats why people sometimes say that we already are enlightened, we just havent Realized that. The sense of separation is an illusion, it is artificial yet experienced very much as being real. Its all just a trick of the mind.

To put it one more way. Indirect experience is the sense of existence and the sense of self. Direct experience is when we are that sense. In order to sense existence you have to sense the things of existence. You have to objectify. In direct experience we dont sense the things of existence, there is only a purity of feeling instead. We no longer experience 'things' we experience a 'continuum'.

[sound]

Originally Posted by Gem

The thought is the thing that occurs, like each finger typing, but there is no rule that there must be a thing expressing in order for expression to occur, only that expression be unique so as to be at all, for it is no other than this which it is, which never before and will never again be expressed.

Yes that is the unique nature of expression ... it is new, like experience in one sense ...

The self is my eternal soul. The soul transforms and grows thoughout many incarnations. But the self that is uniquely "me" remains the same -- yes, it's changed to a degree of course, in the same way we change as we age. But it's still me.

[sound]

Originally Posted by andrew g

Thats why people sometimes say that we already are enlightened, we just havent Realized that. The sense of separation is an illusion, it is artificial yet experienced very much as being real. Its all just a trick of the mind.

However they still make reference to a 'we' .. or if they are talking about individual experience they say 'I' ... seems there is no escaping the 'one' doing the realizing

We experience a sense of existence for as long as we believe that we exist. When we release that belief we trade in the experience of existence and the experience of self for a direct experience of love, light, ease and joy.

And who knows someone who has let go of the belief that they exist in order to experience love, light and joy?

The self IMO is who we think we are. My mind can only comprehend so many parts of myself at once so it will always be a limited view but I can add to that, that my self is so much more. I am capable of being anything.
The focus for myself is not who I am, but simply what I enjoy being and what I want to be more of.

The rest of who I think I am is pretty much made up from perspectives, beliefs and so on. Its shown that a powerful experience can change all memories in the past of who we think we are and how we view life. So the self is an evolving self that will always have some form of identity based on what we think. What we think is influenced by many factors, our evolution, our DNA heritage, conditioning from parents, school, religion, society and so on. Which is why focusing on who you want to be can be more helpful than focusing on who you are, as who you are changes by the time you think you have a handle on it.

Greetings..

Originally Posted by andrew g

You dont experience pure feeling because you still believe that you exist. In talking to me right now you are not experiencing pure feeling. Its not possible because conceptual thought separates us from feeling at least a tiny tiny wee bit.

If we both drop all thought, drop all concepts right now, become still....then we will experience pure feeling. Ready......Go


****


Okay, done that. Now, what shall we talk about hehe? Thats the thing, the being still is cool, but I like to play.

Precisely, Andrew.. it's called 'stillness', and it's something "YOU" DO.. and until you discard the physical vehicle, the vehicle is temporary 'home', you play with concepts, but return to the 'isness' of your 'temporary home'..

Be well..