Spirituality and Happiness

[Seawolf]

Originally Posted by Gem

I read some research on that, most of which was conducted by Christian organisations, and hence biased to the affirmative.

The article I posted was based on empirical analysis of data from the European Social Survey, which isn't a Christian organization.

Since I was a kid I've always noticed religious people seemed happy. But you're right, those that go crazy with it and tend to be very vocal, sometimes called 'fundamentalists', don't seem as happy as the mainstream Christians.

If you actually know alot of Christians, you know that for the most part they aren't overwhelmed by guilt, but rather are focused on things like love and living out their faith. The popular secular bias against them is not fair and isn't based on real life experience being with them.

It may be hard to swallow for some, because it's popular to think of 'organized religion' as a negative thing, but really it's not as bad as secular media and opinion wants us to think. The amount of charity done by these 'bad' groups doesn't seem to be considered either. Buddhism is an organized religion, and for the most part it's a positive thing as well.

I think spirituality makes people happy if they practice/live it, and even happier if they can meet together. This would be true in any religion/spirituality imo. It's not the goal, but a result. Human beings desire spirituality, and exercising that part of us results in a more positive mental outlook.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by Seawolf

The article I posted was based on empirical analysis of data from the European Social Survey, which isn't a Christian organization.

Since I was a kid I've always noticed religious people seemed happy. But you're right, those that go crazy with it and tend to be very vocal, sometimes called 'fundamentalists', don't seem as happy as the mainstream Christians.

If you actually know alot of Christians, you know that for the most part they aren't overwhelmed by guilt, but rather are focused on things like love and living out their faith. The popular secular bias against them is not fair and isn't based on real life experience being with them.

It may be hard to swallow for some, because it's popular to think of 'organized religion' as a negative thing, but really it's not as bad as secular media and opinion wants us to think. The amount of charity done by these 'bad' groups doesn't seem to be considered either. Buddhism is an organized religion, and for the most part it's a positive thing as well.

I think spirituality makes people happy if they practice/live it, and even happier if they can meet together. This would be true in any religion/spirituality imo. It's not the goal, but a result. Human beings desire spirituality, and exercising that part of us results in a more positive mental outlook.

Sheesh, I missed the article.

Yep, moderate Christians are a lot more into love and forgiveness than punishment and hellfire... I spent a lot of time with Christians when volunteering in 'soup kitchens' here in Sydney. Most seemed happier than I am, really. The Churches do a great deal of work to help people in the community.

You're probably right that neglecting our spiritual part of our nature isn't conducive to happiness... over the long term.

From what I read, there are various aspects of religious groups the enhance peoples sense of well being, sense of belonging and sense of personal security. Faith enhanced happiness in moderate Christians, but caused distress for fundamentalists.

Personally, I don't identify with any religious group, and I can't because I don't believe in the doctrine. When working within religious organisations I felt somewhat alienated and had the sense I didn't really belong to the group because I don't believe.

Life can become lonely for people who have a 'personal god' because they forge their own belief, but I think that is a better way than conforming to a consensus.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by Baile

Thanks for the various explanations. FYI, I wasn't critiquing your comments, I was chuckling about them. Guilt and judgement are such weird notions to me; I don't get the inner angst some people create for themselves.

I'm pretty sure each one of us has experienced guilt, but like all hard emotions, it's not particularly problematic unless it's extreme and prolonged. (I didn't mention judgement, and surprisingly to me, it wasn't really discussed in the research either)

You say what I say: psalms and sermons and Sunday picnics have much to do with the happiness and positivity of religious individuals. What sort of community activities do people on the spiritual path undertake together? Watching Youtube documentaries about interplanetary lizard beings invading our Earth.

I didn't say anything about sermons, picnics, psalms or lizards, so we aren't saying the same things. I said something along the lines of a sense of belonging to a community that offers support to one another. That might mean babysitting for each other in kind, having people to turn to in hard times, people to bring meals to you if you fall ill... and simple stuff like just visiting each other. A community that cares for each other in general.

It's not that I like religion or promote or condone it, I merely reviewed literature that concurred, that on the whole, religious people are generally very happy, and had optimistic outlooks toward their lives and their community (I was reviewing in context of religious systems affecting individuals' world view).

[Baile]

Originally Posted by Gem

I didn't say anything about sermons, picnics, psalms... so we aren't saying the same things. I said something along the lines of a sense of belonging to a community that offers support to one another. That might mean babysitting for each other in kind, having people to turn to in hard times, people to bring meals to you if you fall ill... and simple stuff like just visiting each other. A community that cares for each other in general.

Sunday group picnics is all that different from bring each other meals and a community that cares for each other?
You're obviously emphasizing the community aspect more than me, but that's about it I would say.

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by Seawolf

An interesting study showed that religious people were the happiest in Europe..

http://www.mercatornet.com/articles/...s_of_believing

This doesn't surprise me, some of the happiest people I've known were Christians. Following my religion makes my life brighter and more positive too. Does your spiritual path give you peace and happiness? Do you meet with friends at religious services, or do you practice your spiritual beliefs alone?

I called myself a Christian for some 10 years and I was happy. It was like a drug and if things weren't going happily, I just wrote it off as Gods will or the devil interfering. Basically I wasn't facing anything myself.
Now I am at peace and there's a big difference for me between the two.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by Baile

So Sunday picnics isn't what you said. You said bring each other meals.

And getting together for communal church services isn't what you said. You said getting together in the sense of belonging to a community.

So what else did we both say that's pretty much exactly the same, but isn't?

What you say is quite different to what I say, and I don't want people to get the wrong impression about that.

Churches do have a congregation that worship together weekly, bible study, youth group, church picnics and so on, and that brings people together and it's how they meet, but activities organised by the church weren't reported as the reason people felt happy. It's more like, if one family is planning a picnic on the weekend, or a weekend away, they might invite another family from their congregation to join them. People might car pool or baby sit of have a BBQ. In addition, because there is an extensive support network, people are cared for, not by the church organisation, but by each other.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by Gem

What you say is quite different to what I say, and I don't want people to get the wrong impression about that.

Yes, I realized that, thus I edited my post.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by Baile

Sunday group picnics is all that different from bring each other meals and a community that cares for each other? Really?
You're obviously emphasizing the community aspect more than me, but c'mon.

I reviewed literature for a piece I did on social systems affecting world view, so it dealt with how religion affected people outlook on life. It found that moderates generally have an optimistic outlook and a positive attitude toward their community. The reasons given included their faith, but in more dogmatic orders faith in the doctrine was attributed to unpleasant emotions. The overriding reason for their chipper demeanour was not services or activities organised by the church. It was the community that arose from that common interest. The organised activity is how they met and came together. The church doesn't organise the baby sitting or car pools or bring a nice chicken soup over when you are ill. People do that for each other, and it was said that the spirit of community invoked the reported happiness... which has several aspects...

One paper discussed the state of marriges, family abuse and divorce rates... another investigated houshold alcohol and drug use, and these gave pretty favorable findings too... so there are a multitude of reasons that religious people have quite happy lives, generally speaking, most of which have little to do with church organised activities; however, those activities also help, I'm sure.

[Baile]

Originally Posted by Gem

The overriding reason for their chipper demeanour was not services or activities organised by the church. It was the community that arose from that common interest.

So I guess I don't understand why moderate Christians supposedly aren't as happy as non-religious types on an individual spiritual path, something you mentioned I think. Sounds like the moderate religious crowd is pretty positive and engaged in life overall.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by Baile

So I guess I don't understand why moderate Christians supposedly aren't as happy as non-religious types on an individual spiritual path, something you mentioned I think. Sounds like the moderate religious crowd is pretty positive and engaged in life overall.

Moderate, and particularly protestant, Christians were found to be the happiest of the target groups.

People who "believed in a personal god" were not found to be as happy and moderately people ("Non religious type on an individual spiritual path" might fall in that category). This group said their social supports were very limited... but they were pretty happy

Fundamentalists were misery guts.

I didn't review any agnostis or atheist in a religious context...

I personally don't like organised religion, so even though they were said to be happy, I'm in the a non religious type on an individual spiritual path... and that because I live and learn rather that conform to a group mentality. I'm sadder because it's not easy relying on my very own merit... it's tough sometimes... but I think it's more truthful that going along with a crowd.