Enlightenment

[BlueSky]

Originally Posted by northstar

lol WS... (hugs... or handshake i mean) awww shucks (digs toe in ground)

How about bows?
I was blessed to visit China a couple of years ago and I saw the most awesome thing as 2 older men met up in the lobby of the hotel and bowed to each other..........it left quite an impression on me .

<WS bows to northstar>

(northstar bows back simultaneously to another equal in respect)...

Originally Posted by Enlightened

Squatchit - The reason I can't reply to every single post is because of the volume. Enlightened people get bills, and right now I have to work. It's a shame people think i've ran off with my tail between my legs because I haven't immediately replied.

Plus I want to keep this laser focused. People generally tend to do anything to distract themselves from the process of actually looking, which is what's happening here.

Instead of actually following the pointer to the moon, people tend to initially attack it without ever looking at it's instruction.

By our world, I mean a number of things. Humanity is killing itself in countless and obvious ways. The world as a planet, pollution, and potential for nuclear wars etc

On a day-to-day basis i'm working with people that generally come to me looking for liberation. As it's obvious to see here, people say they want enlightenment but they seem to spend 10x as long arguing over it.

No one as of yet has actually looked into what I have said to look for have they?

Honestly?

Yes. Actualy, someone did about 10 years ago. Are you aware of Eddie Traversa? He was my mentor.

[Shantyaikya]

See what happens when you try to wake people up? They get all cranky because they want to sleep in more. It is fun to see that grumpy look on their face though and all the drool.

I think you hold a key to an experience, a good experience, but not the buddhahood experience or perhaps the ultimate experience. I say this due to the nature in how you react to the aggression towards you. Take a breath or three.

Oh and don't bother with Mystique, he's the dodgiest person I've ever met, but a cool one none the less.

Greetings..

I am reposting this from another thread, it seems relevant, here..

In Defense of the 'I'

“I”, is a useful tool of language indicating the speaker’s or writer’s intent to reference their uniquely identifiable relationship with their environment. The word ‘with’ is used to unite, joining the individual ‘with’ the environment of its existence. “I” affirms the user’s self-awareness, expressing a cognizance of its sovereignty within its relationship with its environment. The sovereignty is demonstrated by the person’s ability to maintain a private and inaccessible mindscape.

“I”, as is commonly used in the English language, is a reference to the user’s identifiable individuality, and it is self-evident that, by using that reference, the user is not intending to reference any other person without expressly stating that intention. The physical individuality that is self-aware and references itself by using the commonly accepted term “I” and its related terms has learned communication skills as a necessity for effectively interacting and relating its unique perspective with its environment.

Self-awareness identifies itself, the perceiver and the mechanism of perceiving, as a unique source of perception, awareness, and thought, that perceives what is happening, including that itself is an interconnected participant in the happening. It is observable and demonstrable that the perception is unique and independent from other perceptions simply by the difference of perceptions reported about a common experience. It is equally observable that the individual self-awareness is inter-related and interconnected with its environment as the results of unintended and unanticipated consequences become apparent.

“I”, the identifiable individuality, am an existent quantity as measured by the effect of its existence this “I” has on its environment, and by the quantifiable effect that the absence of this “I” would have, compared to its existing and measurable effect. As an example in the extreme, an effect of the uniquely identifiable person known as Adolph Hitler, was the extermination of nearly six million Jews. The absence of the person, Adolph Hitler, would be that nearly six million Jews would have not been exterminated. There is no evidence that any other person would have had that particular effect on world history.

“I”, as a self-aware individual, must discern itself as different from other self-aware individuals that are interconnected in the collective experience of advancing Humanity’s understanding of itself, and of its relationship with the collective whole. The functionality of “I” is, or should be, apparent, it is the secluded and private mindscape where diversity and randomness are conceived. The spiritually popular belief that there is no “I”, no real person, managing the affairs of the real body-mind is a suspicious belief.

The belief that there is not an existent “I”, or person, or identity necessary for the body-mind to operate in a functional capacity within its interactive environment seems to have been popularized by Buddhist teachings. The Buddhist teachings are supported by a theory called Dependent Origination, which suggests that every condition that arises is dependent on a cause. Buddhist belief suggests that human suffering is caused by ignorance, desire, and ill-will, and to eliminate suffering one must eliminate the causes. Buddhist theories suggest that it is the identification with an identity or the belief in an existent person that is the vehicle of ‘ignorance, desire, and ill-will’. The beliefs continue to suggest that the absence of a being’s belief that it is an actual person or an identity eliminates the vehicle for ignorance, desire and ill-will. An example cited is that if there are the existent conditions of ‘ear and sound’ there will be hearing, regardless of the person or identity believed to exist and contribute to the necessary conditions.

The existence of a healthy body, ‘the ear’, and the vibrating air of the flute, create an experience, but there is the requisite mind and language database needed to reference the experience as ‘hearing’, such that the reference can be effectively communicated among unique individuals. The Buddhist inclinations to ‘think’ away the conditions necessary for the thinking that Buddha employed to conceive the Four Noble Truths, and The Eight-fold Path, is the idea of the ‘hammer that cannot hit itself’ conundrum. As noted, the necessary thinking mind and language database that determines the experience is ‘hearing’, is also the thinking mind that understands its self-awareness is dysfunctional without an identity. A body-mind that cannot understand its unique relationship with its environment cannot also respond by reference to its unique existence, to its ‘name’ or other unique ‘I’dentifier.

The bulk of the problems inherent to this type of thinking, is the ‘thinking’ itself. When the mind is still and not engaged in thinking/talking to itself, it is free to actually have direct experience with its environment. Otherwise, the thinking mind is distracted from what is actually happening, it is ‘lost in thought’. The thinking mind conjures such distractions as ‘four noble truths’ and ‘eight-fold paths’.. creating a cause, ‘wrong’ thinking.. an effect, ‘suffering’.. and a demand (cure) eight-fold path. The still mind sees the interactive relationships, the consequences, and the options for changing the relationships to reflect its best understanding of its relationships with its environment without the implementation of ritual or hierarchy. The still mind acts with clarity and a knowledge born of experience, rather than second-hand concepts adopted in the absence of willingness to experience existence directly, and the clarity such experience reveals.

Be well..

[sound]

Edited .....

[Internal Queries]

Originally Posted by Shantyaikya

See what happens when you try to wake people up? They get all cranky because they want to sleep in more. It is fun to see that grumpy look on their face though and all the drool.

I think you hold a key to an experience, a good experience, but not the buddhahood experience or perhaps the ultimate experience. I say this due to the nature in how you react to the aggression towards you. Take a breath or three.

Oh and don't bother with Mystique, he's the dodgiest person I've ever met, but a cool one none the less.

it's not what the Op says so much as how he says it. he arrives on this site as if he's descending from on high to bestow upon the ignorant sleepy peasants some great pearls of profound wisdom. talking down to people isn't an effective tool of communication unless those people have no self esteem. if the OP were so advanced in his "buddhahood" as he seems to think he is he'd have not made such a silly blunder.

And the word 'I' means self. There is a deeper sense of 'I' beyond the mind. The "I am." I am that I am.

[Internal Queries]

Originally Posted by moke64916

And the word 'I' means self. There is a deeper sense of 'I' beyond the mind. The "I am." I am that I am.

but it's the Mind that perceives the "I am". how can one perceive what is "beyond the mind" without the mind perceiving itself beyond itself?

you can't view the back of your own eyeball without removing it from it's socket. at which point you've blinded yourself having destroyed the functionality of the organ you were seeking to examine. self defeating.

[hybrid]

beyond the mind simply means it is known intuitively