The purpose of 'new age' spirituality?

[Dragonfly1]

2-3 others in the 'whole' forum?.......hmmm.....where did you come up with that number?......do you know how we all think and feel on here ....hmm....interesting you must be a claire something........hehe.....

[Baile]

Originally Posted by Dragonfly1

2-3 others in the 'whole' forum?.......hmmm.....where did you come up with that number?......do you know how we all think and feel on here ....hmm....interesting you must be a claire something........hehe.....

Just read this train wreck of a thread and see for yourself.

[Touched]

Originally Posted by Seawolf

Posting my opinion is forcing anything. You can take it or leave it.

That's a red herring. What you ARE doing is forcing the issue. This became crystal clear after our first failed discussion, and then having you reply to me here with the same one-sided and negating arguments.

From the rules:

Discussion: Members are reminded this is a discussion forum and not a debate forum. That is to say: Debates are destructive as they present one-sided opinions and destroy reasoned arguments, whereas discussions are constructive and encourage the expression of opinion. Trolling and preaching are not forms of discussion and posts or threads of that nature may be deleted, and those who persistently debate / troll / preach without looking to discuss may be subject to warnings leading to Disciplinary Action.

The only reply you have given to anyone's discussion is essentially "No it isn't!" and then inserting your view. That's not discussion, it's preaching.

The other comments you often add are made-up comments about the person who is disagreeing with you, designed to make you look superior and the other person to look weak, by casting them in a negative light through implication. You attempt to control the discussion by imposing your views of us over what we say and then attribute them to me or whoever is disagreeing with you.

http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/sh...7&postcount=68

You really shouldn't do that, because in point of fact you know ZERO about my thoughts, feelings or motivations, and saying you do just makes the rest of your comments also look like bald-faced self-deception.

[Seawolf]

Originally Posted by DJ716

This intrigues me a bit... for me to 'believe' something I would have to have some basis for that belief.

Don't misunderstand me, I 100% agree with these statements, but I can't help but think that there is always some origin for 'belief'. Certainly someone is free to adopt whatever belief(s) they desire. But I don't think that a person would simply generate some random belief and adhere to it.

Another thing that I think about with respect to this topic is what about someone who is subjected to 'brainwashing'. They certainly adopt a set of belief(s) that they have been programmed to accept, but because this was somewhat 'inflicted' externally on them, is it true 'belief'?

I've just been thinking about these things recently. I was raised in a very strict fundamentalist Christian family and had a great deal of reverence for the beliefs of that tradition. However, looking back I cannot say that I ever had experiences that substantiated those beliefs and ran into multiple assumptions within those beliefs with which I had a great deal of dissonance. I began searching for something that I could truthfully (within myself) say that I had experience that supported the belief. Of course this involved a process of 'unlearning' everything I thought to be true and right and leads me now to question, did I ever truly 'believe' those things at all?

I understand what you're saying. I don't mean that we pick our beliefs out of the air, we all learn our beliefs from others and make them personal. I think we pick and choose, we modify and adapt them based on our personality and life experiences.

The real meaning of brainwashing has to do with cults deliberately breaking people down to nothing and then being nice to them so as to make them workers or slaves in the group. Some fundamentalist groups could be seen as using similar tactics. I don't think the beliefs of those who are subject to the fundamentalist approach have as deep a faith as others. All the hard effort they put into seeming dedicated to their faith, to me shows that something is off.

[Seawolf]

Originally Posted by Touched

You really shouldn't do that, because in point of fact you know ZERO about my thoughts, feelings or motivations, and saying you do just makes the rest of your comments also look like bald-faced self-deception.

What's really going on here?

You have argued that New Age is not a religion, and I said it is. You said the New Age is better than the Old Age, and I disagreed. I said that religion mean spiritual beliefs, and you disagreed. I said that religion is the same as spirituality and you disagree.

We just disagree alot, which is ok. We shouldn't have to agree, we should be able to think for ourselves. I would hate to live in a world where everyone agreed.

I'm sorry for making personal remarks about you. I don't know you and I apologize.

[Touched]

Originally Posted by Seawolf

...We just disagree alot, which is ok. We shouldn't have to agree, we should be able to think for ourselves. I would hate to live in a world where everyone agreed...

What I said was "...Yes, spirituality can be a part of religion, and yes religion can be a part of spirituality, but there they are, two separate things..."

I agree that a world where everyone agreed would be useless - and I think a world where everyone has to disagree would be just as useless.

I appreciate the apology - time will tell if you've actually taken it to heart.

[Lilyth Von Gore]

At least old religions like Ásatrú don't force their morals on you. Everyone goes to Helheim whether you believe in the Norse Gods or not. Everyone is equal. The only way into Asgard is through doing something worthy, like saving anothers life, or dying in a heroic fashion, or dying in battle. Only if your actions in this life catch the eye of the Gods can you enter Asgard when you die. If you commit serious crimes, you will never return to this plane of existence. You remain in Helheim for the rest of eternity, strung up like a dead cow.
In spirituality, you either ascend or descend. None of that exists in Ásatrú. Ásatrú does not punish victims of crime, and there is a very clear definition of good and evil. Unless you are truly regretful for your actions, or have a legit reason for doing them, the Gods don't care. If you've been bad you're going to Helheim.

[linen53]

They gotta have a place to dump the rest of us that don't have a "religion". Can't have us running around aimlessly in their tidy world.

Major Religions of the World
Ranked by Number of Adherents
(Sizes shown are approximate estimates)

Christianity: 2.1 billion
Islam: 1.5 billion
Secular/Nonreligious/Agnostic/Atheist: 1.1 billion
Hinduism: 900 million
Chinese traditional religion: 394 million
Buddhism: 376 million
primal-indigenous: 300 million
African Traditional & Diasporic: 100 million
Sikhism: 23 million
Juche: 19 million
Spiritism: 15 million
Judaism: 14 million

This is a lot of people and a lot of churches. Do they all believe and act in the same way?

[Lilyth Von Gore]

Originally Posted by linen53

They gotta have a place to dump the rest of us that don't have a "religion". Can't have us running around aimlessly in their tidy world.

Did you not read what I wrote? Whether you follow Ásatrú or not, if you don't do anything worthy, you go to Helheim. So, even though I follow Ásatrú, if I don't do anything worth going to Asgard, I end up in Baldrs hall in Helheim.