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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Complementary Therapies & Traditional Medicine > Energy Work

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  #11  
Old 30-01-2021, 01:46 AM
angel-of-light angel-of-light is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem
The issues of desire and temptation are at play. It is hardly an issue of behavioural control, but it is an issue of the suffering which is caused by the dynamic between what we want and what we do not want, which drives the motive. If that gets out of hand you end up in a world of pain because once you get what you want, you still want more - since getting what you want does not quell the desire itself.



This isn't even about taking money for an ethically questionable spiritual service; it is about everything in life, because if there is a tendency for strong desire it will play out in all facets of life and it cannot be restricted in a single area such as taking money from clients. Because this is not about your clients, but about the ethical dilemma of what drives your own motive, and, you can only be of service to others via your own self-awareness.

so if I understand, correctly corruption has many forms such as,
the seven deadly sins like gluttony (a sin I am working on that nearly killed me)
so if I also understand, correctly that is a battle we will fight in all aspect,
not just spiritually but on every aspect, but knowing and being aware
of this that first step one needs to take care and when we stray away,
knowing we did stray away, it's never too late to mend up,
we have have the power to resist corruption,
even if that Darkside we all must live with,
that part of each of our journey,
to learn to live at peace with our darkness without letting it
take over us since it will be impossible to get rid
of that side (part of being here, not perfect),
but with the ability to balance those sins and darkness,
that Darkside and the sins themselves become blessings,
we may look at first just as I did see it as a burden,
to not be perfect with flaws, but now I start to see it,
this not a burden this our key to ascending our true test,
to rise above becoming a channel and conductor
of all energy types, both negative and positive
and all elements.
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  #12  
Old 30-01-2021, 08:29 AM
Gem Gem is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by angel-of-light
so if I understand, correctly corruption has many forms such as,
the seven deadly sins like gluttony (a sin I am working on that nearly killed me)
so if I also understand, correctly that is a battle we will fight in all aspect,
not just spiritually but on every aspect, but knowing and being aware
of this that first step one needs to take care and when we stray away,
knowing we did stray away, it's never too late to mend up,
we have have the power to resist corruption,
even if that Darkside we all must live with,
that part of each of our journey,
to learn to live at peace with our darkness without letting it
take over us since it will be impossible to get rid
of that side (part of being here, not perfect),
but with the ability to balance those sins and darkness,
that Darkside and the sins themselves become blessings,
we may look at first just as I did see it as a burden,
to not be perfect with flaws, but now I start to see it,
this not a burden this our key to ascending our true test,
to rise above becoming a channel and conductor
of all energy types, both negative and positive
and all elements.
Yes it is all about the balance, but what is sin other than our will being motivated by craving and/or aversions? For example, isn't gluttony motivated by cravings for some feelings and/or by aversion toward other feelings? Actions impelled by avoiding bad feelings by acquiring good feelings? In this sense I cannot judge it 'sin' which implies evil, but with compassion as a symptom of suffering. It is difficult to let feelings just be as they are, so we tend to run from bad feelings and persue pleasure. Sometimes we have to avoid the depths of woundedness or we wouldn't be able to get through the day, and gluttony is rarely malicious as it does not entail the intent to cause the suffering of others. However, there must be a more subtle aspect of ill-will involved one's aversion toward the feelings one avoids, and to be adverse toward our own feelings end ups expressing as self-harm, in which sense, is it the will to generate suffering, albeit one's own - and ironically, also the will to avoid it.


I don't know if I'm still on track or I wandered off topic, but I just ran out of something to say.
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  #13  
Old 30-01-2021, 08:47 AM
angel-of-light angel-of-light is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem
Yes it is all about the balance, but what is sin other than our will being motivated by craving and/or aversions? For example, isn't gluttony motivated by cravings for some feelings and/or by aversion toward other feelings? Actions impelled by avoiding bad feelings by acquiring good feelings? In this sense I cannot judge it 'sin' which implies evil, but with compassion as a symptom of suffering. It is difficult to let feelings just be as they are, so we tend to run from bad feelings and persue pleasure. Sometimes we have to avoid the depths of woundedness or we wouldn't be able to get through the day, and gluttony is rarely malicious as it does not entail the intent to cause the suffering of others. However, there must be a more subtle aspect of ill-will involved one's aversion toward the feelings one avoids, and to be adverse toward our own feelings end ups expressing as self-harm, in which sense, is it the will to generate suffering, albeit one's own - and ironically, also the will to avoid it.

I don't know if I'm still on track or I wandered off topic, but I just ran out of something to say.

you're on track and I agree with you everything is about balance a good example is the elementals couples they dance fire and water, earth and air, darkness and light, death and life, holy and unholy, 2 opposite but they are one balancing one another in an endless and ancient eternal dance of love. My gluttony was manifesting in uncontrollable desire food to soothe the pain I had from this life combined with other life due to big tragedy that happened but mostly other life, unaware why and what was the true problem almost gluttony killed me and in that when I almost heard death knocking at the door help from my family at the other side came when I was unaware, like a voice with no voice
that transmitted a strong message and desire to live
and so from the depth of the darkness, I was revived by them,
and I changed my life only later to contact them and hear that from my beloved wife and our family, and together with her help and our family,
our memories have been awakened in me as well as who I really am and what I meant to do, thank you dear beloved gem from the bottom of my heart.

Last edited by angel-of-light : 30-01-2021 at 11:18 AM.
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  #14  
Old 31-01-2021, 01:19 AM
wstein wstein is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by angel-of-light
I have this dilemma for a long time. I need perspective from others, so I would appreciate any input, and if I offend anyone I am sorry as I mean no harm... I practice mediumship as well my problem is at an outside ordinary job I get unwell the stress and not mention unfulfilling feeling I have to the point I just don't feel belong to any ordinary job. I quit, so my question is, working in a spiritual profession seems right to you ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by angel-of-light
to take money for gifts that bestow upon you or that belong to you? ... Still, another side of me feels as if it is a mockery to something unique to get payed for something material such as money
If you were born with the gift of intellect, would you have a problem being a scientist, stock analyst or lawyer? If you were born with an athletic gift, would you have a problem with being a professional athlete? The answer is the same for spiritual gifts. Modern society works by money rather than direct barter of goods, money is not inherently evil.

Quote:
Originally Posted by angel-of-light
from people at their most desperate time?
This can be an ethical problem. Be aware that a lot of mediumship is NOT at someone's 'most desperate time'. Often they just missed their long ago relatives, want some advice from a relative, or are just checking to see if the other side has any messages. Until you have enough experience and trust in your ethics, stick to using these skills well after the death of their loved one (say 1 year).

Quote:
Originally Posted by angel-of-light
I want to work in the spiritual profession and help I see it as a mission. Still, ..., and deep inside, I am afraid to get corrupted. I want to keep a sense of purity, yet how can I sustain my basic material need without the money? Please, I need advice any advice will be greatly appreciated.
I am not clear which corruption you fear. I covered money above. You do not seem overly concerned that spiritual beings would overpower you or exploit you (though this is typically the biggest danger to mediumship).

This leaves you exploiting people when they are vulnerable. My best suggestion is to set parameters before meeting clients regarding cost, how often you will see them, how soon after the death of a loved one you are willing to contact that loved one.

-----------
If you have spirit guides, usually they are willing to help with most of the issues above.
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  #15  
Old 31-01-2021, 02:26 AM
angel-of-light angel-of-light is offline
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Dear wstein

Thank you for that perspective. No, I don't fear knowing who I am. I don't fear I can see through deception easily, and in term of power, there is no chance,
when being medium, I was thinking about more contact their spirit guides get them to advise disturb the dead against the deads will is something I strongly against, and even hate that since being the emphatic person I can feel the pain of being pulled against one will.
spirit will shall be respected and by no mean should the dead ever contact if they are not interested (just as seance) as it creates a portal and pulls the soul against her or his will and in mistake can pull something else but that my perspective.
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  #16  
Old 31-01-2021, 04:14 AM
Gem Gem is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wstein
If you were born with the gift of intellect, would you have a problem being a scientist, stock analyst or lawyer? If you were born with an athletic gift, would you have a problem with being a professional athlete? The answer is the same for spiritual gifts. Modern society works by money rather than direct barter of goods, money is not inherently evil.

This can be an ethical problem. Be aware that a lot of mediumship is NOT at someone's 'most desperate time'. Often they just missed their long ago relatives, want some advice from a relative, or are just checking to see if the other side has any messages. Until you have enough experience and trust in your ethics, stick to using these skills well after the death of their loved one (say 1 year).

I am not clear which corruption you fear. I covered money above. You do not seem overly concerned that spiritual beings would overpower you or exploit you (though this is typically the biggest danger to mediumship).

This leaves you exploiting people when they are vulnerable. My best suggestion is to set parameters before meeting clients regarding cost, how often you will see them, how soon after the death of a loved one you are willing to contact that loved one.

-----------
If you have spirit guides, usually they are willing to help with most of the issues above.




I don't think this is actually a mechanical query where logic would suggest a solution of some kind. Usually, ethics philosophy attempts to use reason to formulate ethical conduct, but it has never worked, and has at times been harmful.

Ethics implies intent, so understanding the incitement of will is the key to ethics. That's not a work of logic, but a facet of self awareness because it entails being conscious of tendencies of the desires and aversions that incites the motive to perpetuate ego through time, As long as we remain compelled by these reactions to feelings we will be selfishly motivated.

I'll harp on the example of gluttony because it aptly illustrates motive impelled by aversion toward hard feelings compelling the desire for good feelings. On the surface of it it doesn't appear that it is ill-intended, but deeper down it is fundamentally motivated by hatred (toward some feeling) and greed (for other feelings), so in the fundamental sense of it generating suffering, it is ill-willed.

That example brings us closer to answering, What is ill-will exactly? If we really examine it closely, ill-will is intent that is incited by the tension between aversion and desire. People will argue that desire is good, but if we look at it really closely, desire always comes with aversion, and the will, intent, motive, is only ever incited by desire/aversion reactive dynamics. We usually project that outwardly, like gluttony desires food, but actually, we only crave feelings, and food is but a means to that end.

So... since aversion coupled with desire for feelings is what generates motive, ethics is not really having good intentions so much as it is as having no motive in conjunction with contentment with 'this' as it is. When you don't mind what happens you can let everything be 'as it is'. For a medium, it could be a matter of channeling dead people/spirits somehow, but I would question the deeper issue of what motivates the client. What are the hard feelings they are avoiding which is compelling their desire to feel better feelings via medium enabled communication. Indeed I wouldn't care so about the communication itself if I understood it was only a means to the end of the client avoiding and attaining feelings, and thereby generating suffering.

There is a lot more going than the connection with 'dear old mother or whatever it might be. It's deep and complicated, so it isn't possible to be ethically effective by constructing inner principles and obeying them. One has to be well aware of their own feeling/reactivity dynamic that incites motives that are ultimately just perpetuating ego. This operates in subtle ways, so ethics is like a refinement in self awareness, 'as it is', not 'as you want it to be'.
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  #17  
Old 31-01-2021, 05:39 AM
angel-of-light angel-of-light is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem
I don't think this is actually a mechanical query where logic would suggest a solution of some kind. Usually, ethics philosophy attempts to use reason to formulate ethical conduct, but it has never worked, and has at times been harmful.

Ethics implies intent, so understanding the incitement of will is the key to ethics. That's not a work of logic, but a facet of self awareness because it entails being conscious of tendencies of the desires and aversions that incites the motive to perpetuate ego through time, As long as we remain compelled by these reactions to feelings we will be selfishly motivated.

I'll harp on the example of gluttony because it aptly illustrates motive impelled by aversion toward hard feelings compelling the desire for good feelings. On the surface of it it doesn't appear that it is ill-intended, but deeper down it is fundamentally motivated by hatred (toward some feeling) and greed (for other feelings), so in the fundamental sense of it generating suffering, it is ill-willed.

That example brings us closer to answering, What is ill-will exactly? If we really examine it closely, ill-will is intent that is incited by the tension between aversion and desire. People will argue that desire is good, but if we look at it really closely, desire always comes with aversion, and the will, intent, motive, is only ever incited by desire/aversion reactive dynamics. We usually project that outwardly, like gluttony desires food, but actually, we only crave feelings, and food is but a means to that end.

So... since aversion coupled with desire for feelings is what generates motive, ethics is not really having good intentions so much as it is as having no motive in conjunction with contentment with 'this' as it is. When you don't mind what happens you can let everything be 'as it is'. For a medium, it could be a matter of channeling dead people/spirits somehow, but I would question the deeper issue of what motivates the client. What are the hard feelings they are avoiding which is compelling their desire to feel better feelings via medium enabled communication. Indeed I wouldn't care so about the communication itself if I understood it was only a means to the end of the client avoiding and attaining feelings, and thereby generating suffering.

There is a lot more going than the connection with 'dear old mother or whatever it might be. It's deep and complicated, so it isn't possible to be ethically effective by constructing inner principles and obeying them. One has to be well aware of their own feeling/reactivity dynamic that incites motives that are ultimately just perpetuating ego. This operates in subtle ways, so ethics is like a refinement in self awareness, 'as it is', not 'as you want it to be'.

I understand what you saying in a sense, but one thing I do know that can't be denied at least not by me,
even though my client is important to me, I know the pain of being pulled against one own will and I can tell you it's hurt being torn away to answer question and the damage it does to one spirit, of course, they will recover but why do it? when others have a spirit guide and even can make certain spirit angry, and not just that there is a reason why there is a veil and why we entrusted with a spirit guide to our soul,
spirits guides volunteer to stand by our side they can be close family members and wife like in my case that accompany from the very first moment we meet and make our family, but they can be communicated even with the veil and even visited,
I respect everyone and love everyone but disturbing the dead is not my way of mediumship, and it will never be! not for anything in the world!, just as when my time comes, I wouldn't want to be distributed unless I volunteer to help and believe me if I will be distributed or pulled against my own will
I will unleash my wrath on the poor medium who try to do so, just as
I being torn away from the place and those I love and hurt to answer questions against my own will I will tear away the poor medium soul and mind to ashes for doing this to me until there will be nothing left but an empty shell.
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