Was the condemnation of man justified?

[sky]

Originally Posted by Altair

Wasn't that the plan all along?


No, I'm bad.


I've heard from various places now, that the churches are emptying precisely because they are modernizing, whereas more 'hard' churches that place authority in the Bible, like evangelical ones and also Orthodox churches, have grown more popular over the decades.

If the churches just become a place for secular values then they will become obsolete. The strength of Christianity has always been to place itself outside of the secular, to offer something that kings/princes/government cannot.

Pope Francis' popularity is mostly to be found among non-Christians. A Catholic pastor once told me this also, that his following was in big part to be found outside the church.

Pope Francis is very popular amongst Christian here so it depends on what People expect from a ' Church ', when you Minister outside the Church that's where you find the most needy....
Churches here that preach ' Hell and brimstone ' are empty and closing down, the modern ones are full to the rafters so again it depends on what people expect/want.

[sky]

Originally Posted by davidmartin

I heard a Rabbi explain how original sin has a more problematic doctrine behind it - the depravity of the soul (that every human soul is depraved at birth and worthy of eternal punishment). So the question isn't even about sins we do, since the depravity doctrine applies at the moment of birth. This is the T in Calvinism's TULIP

The Rabbi went on that in Judaism the soul is considered a perfect work of God, that then may get surrounded by a layer of sin. Christianity still works with this view

The Roman Catholics went one step further, a New Baby that is not Baptised and dies goes to Hell, what nonsense....
Thankfully this idea has disappeared into different Dogma's, now a Stillborn or a New Baby that dies soon after birth can be cleansed from ' Original Sin ' through Baptism of the dead , God forgive them for they know not what they say/do comes to mind....

[davidmartin]

Originally Posted by sky123

The Roman Catholics went one step further, a New Baby that is not Baptised and dies goes to Hell, what nonsense....
Thankfully this idea has disappeared into different Dogma's, now a Stillborn or a New Baby that dies soon after birth can be cleansed from ' Original Sin ' through Baptism of the dead , God forgive them for they know not what they say/do comes to mind....

i think if God is love a person can place more trust in that than in dogmas and doctrines, or at least place that first before anything else. i strongly suspect that God is love. if you go anywhere forward in time or backward or stay in the present moment, God is love. the only place he isn't is where he isn't?

[sky]

Originally Posted by davidmartin

i think if God is love a person can place more trust in that than in dogmas and doctrines, or at least place that first before anything else. i strongly suspect that God is love. if you go anywhere forward in time or backward or stay in the present moment, God is love. the only place he isn't is where he isn't?

Agree

[Altair]

Originally Posted by sky123

Pope Francis is very popular amongst Christian here so it depends on what People expect from a ' Church ', when you Minister outside the Church that's where you find the most needy....
Churches here that preach ' Hell and brimstone ' are empty and closing down, the modern ones are full to the rafters so again it depends on what people expect/want.

It's more to do with being 'rooted' in the society they are in and having traditional values. The modernized Anglican Church for instance has shrunk dramatically in attendance people identifying as Anglican, and I suspect they've sealed their own fate in recent times.

https://www.christianitytoday.com/ct...al-action.html

The more 'hardline' churches have been more steady over the past couple of decades.

Originally Posted by Morpheus

Regarding the "Scapegoat".

Leviticus chapter 16.

Don't like the word of God? Take a hike. You don't belong here.
Farce.

I like god, just not the genocidal satanic one who hates the women and gays he creates.

Regards
DL

Originally Posted by sky123

Not all Christians believe in ' Original Sin ' nor do they believe that they need Jesus to save them. Times are changing and ' Mindsets' are evolving.

I agree.

To believe in a religion that hold no unifying concept is why Christianity is so fractured.

They cannot believe the brain dead official creed.

That is why they are known for lying and being hypocrites.

Regards
DL

[Altair]

Originally Posted by Soul Seeker

I agree.

To believe in a religion that hold no unifying concept is why Christianity is so fractured.

They cannot believe the brain dead official creed.

That is why they are known for lying and being hypocrites.

Regards
DL

You really had a rough childhood, didn't you?
I don't know how else one could rant so much at Christianity...

Originally Posted by Altair

Wasn't that the plan all along?


No, I'm bad.


I've heard from various places now, that the churches are emptying precisely because they are modernizing, whereas more 'hard' churches that place authority in the Bible, like evangelical ones and also Orthodox churches, have grown more popular over the decades.

If the churches just become a place for secular values then they will become obsolete. The strength of Christianity has always been to place itself outside of the secular, to offer something that kings/princes/government cannot.

Pope Francis' popularity is mostly to be found among non-Christians. A Catholic pastor once told me this also, that his following was in big part to be found outside the church.

I understand why he said that.

Most who develop a normal moral sense will condemn Yahweh to hell and will not not support his vile church.

By modernizing the bible, do you mean that they will remove what causes Christians to be homophobic and misogynous, and act the way a true Christian would and not like your political and religious right wings?

Regards
DL

Originally Posted by davidmartin

I heard a Rabbi explain how original sin has a more problematic doctrine behind it - the depravity of the soul (that every human soul is depraved at birth and worthy of eternal punishment). So the question isn't even about sins we do, since the depravity doctrine applies at the moment of birth. This is the T in Calvinism's TULIP

The Rabbi went on that in Judaism the soul is considered a perfect work of God, that then may get surrounded by a layer of sin. Christianity still works with this view

Yes, by not recognizing their perfection, the way we Gnostic Christians do, --- nature always creates for the best possible end, --- and like the vile Yahweh himself, who adds sins to his perfection, Christians willingly follow suit.

All while singing that Adam's sin (and their own), is a happy fault and necessary to god.

Talk about not knowing what to believe.

No wonder it took inquisitions to grow that foul religion.

Regards
DL