Some truths about the untruth of duality

Originally Posted by movingalways

I no longer desire nondual realization. It came and it stayed.
.

Didn't you earlier post non-duality doesn't exist?

[movingalways]

Originally Posted by inavalan

I have no intention to start an argument on this, but evidently your "dualism is a belief, not a truth" is a belief, not a truth, as well.

Your intention to have no intention aside , what is true is true, and what is not true is not true. Truths: A dog is a dog, a train is a train, reality or God or awareness (pick your concept) is not-two-things. What is not true: A dog is a cat, a train is a car, reality or awareness is two things.

Originally Posted by inavalan

Even if you had a "realization" kind of experience, there is no way to prove it, even to yourself, that your experience wasn't the creation of your beliefs and expectations.

Nondual realization 'makes real' the truth of not-two-things. Truth does not require proof nor is truth influenced by expectations.

[movingalways]

Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy

Didn't you earlier post non-duality doesn't exist?

Nondual realization dispels the notion of existing things. Using nouns such as "duality" and "nonduality" implies existing things.

[movingalways]

Originally Posted by iamthat

The meaning of this is not clear. It seems as if your intellect is over-complicating something very simple.
The intellect serves a purpose but it is concerned with the nature of duality through analysis and comparison. At some stage the intellect has to be surrendered.
The realisation of non-duality is a state of Being, not an intellectual understanding.

The last statement is true, however, the intellect is useful when used as a sword to cut away consciousness' (unnecessary) concern with duality. Perhaps my sword is dull, perhaps not.

Originally Posted by movingalways

The mind doesn't exist so duality (and nonduality) don't exist.

Originally Posted by movingalways

Nondual realization dispels the notion of existing things. Using nouns such as "duality" and "nonduality" implies existing things.

If nonduality doesn't exist how can one have nondual Realization, and if one did wouldn't that be realization of an existing thing?

The thing about things is they only don't exist in and of themselves. They don't have intrinsic existence but they do have extrinsic existence. It's not that there's something out there. It's not that there's nothing out there. It's that there's no thing and there's no out there.

For discussion purposes how can one avoid using these terms since it all takes place within Maya? Why trip over words when the deeper philosophy behind the words is the pointer?

[movingalways]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

never mind...

Exactly!

The truth that there is only That reveals the untruth of a subject/object duality (ego). It really is that simple. Simple to 'see' for a moment or two but hard to realize permanently. Do we want to live according to what is true (to be) or what is not true (not to be), that is the question.

Originally Posted by movingalways

The truth that there is only That reveals the untruth of a subject/object duality (ego).

Yet here you are, fully engaged in subject/object duality. Neo-Advaita?

[Miss Hepburn]

Originally Posted by movingalways

This is called nondual (or unity or oneness) realization.

Hi, Anytime someone reminds me of Reality I wish I could give them a like. Realization, yes, ah, my best friend.
A dawning, a bolt of amazing Grace is wonderful isn't it?
No intellectualization ...just a pure awakening of your perception...a
few moments of an altered state, Cosmic Consciousness - coined in the 1890s!
Thank you*Richard Bucke, MD* for your work and your book.
Oneness Consciousness...ah, nice way to start my day...
we are all in this Universe of Jell-o.

[movingalways]

Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy

Yet here you are, fully engaged in subject/object duality. Neo-Advaita?

The subject/object duality isn't true so it is not possible for me (or you) to write from a dual perspective. It is possible however to believe that a subject/object perspective is true which is the case for most spiritual seekers.

Belief in duality is part of the imaginary raft heading for the imaginary shore the Buddha spoke about centuries ago. Duality is a helpful belief because it gradually shifts one's awareness from their conventional identity as a person in a world of other persons to their non-identity as ?

Truth: Despite what most of us believe is true, because there is only That (or This), there is no subject-object split, there has never been a subject/object split, there will never be a subject/object split.

As Neil Sedaka sang so many decades ago and I know from my own experience to be true, "Waking Up is Hard To Do."

Originally Posted by movingalways

Despite what most of us believe is true, because there is only That (or This), there is no subject-object split, there has never been a subject/object split, there will never be a subject/object split.

How does one go about realizing that? What are the paths and their practices?