Have I Learned All I Can from My Twin?

[InquiringMind]

Thanks Akira. I really enjoy hearing reunion stories. I would love to have a similar reunion, but I have an inner conflict that I would like to ask about.

On the one hand, she certainly feels like my Twin, and it seems obvious to me that we share a deep and unusual connection. On the other hand, she is also my ex-girlfriend who dumped me. Twin or no Twin, it just doesn't seem very self-respecting of me to go chasing after her when she herself isn't making much of an effort to reconnect with me. Isn't reunion just as much her responsibility as it is mine? Why can't she make more of an effort?

I dunno...I live in Southern California, and she will be moving to the Bay Area (from Utah) in an month or two. I could offer to meet up with her for lunch, but why is it my job to drive six hours to buy lunch for a woman who dumped me? That seems kinda desperate and definitely not very self-respecting. Why can't she share some of the responsibility? Why can't she drive to Southern California and buy me lunch to show me that she's willing to admit that she made mistakes and is ready to make them right? By reaching out to her and showing her that I'm willing to make some sacrifices, even after she dumped me, I'm putting myself in a position where she has most of the power, and it just doesn't feel very self-respecting.

It's generally true in relationships that the person who is the least invested in the relationship is the person who controls it. If I reach out to her, rather than she reaching out to me, that shows that I'm more invested in the relationship, and therefore she will have most of the power. Anyone in a Runner/Chaser relationship knows that the Runner is the one who has most of the power. If I contact her, I want a more even power distribution between us. I can't be in another relationship where she has all the power, even if her power flows from the fact that she is less invested in the relationship than me.

Am I missing something here? Can anyone help me out?

[FallingLeaves]

Originally Posted by InquiringMind

Thanks Akira. I really enjoy hearing reunion stories. I would love to have a similar reunion, but I have an inner conflict that I would like to ask about.

On the one hand, she certainly feels like my Twin, and it seems obvious to me that we share a deep and unusual connection. On the other hand, she is also my ex-girlfriend who dumped me. Twin or no Twin, it just doesn't seem very self-respecting of me to go chasing after her when she herself isn't making much of an effort to reconnect with me. Isn't reunion just as much her responsibility as it is mine? Why can't she make more of an effort?

I dunno...I live in Southern California, and she will be moving to the Bay Area (from Utah) in an month or two. I could offer to meet up with her for lunch, but why is it my job to drive six hours to buy lunch for a woman who dumped me? That seems kinda desperate and definitely not very self-respecting. Why can't she share some of the responsibility? Why can't she drive to Southern California and buy me lunch to show me that she's willing to admit that she made mistakes and is ready to make them right? By reaching out to her and showing her that I'm willing to make some sacrifices, even after she dumped me, I'm putting myself in a position where she has most of the power, and it just doesn't feel very self-respecting.

It's generally true in relationships that the person who is the least invested in the relationship is the person who controls it. If I reach out to her, rather than she reaching out to me, that shows that I'm more invested in the relationship, and therefore she will have most of the power. Anyone in a Runner/Chaser relationship knows that the Runner is the one who has most of the power. If I contact her, I want a more even power distribution between us. I can't be in another relationship where she has all the power, even if her power flows from the fact that she is less invested in the relationship than me.

Am I missing something here? Can anyone help me out?

If she doesn't want to, it isn't in your capacity to require it of her. That won't go anywhere. The most you can do for yourself is decide, do you want another round with her badly enough to go far out of your way to try again knowing she might treat you just as badly? Or do you just want to accept the status quo and and let it go? There is no wrong answer by the way... and it is a hard lot either way you go. One way you have to swallow your pride, and let her have control, and still maybe not get the prize, and the other you have to accept that you must do without entirely. Really rough choice. (shivers)

[Ziusudra]

Originally Posted by InquiringMind

... why is it my job to drive six hours to buy lunch for a woman who dumped me? That seems kinda desperate and definitely not very self-respecting. Why can't she share some of the responsibility? Why can't she drive to Southern California and buy me lunch to show me that she's willing to admit that she made mistakes and is ready to make them right? By reaching out to her and showing her that I'm willing to make some sacrifices, even after she dumped me, I'm putting myself in a position where she has most of the power, and it just doesn't feel very self-respecting.

It's generally true in relationships that the person who is the least invested in the relationship is the person who controls it. If I reach out to her, rather than she reaching out to me, that shows that I'm more invested in the relationship, and therefore she will have most of the power. ....

Am I missing something here? Can anyone help me out?

Yes, you are missing lots. - Trusting yourself, Believing your strength to handle any possible outcome, Accepting all lessons of the connection, and Acknowledging fate of the connection.

Neither of you have any control of the ultimate outcome.
In any relationship, it is actually very petty to calculating "control" based on who "contacts" first. Are you kidding?

You are also making lots of assumptions about her, not in positive ways.
You already made her to be irresponsible and lazy in the relationship.
You have not even talk to her yet.

Why do you assume that she wants you to drive 6hrs and expects you to buy her lunch?

If you don't want to offer that, just talk to her over the phone or just email her.

You are unnecessarily burdening yourself with these assumptions.

And ask yourself, why does she want you? who thinks of her so poorly?
Do you want her if she is the one who thinks of you that way?

Most importantly, why do you want this girl? when you think of her so poorly?

[57tcjc75]

I've had 2 close connections want me then push me away.. At the time it was confusing but devastating. Each time, God would allow someone else to come along, the first time it was a few years but it happened. There are several close souls I have pushed way back as I am overwhelmed by certain aspects of how they & myself are connecting although I try to express this so they don't take it personally. If this gal is a close soul, a twin flame, & she is pushing you back or away, then it might be to your advantage to work on self, let go for now & someone else will likely come along that you will understand why the current gal is not connecting as you desire.
These closer souls are so intense, sometimes it's healthier to accept the rejection as is, & expand hobbies, interests, groups where perhaps you can share your own healing with others in the way that you are able.
I personally feel this latest connections is so emotional with me, I short out. He wants to be close, talk often and can't really get his head around why I am not wanting this. The first 2 close souls it was different yet I think they shorted out in ways & maybe were even able to, disconnect that I could not.
Becoming strong in self is the way to go at times. People can be cruel, judgmental & completely unwilling/unable to stand on their own. I am around plenty (in my face to face world & it's my perception, always, I have to challenge myself & my own thinking). You are your own person, believe in yourself & don't let her or anyone shame you. You can also let go of her so she is able to finish her own earthly work. Just my 2 cents.

[InquiringMind]

Great thoughts, Ziusudra. I need to address them individually.

Originally Posted by Ziusudra

Neither of you have any control of the ultimate outcome.
In any relationship, it is actually very petty to calculating "control" based on who "contacts" first. Are you kidding?

It's true that she doesn't have ultimate control over the outcome, but given that my answer at this point is "yes," she has the power to say yes or no, and therefore has the power to make the relationship happen or not.

Originally Posted by Ziusudra

You are also making lots of assumptions about her, not in positive ways.
You already made her to be irresponsible and lazy in the relationship.
You have not even talk to her yet.

I laughed out loud when I read this You're right, I am making a lot of negative assumptions about her. She's definitely not lazy or irresponsible, though she did make sure that she had most of the power when we were dating four years ago, mostly by threatening to withdraw if she didn't get her way. It does seem that she has changed a lot for the better in the last four years, and it's probably unfair of me to assume that she's still the same person that she used to be. She's definitely changed for the better, but I don't know if she's changed enough.

Originally Posted by Ziusudra

Why do you assume that she wants you to drive 6hrs and expects you to buy her lunch?

You're right, she didn't ask me to do that. But I rarely go to the Bay Area for anything, so if I went there, it would be to see her. We chat on facebook sometimes. Maybe I could offer to meet her halfway. I really just want to see some effort on her part.

Originally Posted by Ziusudra

You are unnecessarily burdening yourself with these assumptions.

Yes, I am, and I'm not sure why. Maybe I'm just trying to protect myself from rejection.

Originally Posted by Ziusudra

And ask yourself, why does she want you? who thinks of her so poorly?

I'm really struggling to accept that she has changed, because I have spent the last four years trying to convince myself that she is never going to change. If you read the standard dating advice given by dating coaches, they tell you that you can't expect someone to change and that you can't take an unavailable person and make them available. All I'm trying to do here is to follow that advice by assuming that she is exactly the same person she was four years ago and that she is never going to change and she will never be available.

Originally Posted by Ziusudra

Most importantly, why do you want this girl? when you think of her so poorly?

This is the question that started this thread. One of the most difficult questions I had after we broke up was, "Why did I fall for someone who treated me so badly?" My quest to answer this question has lead to a tremendous amount of personal growth for me. I have spent the last four years trying to rid myself of her in many ways, but to little avail. I still have dreams about her at night fairly regularly. I had a very powerful feeling that she and I would be together, and that feeling has persisted in spite of all my attempts to get rid of it. I started this thread because I wanted to know if I should really abandon all hope in regards to her, or if I should make more active attempts to pursue a relationship with her. Being negative about her - even unfairly negative - is mostly me trying to rid myself of my feelings for her. She has actually been really nice to me in our recent conversations. I feel like I could handle a "Never again" answer from her, but a "Not now" or "Maybe later" answer would put me in a tough spot.

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

If she doesn't want to, it isn't in your capacity to require it of her. That won't go anywhere. The most you can do for yourself is decide, do you want another round with her badly enough to go far out of your way to try again knowing she might treat you just as badly? Or do you just want to accept the status quo and and let it go? There is no wrong answer by the way... and it is a hard lot either way you go. One way you have to swallow your pride, and let her have control, and still maybe not get the prize, and the other you have to accept that you must do without entirely. Really rough choice. (shivers)

At this point I'd really like the matter to be settled one way or the other. About a year ago I asked her if she was interested in a relationship and she essentially said "Not right now." I'd really like to get a final answer from her of either "let's do this" or "never again" and I'm willing to stick my neck out there to get it. I hope I'm willing.

[Ziusudra]

... she has the power to say yes or no, and therefore has the power to make the relationship happen or not.

No, not really.
What one WANTS and what one CAN are different.

I laughed out loud when I read this ... It does seem that she has changed a lot for the better in the last four years, and it's probably unfair of me to assume that she's still the same person that she used to be. She's definitely changed for the better, but I don't know if she's changed enough.

I am laughing out loud now.
Let me see.. So, she is not good enough for you as she has been.. and must be changed? to your liking?
What do you think your lesson is from this?

Hint: mirror

Maybe I could offer to meet her halfway. I really just want to see some effort on her part.

Great start! Yes, negotiation and open communication are positive start w/o unfair assumptions.

.. because I have spent the last four years trying to convince myself that she is never going to change. If you read the standard dating advice given by dating coaches, they tell you that you can't expect someone to change and that you can't take an unavailable person and make them available.

Not always true. Changes do occur due to the knowledge/lessons learned from the life journey. - Who am I kidding.. It is mostly fate actually.
It is based on the predetermined path of your connection with her.

I have spent the last four years trying to rid myself of her in many ways, but to little avail. I still have dreams about her at night fairly regularly. I had a very powerful feeling that she and I would be together, and that feeling has persisted in spite of all my attempts to get rid of it.

Well.. I understand that fully.
Ok, so you two are meeting in astral space (yeah, such thing exists apparently ).
Take comfort in knowing that you two are already together in different dimension.

.. Being negative about her - even unfairly negative - is mostly me trying to rid myself of my feelings for her.

Great insight and totally understandable.
After all, we are humans and we are here to experience our humanness..

I feel like I could handle a "Never again" answer from her, but a "Not now" or "Maybe later" answer would put me in a tough spot.

Explain why?

[InquiringMind]

Originally Posted by Ziusudra

I am laughing out loud now.
Let me see.. So, she is not good enough for you as she has been.. and must be changed? to your liking?
What do you think your lesson is from this?

Hint: mirror

Well, it's generally true that we need to accept people as they are, but that becomes a problem when someone has emotional issues that would make a relationship difficult, such as fearing intimacy or being emotional unavailable. I've done quite a bit of work on myself these last four years to overcome my own fears of intimacy and to be more vulnerable and authentic, but I don't know if she has done the same. If she hasn't, I can't accept her as she was before because I would be very unhappy being with her as she was. I do have needs and I respect those needs, and I do need to be with someone who wants an intimate relationship and who is willing to give and receive emotional support. If she's going to continue to avoid intimacy and emotional expression, as she did before, it's going to be hard for me to be with her. It's a difficult place for me, because I am asking her to change, at least from what she was.

Originally Posted by Ziusudra

Explain why?

The fact that I still feel such a strong connection and sense of destiny with her has made it difficult for me to find another relationship and really invest in it. Since my relationship with her still feels very unfinished, I'm having a hard time committing to another person or a different lifestyle. As long as the possibility of being with her remains open, it's very difficult for me to fully emotionally commit to another option.

[Ziusudra]

Wow...Lots of expectations from a possible one lunch meeting.... Intimacy, emotional supports, and everything in between..

Start by just calling and asking her casually if she wants a lunch with you first before having all these expectations.

And don't forget to let her know that you will meet her half way between Bay area and LA. .... also let her know that you will not pay for her lunch.
This will set the perfect tone for the meeting before you start asking for intimacy, emotional support, and all your needs from her.

Find out what she wants first before you give her your list of needs.

Good luck!

[Ziusudra]

InquiringMind,

Seriously, I want you to succeed with your connection.

What did dating coaches tell you about how to win woman's heart?

Do you know how to make her fall in love with you?

Who do you think ... has this answer?
Not me and certainly not anyone else here.

Two souls already have what they need between their connection and they are already on their right path. Your souls do not need 3D physical intimacy. They already achieve that in other dimensions.

But it is you (a man) who wants her (a woman) to desire you and to love you.
So, date her, woo her, respect her, treat her the way you want to be treated.
Find out what her likes and dislikes are.
Give her what she needs so she will open up to you emotionally.
You actions (not your preconceived expectations/demands) will allow her to be a woman in your presence.
Become the man that she wants to be with.
Then she will allow herself to be vulnerable to fall in love with you.
The intimacy will naturally follow.

I wish you luck.