God

Originally Posted by janielee

Courtesy ketzer:

“There are always those who take it upon themselves to defend God, as if Ultimate Reality, as if the sustaining frame of existence, were something weak and helpless. These people walk by a widow deformed by leprosy begging for a few paise, walk by children dressed in rags living in the street, and they think, "Business as usual." But if they perceive a slight against God, it is a different story. Their faces go red, their chests heave mightily, they sputter angry words. The degree of their indignation is astonishing. Their resolve is frightening.

These people fail to realize that it is on the inside that God must be defended, not on the outside. They should direct their anger at themselves. For evil in the open is but evil from within that has been let out. The main battlefield for good is not the open ground of the public arena but the small clearing of each heart. Meanwhile, the lot of widows and homeless children is very hard, and it is to their defense, not God's, that the self-righteous should rush.”

― Yann Martel, Life of Pi

Even a quote such as this doesn't fail to inspire the defenders of God to jump up off their seats and rush to block a blow they see coming at them regardless of whether that was its aim or not. It is as if one just has to shoot the arrow at random and the targets designate themselves and just jump in front of it.

This quote is coming from a character in a book. A character who is a devout Christian, but also a devout Hindu and a devout Muslim. A book about the search for the deeper meaning in life and the roles of faith and doubt in it. A character who goes through an ordeal that stretches every aspect of his faith to its limits. It was not intended, by the author, IMO, to be a condemnation or promotion of any one religion, or even religion in general, but rather a reflection on how man uses faith to help him through life.

Perhaps, this quote is more an exploration (maybe accidentally so) of the danger of not giving enough thought to the meaning and purpose of the 3rd of the 10 commandments. I think the real danger in violating that commandment does not come from angering God, God can take it. Perhaps the danger comes from losing oneself in ones own pride and anger. In spending not enough time making sure one keeps God in their own heart, and too much worrying about whether others have God properly in theirs.

Originally Posted by ImthatIm

I think in any man/woman it is a difficult path
to develop a pure heart and follow it , when societies
give us a corrupt system to follow.

In my beliefs I trust a God both inside and outside that will
Father my errors of being with all the various teachings that are available.
I have done both, given to those in need and also passed them
right by. I would hope my giving becomes more Loving in my future days.
All I can do is honestly evaluate my heart and mind,body and soul and accept
what I find and continue purifying said mind,body, Heart and Soul.
I observe Loving acts and bow.
* * * *
^^^^^^^

Absolutely stunning

Thanks.

JL

Originally Posted by Morpheus

Gnostics do not accept the Bible and are engulfed in a hodgepodge of "new age" beliefs.
Much like the Nicolaitions in the Book of Revelation that Jesus addresses.
Rejecting the Canon of scripture

Despite the Scroll findings in Qumran. Which include most of the Book of Isaiah.
Which writings substantiate our present translations.

They are not actually Christian. No matter what they may call themselves.

Rejecting Jesus own words. Rejecting that He fulfilled the Messianic prophesies also and His physical incarnation.

They would be considered anathema by the first Christians.

As intended in wiser times.

I hope you can see how intelligent the ancients were as compared to the mental efforts that modern preachers and theists are using with the literal reading of myths.

https://bigthink.com/videos/what-is-god-2-2

Further.
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/03132009/watch.html

Rabbi Hillel, the older contemporary of Jesus, said that when asked to sum up the whole of Jewish teaching, while he stood on one leg, said, "The Golden Rule. That which is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. That is the Torah. And everything else is only commentary. Now, go and study it."

Please listen as to what is said about the literal reading of myths.

"Origen, the great second or third century Greek commentator on the Bible said that it is absolutely impossible to take these texts literally. You simply cannot do so. And he said, "God has put these sort of conundrums and paradoxes in so that we are forced to seek a deeper meaning."

Matt 7;12 So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets.

This is how early Gnostic Christians view the transition from reading myths properly to destructive literal reading and idol worship.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02...list=PLCBF574D

Regards
DL

Originally Posted by Altair

Gnostics believe in ''demiurge'' and other things that don't align with Biblical tradition. They are a mystery tradition.

Differences between Christianity and Gnosticism:

(1) An alienated humanity (Gnosticism) versus a good creation (Christianity).
(2) Knowledge that saves (Gnosticism) versus Knowledge of Mighty Acts (Christianity).
(3) Salvation through escape (Gnosticism) versus salvation through pilgrimage (Christianity).
(4) The knowing of self (Gnosticism) versus the believing community (Christianity).
(5) A spiritual elite (Gnosticism) versus ordinary people (Christianity).
(6) Selective syncretism (Gnosticism) versus particularity (Christianity).

From: https://www.theaquilareport.com/gnos...-christianity/

Sigh.

The inquisitors have been hard at work putting their justification for murder of many into our history.

Read the Gnostic Gospels. The few the inquisitors did not burn. I hate to say that as it sounds trite but if your enemy, know your enemy as well as I know the idolaters of the genocidal one.

1. A body holding a spark of god cannot be alienated. We love ourselves as we love others, body wise. Respectfully and not the stupid orgyistic ****. the inquisitors also mostly invented.

2. Mighty imaginary acts are indeed garbage.#. Logos over mythos.

3. How stupid. What does a soul that has never been condemned need with the salvation from an imaginary genocidal satanic demiurge of a god?

The name "I Am" you might see as meaning something like, --- I think I have grown up thanks to having forced my apotheosis through Gnosis and meditation and “I am”, represents the best rules and laws that we have found to live by.

In Gnostic Christianity, we follow the Christian tradition that Christians have forgotten that they are to do. That is, become brethren to Jesus.

That is why some say that the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

Here is the real way to salvation that Jesus taught.

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Allan Watts explain those quotes in detail.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRN...layer_embedded

Joseph Campbell shows the same esoteric ecumenist idea in this link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aGx4IlppSgU

The bible just plainly says to put away the things of children. The supernatural and literal reading of myths.

4. Proudly guilty as charged. We did not favor communities that used inquisitions and jihads and honored genocide and fascism.

5. Guilty in many cases. We were a part of the intelligentsia. We were the logos side while whatever Christians called themselves took the mythos side.

6. Indeed. Unlike the Roman Jesus, the Gnostic Christian Jesus is a universalist who has tied god's righteousness to equality. No slaves or serfs etc. I adlib the bible.

Christians see Yahweh as having a puny path to heaven, while hell has a 10 lane thoroughfare. A loser of a god.

Gnostic Christians believe a real and good god would save us all, just as the scriptures say he wills.

We see God getting his way, a winner, while Christians have a loser.

Who embraces equality for all? Gnostic Christians.

Who are homophobic and misogynous and deny equality for all?

You know who, and who are you?

Regards
DL

Originally Posted by ketzer

Even a quote such as this doesn't fail to inspire the defenders of God to jump up off their seats and rush to block a blow they see coming at them regardless of whether that was its aim or not. It is as if one just has to shoot the arrow at random and the targets designate themselves and just jump in front of it.

This quote is coming from a character in a book. A character who is a devout Christian, but also a devout Hindu and a devout Muslim. A book about the search for the deeper meaning in life and the roles of faith and doubt in it. A character who goes through an ordeal that stretches every aspect of his faith to its limits. It was not intended, by the author, IMO, to be a condemnation or promotion of any one religion, or even religion in general, but rather a reflection on how man uses faith to help him through life.

Perhaps, this quote is more an exploration (maybe accidentally so) of the danger of not giving enough thought to the meaning and purpose of the 3rd of the 10 commandments. I think the real danger in violating that commandment does not come from angering God, God can take it. Perhaps the danger comes from losing oneself in ones own pride and anger. In spending not enough time making sure one keeps God in their own heart, and too much worrying about whether others have God properly in theirs.

ketzer:

I appreciate the context of this quote, and yes, agree with you as usual.

JL

[sky]

Originally Posted by ketzer

Even a quote such as this doesn't fail to inspire the defenders of God to jump up off their seats and rush to block a blow they see coming at them regardless of whether that was its aim or not. It is as if one just has to shoot the arrow at random and the targets designate themselves and just jump in front of it.

This quote is coming from a character in a book. A character who is a devout Christian, but also a devout Hindu and a devout Muslim. A book about the search for the deeper meaning in life and the roles of faith and doubt in it. A character who goes through an ordeal that stretches every aspect of his faith to its limits. It was not intended, by the author, IMO, to be a condemnation or promotion of any one religion, or even religion in general, but rather a reflection on how man uses faith to help him through life.

Perhaps, this quote is more an exploration (maybe accidentally so) of the danger of not giving enough thought to the meaning and purpose of the 3rd of the 10 commandments. I think the real danger in violating that commandment does not come from angering God, God can take it. Perhaps the danger comes from losing oneself in ones own pride and anger. In spending not enough time making sure one keeps God in their own heart, and too much worrying about whether others have God properly in theirs.

' and too much worrying about whether others have God properly in theirs.'


And woe betide if the God you have in your heart is not the image and likeness of the God they have in their heart

[Altair]

Originally Posted by Soul Seeker

Sigh.

Hi Soul Seeker...
I will prefer the words of others on Gnosticism. The main reason is they are basing their views on the scriptures. Jesus didn't taught ''demiurge'' or other stuff that many Gnostics believe in (such as reincarnation, which isn't a match with Biblical themes). Second, you have multiple times mentioned that you think the supernatural isn't real, which would mean you are a materialist. How can you then be a representative of Gnosticism? I agree with Morpheus when he says it (Gnosticism) is like a New Age, because it seems anyone can call himself a Gnostic. There isn't really a foundation. You referring to New Age teachers just proves that point.

Your commentary to the six differences displays your personal concerns. You have a social justice warrior identity, which makes it very hard, if not impossible, to have a conversation about Christianity in a more nuanced way. You focused on stuff that you associate with Christianity. If you study history you'll find that many issues you're so concerned about were fixed by Christians.

Originally Posted by sky123

' and too much worrying about whether others have God properly in theirs.'


And woe betide if the God you have in your heart is not the image and likeness of the God they have in their heart

Yes of course. The more narrowly one defines God, the more enemies there will be to defend God against. If that does not suffice, one can just assume others must think or mean something and defend God against that.

The problem arises when another defender comes along and wants to dominate. Then they have to declare the first defender as an evil fraud and attack them in the name of God. Of course none of it is really about defending God. It seems to me to be more like a bunch of bull elephant seals on the mating beach. All jostling about, with their heads raised up bubbling air through their proboscises and slamming their bloated bodies against each other hoping to make an impression.

[sky]

Originally Posted by ketzer

Yes of course. The more narrowly one defines God, the more enemies there will be to defend God against. If that does not suffice, one can just assume others must think or mean something and defend God against that.

The problem arises when another defender comes along and wants to dominate. Then they have to declare the first defender as an evil fraud and attack them in the name of God. Of course none of it is really about defending God. It seems to me to be more like a bunch of bull elephant seals on the mating beach. All jostling about, with their heads raised up bubbling air through their proboscises and slamming their bloated bodies against each other hoping to make an impression.

Love your Neighbor as yourself can easily become Love your Neighbor as yourself as long as they believe what you believe...

As you pointed out it's not about defending God but rather defending themselves and their beliefs.

But I do love the Bull Elephants, they have no malice in their actions just pure instinct...

Originally Posted by sky123

Love your Neighbor as yourself can easily become Love your Neighbor as yourself as long as they believe what you believe...

As you pointed out it's not about defending God but rather defending themselves and their beliefs.

But I do love the Bull Elephants, they have no malice in their actions just pure instinct...

Well, that is how we know who is our neighbor and who is an evil Samaritan. I expect when it comes down to it there is a good bit of instinct and pecking order sorting going on with all those Christian apologists running around and humping peoples legs as well. Personally, I think it is more fun just to chase my tail.