What is non duality?

Originally Posted by Greenslade

The only thing that is inherent is Isness, everything else is the mind/ego. So while we sow the negative we also sow the positive that is just as much created by the mind/ego.

Sat is Isness. Chit is Isness. Ananda is Isness. All one and the same Isness without a second and mind/ego weaves its stories about existence (Sat), knowing (Chit) and how existence and knowing are experienced (Ananda) in effect creating seconds, thirds, fourths, etc.... The body/mind/ego and its stories are illusions of Maya which itself is the Grand Illusion..

Being conscious is a story. Being unconscious is a story. The notion of a collective unconscious is a story. Karma and even Maya are stories too. In the context of non-dual Brahman they have to be else Brahman isn't non-dual.

The Dreamer (Isness) is real and the dream (Maya) and all that transpires within the dream (stories) are neither real nor unreal but finite appearances of and within the Infinite.

It still amazes me that people still buy into this reality not being real thing. Now don't get me wrong reality is not as fundamentally "singular" as the atheistic non-religious viewpoint might project it to be

and the religion of bumping particles ( science ) might promote it as literally holographic due to their imaginary particle they call the atom which they think doesn't necessarily exist in the sense of solid matter but all the semantics aside it doesn't matter if this realm was made of cupcakes or unicorn farts it's the only shared existence we have that's consistent and crystallized therefore regardless of what it is it is real reality

[The Cobbler's Apprentice]

Originally Posted by MAYA EL

It still amazes me that people still buy into this reality not being real thing.

As I understand many who talk of "illusion" and "maya" they are not questioning reality as such, but more our perception of it. They seek, posit, not another reality, but seek to know this very reality with new eyes/mind/heart.

Originally Posted by The Cobbler's Apprentice

As I understand many who talk of "illusion" and "maya" they are not questioning reality as such, but more our perception of it. They seek, posit, not another reality, but seek to know this very reality with new eyes/mind/heart.

Yup. The perception of separateness, of things, of names and forms is the illusion. They are neither real nor unreal. They are not real in the sense they do not posses intrinsic existence but only extrinsic existence. In and of themselves they are not Absolute. Their extrinsic existence is dependent upon That which is intrinsic. That which is Absolute.

They are not unreal in the sense their extrinsic existence is a finite and temporary appearance of and within That which is intrinsic. To state they are unreal would also state That which they are an appearance of and within is also unreal. If they are unreal they have no extrinsic existence and that brings into question That which is intrinsic.

If the dream is real there is no Dreamer. If the dream is unreal there is no Dreamer.

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy

In and of themselves they are not Absolute. Their extrinsic existence is dependent upon That which is intrinsic. That which is Absolute.

The extrinsic and intrinsic are solely based on what's of value and benefit to you, and is making more judgements, labels, and separation, nothing more and nothing less.

Value and the lack of value in relation to the same thing or person creates all opposites of that something or someone. As you say "one not two". There is no separate extrinsic and intrinsic existence, there is only one single existence or isness as a whole, where the extrinsic and intrinsic are united together, This one single existence or isness is brahman. Nothing exists independently, or individually, or without, or outside of brahman.

The physical universe, form, matter, mind and body and etc are not duality (and this is a very important point) because they are all brahman. Separating and judging brahman (which creates opposites of brahman) such as extrinsic and intrinsic, when brahman are both, is the true duality.

You value the intrinsic because it is the absolute. The opposite happens with the extrinsic because you value or put value on the intrinsic aspect of brahman, while you do not put value on the extrinsic aspect of brahman. Why put value on one aspect of brahman, but not on the other aspect of brahman, especially when you say "one not two"?

The most important thing in selling and buying real estate is location, location, location. The most important thing in spirituality is what you attach value or not to, what you attach value or not to, what you attach value or not to.

Most, if not all spiritual lessons and concepts about not making judgments, duality etc etc has to do with what one places value on or not. Spiritual lessons and it's concepts have nothing to do with the ego, body, mind, form, matter, the physical universe etc etc as being duality and a negative to spirituality and to spiritual growth, they are all brahman anyway, therefore they are spiritual in nature and they are essential to spiritual growth.

It makes no sense at all to place value on one aspect of brahman, but not on the other "opposite" aspect of brahman.

EDIT: The physical universe, form, matter, mind and body etc etc are also the absolute because they are all brahman-the absolute.. There is no such things as non-absolute because all the aspects of the absolute are still the absolute.

Originally Posted by MikeS80

Why put value on one aspect of brahman, but not on the other aspect of brahman

Those are your words, not mine. What I'm saying is discernment is key to understanding and eventual liberation. It's Step One in Two Steps to the Not-Two and it is a necessary step.

When we have a mundane dream we believe it to be absolute reality and therefore suffer its consequences. If we attain lucidity we realize it's only apparent and not Absolute reality and are liberated from its consequences.

It's really that simple however that's not to say it's easy.

It's discernment between the apparent and absolute, the impermanent and the permanent. The apparent is impermanent and in the words of the Buddha dukkha'. Both Buddhism and Advaita posit clinging to the apparent/impermanent is the root of all suffering. So yeah, discernment is an important first step.

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy

Those are your words, not mine.

It was not a statement, it was a question.

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by JustASimpleGuy

What I'm saying is discernment is key to understanding and eventual liberation.

Discernment, which includes making judgments gives the (false) appearance of understanding and liberation. discernment in the context of spirituality and in the context of oneness/wholeness is not required at all.

Discernment, making judgments about brahman, oneness/wholeness, which is everything and everyone is what causes separation/duality in the first place. There is no such thing as a positive or good judgment, a judgment is a judgment.

Making a discernment of the intrinsic and extrinsic existence does not matter on a deeper level under it all because brahman is both the intrinsic and extrinsic.

One should use discernment, make judgements, and differentiate only when he/she knows they are not required, to prevent any misunderstandings and misinterpretations etc.

@mike80

>>>Most, if not all spiritual lessons and concepts about not making judgments, duality etc etc has to do with what one places value on or not. Spiritual lessons and it's concepts have nothing to do with the ego, body, mind, form, matter, the physical universe etc etc as being duality and a negative to spirituality and to spiritual growth, they are all brahman anyway, therefore they are spiritual in nature and they are essential to spiritual growth.<<<


Let me ask you this hypothetically. You have two realms of existence one where everything is Brahman and the other where Brahman doesn't exist now they both look identical in every way so how do you determine which one is the reality we're in?

[MikeS80]

Originally Posted by MAYA EL

@mike80
Let me ask you this hypothetically. You have two realms of existence one where everything is Brahman and the other where Brahman doesn't exist now they both look identical in every way so how do you determine which one is the reality we're in?

Well, we will know both realities exists, otherwise, there will be nothing for us to determine. So it will be easy to determine and to know what reality we are in....If brahman exists in the reality we are in, then we are in that reality or if brahman does not exist in the reality we are in, then we are in that reality.